An anti-pirate curious about the warez enemy!

[REDBOX04]

Hey guys, first let me start this post off by saying in no way am I a supporter of any type of illegal downloading/distribution of any kind. I think its wrong, and it hurts the developers/artists. If you like a piece of software, then buy the damn thing. It actually kind of pisses me off to think I work my ass off to pay for this shit, and others are getting it for free. I'm sure most of you can agree with me which is one thing I really like about this forum. It seems like this shit is everywhere and its nice to come to an informative place without it.

On to my question...

Due to the fact I know very little about pirating, I am very ignorant on the whole thing. I like to stay informed and in the know as much as possible, and I've learned some stuff about it, but there's one thing I don't understand that left me quite amused actually.

I read on another forum someone made the mistake of posting about his/her illegal software usage/downloading. Another forum member commented on the post and said something along the lines of "Dont make money using warezed software"

At first I figured that was a no brainer...who is going to sell software they downloaded? That sounds like a sure fire way to get your ass in a first person experience of the TV show OZ.

But then another forum member made a comment agreeing saying "yeah, making money using warez is a big no no"

Then I thought about it for a second, and it seemed like they weren't saying "don't sell the software", they said don't make money "using" the software. I found that rather amusing and confusing...

Say you download a DAW, or maybe the infamous WAVES Diamond bundle that EVERYONE seems to mysteriously have these days and you use these programs to create an album in your home studio. You release the album whether on your own or through a label and you make money selling the album. How the hell will a developer such as waves, or cubase know whether or not the software you used to make the album was legal or not? How will they even know you are using their software? Is this just a pathetic attempt on our parts to try and dissuade the pirates out there? If so, I find that rather amusing. I'm all for trying to stop these guys, but come on lol

Am I just misinterpreting the whole thing?

Please excuse my ignorance. lol

Thanks again for all your guys' help out there! I really appreciate this forum and all of your contributions. And props to all the people on here that are against pirating. We have to keep spreading the love for the developers so they can continue giving us the software we want and need.

 

[AdamWathan]

There's no way Waves would know, that's not the point people are trying to make... They are just saying it is very morally wrong to be using pirated software for commercial reasons.


So don't worry about anyone catching you when you put out your album Pirate.

 

[Sean in Silence]

So don't worry about anyone catching you when you put out your album Pirate.

haha
That's exactly what it sounds like to me
lol

 

[[UEAK]Clowd]

I don't think there's any way they could know, unless they have some sort of watermarking thing going on? For me at least, it's more about (a) being able to tell your clients your are legit, to have your software boxes all on display and stuff, and (b) not have to worry about some unhappy client trying to report you or any such nonsense like that.

 

[ahjteam]

I've used the borderline that you can pirate all the way you want for learning purposes and trying out stuff if no demo are available (but keep the info to yourself as it is illegal), but when you start make money out of the plugins you use, buy the software. Especially if you can afford to get the PT HD rig, then you can easily afford to pay for the waves bundle after 1-3 clients.

The only sad fact with Waves plugins is that for example my classmate owns the Musicians Bundle 1 and 2, and the legit versions he owns don't work on his computer, but the cracked versions do :Smug: But he does own the licenses for the plugins, so I don't see anything wrong with using the version he downloaded from the net.

 

[Erkan]

It actually kind of pisses me off to think I work my ass off to pay for this shit, and others are getting it for free.

Why does it piss you off? They can't make any serious commercial productions anyway with pirated software. They would get fucked as soon as they are required to show their licenses to the client.

Getting it for free but not being able to make money from it is one thing, but making money with the help of pirated DAWs/plugins etc is a whole different story, and a much more serious one at that.

 

[Erkan]

my classmate owns the Musicians Bundle 1 and 2, and the legit versions he owns don't work on his computer, but the cracked versions do :Smug: But he does own the licenses for the plugins, so I don't see anything wrong with using the version he downloaded from the net.

You are correct about that. If you own the license and can show it, it's no problem.

At university, we've got Maya 2009 (a 3D modeling/animation suite) and there was a long delay in delivery from Autodesk (the owners of Maya), and they told us to just go "fix it" from elsewhere on the net until Autodesk managed to deliver Maya 2009. And this is for a university!

So bottom line: Own the license, and it's no problem.

 

[kev]

They can tell, every time you put a waves plugin on a piece of audio e.g. the C4 compressor with the Andy Sneap settings, it leaves an audit trail. All waves have to do is pick up the mp3 and put it through their flux capacitor machine and it will decode it for them

 

[TheDriller]

Its a matter of professionalism too,
having legit licenses for the software you use instantly puts you a peg above the legions of schmuks with the cracked waves diamond bundle and cracked cubase.

 

[REDBOX04]

Thanks for the info guys. I know this sounds stupid but I honestly thought there might have been some way for developers to know you were using their software just by scanning the mp3 or something. Nothing regarding technology should be scoffed at, there is some crazy capabilities these days with computers and in my mind anything is a possibility. Just look at the ipod...who wouldve thought 50 years ago there would ever be such a device. I figured if there was a way for developers to know this kind of stuff I'd love to learn about it just for the sake of learning how it works. How fascinating would that be?

