ATHEISTS are demoralizing society. We need a strong CHRISTIAN president.

[WhiteBeastofWotan]

This is UM, not EuroJoe chat board. Few here are "average."

True, I'm much larger than average.

 

[Captain Beard]

Aren't we all.

 

[Narmoth]

as far as i met and read about the opinions of average euroJoe, they still don't understand foreign policy or are uninformed and hate America. Yes, Bush was a retarded dumb fucked asshole, but they can't go and hate America, while Russia and China are their biggest threat. Putin still doesn't sign the "Carta Energetica" and can blackmail the EU with pulling the plug on natural gas and oil.

At least Putin isn't trying to dominate the world by might of arms, like US, but simply refuses to sell oil to lands that don't suppourt him. Since the oil is property of the russian people who have elected Putin to watch after their interests, he has a right to do that.

The incident with Ukraina was that Ukraina were getting 1/2 price on the oil and gas while they were allied with Russia. If Ukraina wanted to exit the alliance, they were free to pay market price for the oil from Russia, or buy from their new allies

I think you've noticed a general trend towards dislike of George Bush and extrapolated it way too far. Many people distrust the United States, but the vast majority of intelligent and able people consider the situation more holistically. Of course not all Americans are X or Y.

After all, Nevermore are an american band, and they alone prove that all americans aren't like Bush.

Just to spell it out for some people here:
I'm not against americans, but I'm against american foreign politics policy.
And from a medical proffesional viewing point, I believe the radical religious view on abortions and gay marriage are an abomination.

As for Russia or China, I'm not sure threat is the right word. I'm not about to get McCarthyesque when considering them. They both have questionable governments, yep and they are both fast growing economies (China especially) but that hardly means they are a legitimate threat (I'm unsure what you even mean by threat? Economically, socially, maybe declarations of war???). It seems to me you consider the rise of any Economy outside of N. America or W. Europe as inherently bad. Why? The onus is on us not to chastise and be fearful of growing economies but to take some responsibility as participants in the international body politic to ensure the growth is benevolent.

Point.
Then again, there's put a lot of effort in portraying N. America or W. Europe as the paragons of freedom and democracy, while the rest of the worlds goverments, except dictatorships that suppourt US interests (like Pakistan and Saudian Arabia) to be evil usurpers that oppress the populations wish for democracy.

And just some comments on this thread by an american webcartonist I'm fond of:

 

[Blind Guardian]

Although we westeners probably are to blame for a huge amount of shit that´s going on in the world right now,at least people here can criticize our governments actions,things like that is the difference between for example USA and China,that´s why it feels a little bit scary now,them gaining more and more power and influence by the minute.

 

[[KOTNO]Narrot]

mattsson har rätt ...

 

[Narmoth]

Although we westeners probably are to blame for a huge amount of shit that´s going on in the world right now,at least people here can criticize our governments actions,things like that is the difference between for example USA and China,that´s why it feels a little bit scary now,them gaining more and more power and influence by the minute.

Sorry, that was before the patriot act.
Now, how do you explain the Guantanamo prison, "free speech zones", arrestations of peasefull anti-war-demonstrations, abductions of potetntial terrorists in Europe and so on?

USA violate almost as many human rights as China!

 

[El Stormo]

I love it when foreigners talk about US affairs like they know what the fuck they're talking about. I love it.

Who says we don't?

 

[derek]

This is getting dull...

You're both wrong.

 

[Necromunchkin]

The cartoons were pretty nifty, though.

 

[Blind Guardian]

Sorry, that was before the patriot act.
Now, how do you explain the Guantanamo prison, "free speech zones", arrestations of peasefull anti-war-demonstrations, abductions of potetntial terrorists in Europe and so on?

USA violate almost as many human rights as China!

Yeah i agree but if you take someone as Michael Moore for example,a Chinese version of him would get thrown into jail in no time,the government in USA could never do something like that in the open in the same way the Chinese could

 

[Tans]

Not picking on you or anything, but most of the time relgions are to blame for war. Christanity has had its dark times through history when it was the super power of the day.
So having a relgion does not change a government, its the situation and the person you should be more concerned about.

 

[El Stormo]

Not picking on you or anything, but most of the time relgions are to blame for war.

I'd like to put that statement into some perspective: religions have very often been used as a front for other reasons.

 

[Anvil]

This has just become entertainment.

 

[Jeff-Loomis-fan]

as long as we dont start a war over this

 

[Captain Beard]

We did, Iraq... I mean, uh, terrorism, not brown people with different beliefs... yeah.

 

[The River Dragon]

The first time I saw this thread, I thought it was a joke! You don't have to believe in hell to have an idea of what's wrong and what's right (for you). Everybody has some kind of moral!
Ideology and moral are two different things though. The topic for this thread was Christian moral vs Atheistic moral (or lack of such), not Communism vs Capitalism. Honestly I don't think modern Christian moral really is very different from the Atheisitc.

For some of you this might be intresting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism#Fascism_and_religion

 

[flying_whale]

The first time I saw this thread, I thought it was a joke! You don't have to believe in hell to have an idea of what's wrong and what's right (for you). Everybody has some kind of moral!
Ideology and moral are two different things though. The topic for this thread was Christian moral vs Atheistic moral (or lack of such), not Communism vs Capitalism. Honestly I don't think modern Christian moral really is very different from the Atheisitc.

For some of you this might be intresting: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fascism#Fascism_and_religion

Yes, you are living in Europe where the church mostly stays out of people's live, but not in America

 

[WhiteBeastofWotan]

The Church doesn't get in the way of my life.

 

[Captain Beard]

It DOES want to, though.

 

[WhiteBeastofWotan]

Well it can look, but it can't touch.