Your duty as an American citizen.

[Anvil]

As was I.

So my question is, aren't the cynical remarks and complete dismissal of any validity this video might hold, the exact sort of complacency that, it says, is being perpetuated by the antagonists it depicts?
Just an observation.

I'd like to know the same.

 

[Ambivalent]

Please, I saw this, and the September 11th stuff is just funny. All of the sources are basically other conspiracy books.

Conspiracy theories are hilarious.

 

[JBroll]

So from the way that read, I really can't tell if the responses have more to do with the content of the movie or the way it was presented by the original poster.

I don't like either. We've got a guy who is fucking convinced he's giving fire to cavemen, which just gets annoying, and we've got an overhyped documentary that embarrasses valid content by including complete and utter bullshit. On top of that, implying that people who disagree with the film are too afraid of rethinking the world around them to accept it and that that's the only reason it's disliked will make you few friends.

Jeff

 

[Kellan]

Again I reiterate my previous question in response to the "conspiracy theory" claim.
Honestly I'm not really swayed one way or the other because there's just absolutely so much to take in I'm not sure where I stand.
But just to kind of play devil's advocate, have any of these "conspiracy theories" been actually proven wrong, and against what? The 9/11 commission report?
To me it's kinda both sides saying one another is wrong. And that's the fucked part about it, is there's seemingly no unbiased perspective. So everyone is wrong, and nothing is solved. Much like religion, everyone seems to have their minds already made up that the other is wrong, so the questioning of one point of view or the other just always ends up in cynical slander/libel and the situation becomes completely counterproductive. It's no wonder the majority is apathetic really.

 

[Anvil]

I make an effort not to stand with any point, but to be open-minded about anything people throw at me, whether it be conspiracy theory, etc.

I will say it again though, this movie does well in supporting it's claims, and I feel slightly annoyed that many of you don't give an open-mind to things like this, no matter how it was presented to us.

It's like some of you are scared to see what others think about it, or scared that it will disprove something you strongly believe in. Ever think it may just strengthen some of your own theories on such a subject?

You Americans of all people should watch it, even to see what some people in your country are thinking.

 

[Kellan]

I share the same sentiment as Anvil.

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

I liked it. We will never know about the 911 bullshit, Im still convinced that a missile hit the pentagon.
That, and I have 0 respect for christians.

 

[JBroll]

Again I reiterate my previous question in response to the "conspiracy theory" claim.
Honestly I'm not really swayed one way or the other because there's just absolutely so much to take in I'm not sure where I stand.
But just to kind of play devil's advocate, have any of these "conspiracy theories" been actually proven wrong, and against what? The 9/11 commission report?
To me it's kinda both sides saying one another is wrong. And that's the fucked part about it, is there's seemingly no unbiased perspective. So everyone is wrong, and nothing is solved. Much like religion, everyone seems to have their minds already made up that the other is wrong, so the questioning of one point of view or the other just always ends up in cynical slander/libel and the situation becomes completely counterproductive. It's no wonder the majority is apathetic really.

Many of them have been - yes, you have to search a little on your own, but the vast majority of bullshit they throw around has been refuted. As for the comparison, I did take an unbiased perspective... and I fucking used Google. There are only so many 'bullet-proof' claims you can see shot down before it's like a bad late-night infomercial.

I make an effort not to stand with any point, but to be open-minded about anything people throw at me, whether it be conspiracy theory, etc.

I will say it again though, this movie does well in supporting it's claims, and I feel slightly annoyed that many of you don't give an open-mind to things like this, no matter how it was presented to us.

It's like some of you are scared to see what others think about it, or scared that it will disprove something you strongly believe in. Ever think it may just strengthen some of your own theories on such a subject?

You Americans of all people should watch it, even to see what some people in your country are thinking.