And no, I am not a pirate, sorry to burst your bubbles lol Hence the opening disclaimer. I understand your assumptions though. When it comes to having any type of question on pirating/warez it always seems to understandably generate some suspicions. Dont be so quick to judge guys, were all on the same team.

I swear, I think some people just look for conflict. lol

Maybe I should pretend to be a pirate to make everyone happy?

Here goes...

Yarrrrr....WAREZ!....Yarrr...bittorrent...Yarrr!...Pro Tools!

 

[Sean in Silence]

hahahahahaha
you just convinced me you're not a pirate with those last 3 lines
lol
but you never know
everyone can say whatever they want on the internet and noone would really know who they were
I could say I'm president Obama right now and noone on here could prove that I wasn't
The topic just seemed kind of sketchy

 

[Metaltastic]

Ugghh, who gives a fuck, let people do what they want

However,

Is this just a pathetic attempt on our parts to try and dissuade the pirates out there? If so, I find that rather amusing. I'm all for trying to stop these guys, but come on lol

you're right, really the only motivation for non-pros to not pirate software is other people endlessly guilting them about it, and when a person actually has to face the consequences of piracy (in the case of the Pirate Bay people, for example), so many of those "anti-piracy" people get all whiny about the injustice of it

 

[REDBOX04]

hahahahahaha
you just convinced me you're not a pirate with those last 3 lines
lol
but you never know
everyone can say whatever they want on the internet and noone would really know who they were
I could say I'm president Obama right now and noone on here could prove that I wasn't
The topic just seemed kind of sketchy

LOL Of course you could say that your Obama, but everyone knows its not possible because Iam the real Obama. Time to go "fist bump" the old ball n' chain!

 

[Sean in Silence]

hahaahaha
welcome to ultimatemetal dude!

 

[RiF]

I know this sounds stupid but I honestly thought there might have been some way for developers to know you were using their software just by scanning the mp3 or something.

They don't need to, because it's far more easy: The use of pirated software is forbidden BY LAW.
The manufacturer is not responsible for the law enforcement, the government is.

And regarding the example of using cracked warez while owning a legit copy: I don't think that this is totally legal, although I would (and do) give a s**t, because I would feel totally legal doing it. And when the police comes around and says: "Hey dude, you're using a cracked version of Whatever v2.0 on your computer and did not install your legal copy which I found right here in your bookshelf! The grand jury will decide how to care about you evil doer!" I would not get that excited...

 

[GarethSE]

They don't need to, because it's far more easy: The use of pirated software is forbidden BY LAW.
The manufacturer is not responsible for the law enforcement, the government is.

And regarding the example of using cracked warez while owning a legit copy: I don't think that this is totally legal, although I would (and do) give a s**t, because I would feel totally legal doing it. And when the police comes around and says: "Hey dude, you're using a cracked version of Whatever v2.0 on your computer and did not install your legal copy which I found right here in your bookshelf! The grand jury will decide how to care about you evil doer!" I would not get that excited...

That's an interesting point actually.

I downloaded Opeth - Blackwater Park the other day purely because it would be quicker to download it then rip my copy of the CD (which I bought, with money, BELIEVE IT ) to iTunes.
I'm curious as to where that leaves me standing legally.
Not that I give much of a shit, I bought the damn CD, but it's food for thought.

 

[Cyanide_Anima]

lol. great first posts.
the pirates pirate because they can pirate!

 

[GarethSE]

I find it odd that in a forum so full of reasonable, open minded, intelligent people that with THIS particular subject, there's a lot of, sue me for saying this, but perhaps unjustified(?) hatred.

Hear me out.
There's more that one angle to view any given situation, we all know this right? It's just life.
I'm a firm believer that you cannot judge someone's actions before you know the motivation and reasoning behind it.
Not everyone that pirates shit thinks OH YEAH IM GONNA MAKE MONEY AT OTHER PEOPLE'S EXPENSE COS IM A CHEAP MOTHERFUCKER.
There's people out there with a talent for this sort of thing that may not have the money YET, and it's all a means to an end.
There's people out there who use the software to learn, to record their own ideas, for fun, basically for no commercial reason. Shit that's never gonna get heard by more than like 50 people.

Then there's the people who do make money at a software developer's expense, and use the money soley on themselves, rather than slowly buying the plugins they once had cracked versions of.
But how many people out of the legion of kids recording demos in their bedrooms graduate to the level where they can make any kind of money out of recording at all?
I'm sure we've all had phases where we've thought "you know what? fuck this." and almost threw in the towel. I had a phase like that, and I've known many people who've gone through phases like that.
It's a tough thing to get good at, this audio engineering lark, so to get to the point where you can hand on heart say to someone "yeah im good at this, give me some fucken moneyz" isn't something many people reach when you look at the big picture.
Even less get to the point that Andy Sneap or James Murphy or Colin Richardson have reached.

Our little world of Audio Engineering isn't quite as occupied as it could be, and a huge percentage of that "population" is kiddies with cheap ibanez' and Marshall MG50's who wanna record some demos of their Korn rip-off projects.
Do those people even really matter? Is it even worth taking the time slagging them off for using cracked plugins?
Nah.

It seems that most people who get to the point that they can charge for shit do eventually start buying their shit.
I've taken the plunge and bought my first plugin recently. aptrigga. It's a start, eh?
Does that all of a sudden make me better than them because I've had a change in mindset and finally given a plugin dev some money? Up until a coupla weeks ago I was one of those kids I just sat describing, maybe without the cheap ibanez part, or the MG50 part, or the korn rip-off project part, but I was one of those kids recording shit in his bedroom. And until very recently the most I'd ever made off a recording was £40 for 2 songs for a friends band last year, and that had to go on day to day life because I was poor as fuck and needed the money, and eating comes first. I've only just start making enough money to even CONSIDER buying plugins and software.

So, yeah, I wrote an essay. My bad, but my point is, there's more than one way to view a fucking situation, and going LOL FUCK PIRATES isn't going to fix anything. If anything it'll just make them go "hey fuck you" right back. Give them a reason to buy plugins and they will.
Plus, seriously, no offense to devs n shit, I know coding is motherfucking complex and I could never do that shit. But the money some devs charge for their plugs is fucking obscene. Drumagog rings a couple of bells. I was gonna lay down some cash for that before Marcus advised me to get aptrigga. And you know what? Fuck drumagog, aptrigga is better and cheaper.
Value for money goes a long way. Why buy one eq for £500 when I could buy a cheaper one that will do basically the exact same thing (I trust we all saw that topic recently that compared cheap eq's to mega expensive ones, with a damn near identical result.) It's fucking ridiculous and I refuse to give devs money for that sort of shit. There's word for that: extortion.
Devs aren't all sweetness and light. Yeah, without them we couldn't do this shit that we all enjoy so much, but seriously. That sort of money for 1's and 0's is fucking obscene.

Anyway, rant = over.

 

[slayercannibalsuffohead]

Well, for me, if you sit at your computer pondering on how to get cracked software ( unless you are mentally retarded ) shows that you know that it is WRONG!

Second, if you go ahead and start downloading keygens and what not, shows that you still know that it is wrong and it also shows that you dont give a fuck!

Thirdly, no difference if you are young or old, own a mg 50 or a triple rec, or you are in a rip off korn band or a talanted original death metal band, ( unless you are mentally retarded again ) you damn well know that it is FUCKING ILLEGAL!

Poor or rich makes no difference either. To tell you the truth, I dont know any poor people who own anything musical, be it a guitar, computer etc .............
If you can have a computer, internet connection, guitar, mics or whatever ( and none of it has to be expensive ) then the possibility of you using the poor card is just as bad as pirating! Stop spending money on drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, lap dancers, fast food, hooded metal tops and put a savings plan in order! By all means download the demos and try them out. If you like them and really want them (ie, a necessity ) then SAVE!

If you want free plug ins ( because you cant afford higher end stuff ) then search for 'free vst plug ins'. What would you do if those so called YOUNG peckerheads came around to your place and stole your rims so they could put them on their shitbox looking vehicles, say nah, its all right, their young, they havent got a good car, their not going to make any money out of it! ( LIKE FUCK! )

SIMPLE: PIRACY IS ILLEGAL! FULL STOP!

 

[slayercannibalsuffohead]

Well, for me, if you sit at your computer pondering on how to get cracked software ( unless you are mentally retarded ) shows that you know that it is WRONG!

Second, if you go ahead and start downloading keygens and what not, shows that you still know that it is wrong and it also shows that you dont give a fuck!

Thirdly, no difference if you are young or old, own a mg 50 or a triple rec, or you are in a rip off korn band or a talanted original death metal band, ( unless you are mentally retarded again ) you damn well know that it is FUCKING ILLEGAL!

Poor or rich makes no difference either. To tell you the truth, I dont know any poor people who own anything musical, be it a guitar, computer etc .............
If you can have a computer, internet connection, guitar, mics or whatever ( and none of it has to be expensive ) then the possibility of you using the poor card is just as bad as pirating! Stop spending money on drugs, alcohol, cigarettes, lap dancers, fast food, hooded metal tops and put a savings plan in order! By all means download the demos and try them out. If you like them and really want them (ie, a necessity ) then SAVE!

If you want free plug ins ( because you cant afford higher end stuff ) then search for 'free vst plug ins'. What would you do if those so called YOUNG peckerheads came around to your place and stole your rims so they could put them on their shitbox looking vehicles, say nah, its all right, their young, they havent got a good car, their not going to make any money out of it! ( LIKE FUCK! )

SIMPLE: PIRACY IS ILLEGAL! FULL STOP!