Have you actually checked the movie's sources? I gave it an open mind when I was watching the first part, but when I actually saw the source list I knew that no good could come of it. And now you pull cognitive dissonance bullshit on me - yeah, so many people say 'well, my fragile worldview could be shattered by anything resembling the truth, so I'm going to pretend it doesn't exist and let FOX spoon-feed me everything' that I couldn't possibly see things from any perspective *but* yours. It's all because nobody but you few enlightened messiahs could *ever* have seen bizarre conspiracy claims before, not because SOME PEOPLE KNOW BULLSHIT SOURCES. A school organization I'm actually involved in was planning to show this based on the hype of people like you who wouldn't be strict enough with their standards, and it took one guy watching it and checking facts to tear the shit out of most of it - all because very essential parts of their footage depend on empty claims that people just never seem to get around to checking.

Goddamn, guys, cut the enlightenment act, could it be that maybe your bullshit diagnosis of 'well, you're just afraid, so phthppbth' isn't right and other people can know what they're talking about and still disagree? I know our system is fucked from lunatic fundamentalists and bleeding-heart socialist morons, but you wouldn't be much of an improvement no matter how hard you tried to have an inside scoop.

Jeff

 

[Kellan]

Alright, now that we've been berated for saying anything while not trying to start conflict, what's the answer?
Tad bit hypocritical/ironic you were on about the OP for the very same thing you just did.

 

[BlueSky]

A school organization I'm actually involved in was planning to show this based on the hype of people like you who wouldn't be strict enough with their standards, and it took one guy watching it and checking facts to tear the shit out of most of it - all because very essential parts of their footage depend on empty claims that people just never seem to get around to checking.

It's just too hard to tell the truth on subjects on this large of scale, and nature that can be diluted, and very well has been diluted by every source imaginable. This is turning into the typical egotistical "I'm right you're wrong thread." At this point none of us know for sure either way. I'm not taking a stand at this point in time, but I do know this one fact, that it is our duty to discuss things of this nature. I'd like this thread to turn into people pulling together resources on both sides of the matter to see if we can sift through just the tip of the dirt mountain. I'm constantly impressed by the people who flock to forums. It's really a new culture within itself. So all I'm asking is please.

Jbroll you made a claim that the sources in this video were false. Care to back your claims? I for one am all eyes.

 

[Reminiscence]

Your duty as someone that left the country and is happy where they are now:

Stop giving a shit about a country that you're pretending to not care about anymore.

Thanks pal, but I have to move back to America at the end of August, so it's something I very much do give a shit about, especially the insane levels of "security" being placed upon everything in our world. Electronic passports and electronic financial systems means complete control over anyone who uses them, which will sometime soon be everyone. It's especially funny to read the pathetic comments of the people who didn't actually watch the film.

 

[El Stormo]

Conspiracy theories are hilarious.

Are they? I suppose many are. But people who think there isn't loads of things that happen behind closed doors, are fools. It's not difficult to imagine that behind the facade that many world leaders love to present, there's conspiracies, power games and strategy going on. Look at Bin Laden. I'm still completely speechless when I think of how many Americans don't even know that Bin Laden was trained by the CIA in order to go and destabilize the Middle East and chase the Russians out of Afghanistan. Now, if this little thing is true, then why shouldn't tons of other, bigger things be true?

I'm not too keen on conspiracy-theorists either, but the fact is that none of us will ever know to what extent media and events are manipulated and orchestrated. Many people still think the U.S. are in Iraq to fight terrorism, and if people believe that that's what it's all about, then they're fools.

And to be honest, all you people who disbelieve those theories before they've even listened to it are exactly why those liars get away with it. I agree that you shouldn't believe everything people say (especially on the Net), but being critical of your own government and keeping an open mind will only benefit you as people.

That, and I have 0 respect for christians.

Aren't you simply against religion altogether?

 

[Reminiscence]

Well said, Stormo. The point of the movie wasn't to attack you with conspiracies. It was to get you to think about the future and what we've let the world and society become, a money and media-controlled hell that benefits no one.

 

[Will Bozarth]

Thanks pal, but I have to move back to America at the end of August, so it's something I very much do give a shit about, especially the insane levels of "security" being placed upon everything in our world. Electronic passports and electronic financial systems means complete control over anyone who uses them, which will sometime soon be everyone. It's especially funny to read the pathetic comments of the people who didn't actually watch the film.

I just don't have any urge to watch it. I watched F911 and that was good enough for me. I agree that alot of things in the country are fucked up, and no video I'd watch would set anything straight, so I'd rather not waste my time.

 

[Kellan]

Well I'm pleasantly surprised with the replies that have been made after I turned off the computer last night. Because that was the exact point that was trying to be made before. Seriously Jeff, if you have particular sources that invalidate these claims in the video, I and I'm sure others would love to read them. Don't interpret that as we're too lazy to go search, as it seemed that's what you were somewhat implying earlier. We will search, and the point of seeing what you've found is to compare it what we might find. After all, the best way to make any sort of "educated guess" as to what happened is to gather as much information as we can, and then decide for ourselves what happened with these matters, if possible. Wouldn't you like to help rather than hinder?

I'm not saying anyone has to believe what this video has to offer, whatsoever. But there's one common thread throughout it that I don't think can be denied, and that is that we're being passively turned against one another. I mean this thread is a prime example. As was a quote in the movie, the idea that we've been trained to seek out the shortcomings and faults, and simply differences in others (and typically regard them as something negative to this person's character even though it very well may not be negative at all) I really don't think can be denied. I don't know about you all, but I see it EVERYWHERE. Hell, I'll be the first to admit that I do it all the damn time. Am I happy about it? No. Do I still do it? Yes because it's subconscious.
With that concept in mind, and the fact that the government is comprised of the people, for the people; what outcome does our prejudice and defensive behavior toward anyone/thing we're unfamiliar with have on our how we run our country? EVEN if all of these conspiracy theories are 100% false.

I agree that Christianity is a huge pile of BS, but I'll be damned if they didn't do one thing ABSOLUTELY right to get SO many people to follow it. Even though below the surface it was a completely different story, they at least APPEARED to be loving and offering acceptance, and not a scowl and a deaf ear.

Point is, we will NOT be able to improve the state of our society, if that's what we want, if we keep approaching each other with unease if we don't know one another, and immediately classifying someone as dumb/wrong/idiot/asshole if we learn some things about how they behave or what they believe that don't necessarily coincide with what we believe.

 

[Reminiscence]

I just don't have any urge to watch it. I watched F911 and that was good enough for me. I agree that alot of things in the country are fucked up, and no video I'd watch would set anything straight, so I'd rather not waste my time.

The thing is, only 1/3 or less of that video has anything to do with 911.

 

[Will Bozarth]

so? only 1/3 or less of our problems deal with 911

I'm content with where I live, even though it's fucked up. Oh well.

 

[Anvil]

Point is, we will NOT be able to improve the state of our society, if that's what we want, if we keep approaching each other with unease if we don't know one another, and immediately classifying someone as dumb/wrong/idiot/asshole if we learn some things about how they behave or what they believe that don't necessarily coincide with what we believe.

It should be enough that we all think the general synopsis of these conspiracy theorist movies are based on trying to make people think for themselves, and not think the truth is whatever is being fed to them from Fox. Or even from these damn movies.

Why fight against people of this forum who, the majority, understand that what we're told, isn't always right.


Secondly, I did research some of part 1, and oddly enough my findings were exactly what I thought they'd be.

Part 2 on the other hand, was no different than any other analyzation of the September 11th fiasco. We know the holes. This movie was able to put reasons and sources behind the holes, but it only left them more open. It didn't prove anything we didn't already think happened.

 

[Malergion]

The problem with that is that half of them would believe it. The way to educate people about the sorry state of corruption we've nestled ourselves into is hardly to put together shoddy conspiracy laden tapes and post them on the internet under the pretence that they really speak about the spiritual, intellectual and political climate of an age.

I agree. You're just as nuts if your crazy conspiracies are about the government(which actually *does* engage in dirty tricks from time to time) instead of the green men from Area 52 or statues on Mars.

 

[mReEtTaIlRsEkD]

Your duty as someone that left the country and is happy where they are now:

Stop giving a shit about a country that you're pretending to not care about anymore.

Haha, pwnt.

AND

Conspiracy theories are for jackasses.
Anyone who says otherwise is a jackass.