Boss SD-1 Yes/No? Or TS7?

[colonel kurtz]

damn, this thread just reminded me that the pawn shop down the street from me is selling an SD1 for $20

i don't really even want the thing, but i figure for that price, it's worth grabbing up

 

[colonel kurtz]

heh...so i went and got that pedal today, and turns out it was a DS-1, not an SD-1

i figured for $20 i'd give it a shot...and lo and behold, this thing is totally unusable as a boost, and really is a true distortion pedal - but i have a feeling it'll work well for getting some grind out of bass, and for what i paid for it i'm sure i can get my money's worth out of it

sorta bummed though, cause i was looking forward to doing a SD-1 v. TS7 shootout w/ clips and all!

 

[TheWinterSnow]

My guitarist got a DS-1 a few years back for the fuck of it and the thing as a boost it pointless, its noisy and extremely muddy compared to the SD-1. Fortunately for him, he later bought an SD-1 and was much happier. The SD-1 is leaps and bounds better than the DS-1

 

[colonel kurtz]

My guitarist got a DS-1 a few years back for the fuck of it and the thing as a boost it pointless, its noisy and extremely muddy compared to the SD-1. Fortunately for him, he later bought an SD-1 and was much happier. The SD-1 is leaps and bounds better than the DS-1

yea...it took me 2 seconds to figure out that it's worthless as a boost - when cranking the level with the distortion turned all the way down, it still distorts the crap out of the signal, and the level going into the interface was lower than when it was bypassed

i will say, however, that i just had bunches of fun running my bass into the DS-1 with some good bass cab impulses slapped on top of that

 

[Notuern]

The DS-1 has some sweet mods though!
Cant really say that its suitable for metal though.. out of the box its more for grunge/punk, with the mods its more for blues/heavy rock.

 

[HeadCrusher]

Ok, so the good news is I walked into the store today to buy one of these pedals. The bad news is now I want the TS9.

As I expected the store didn't carry the TS7. So I started out trying the SD-1. It seemed ok but it does take away Bass for sure, even with the Tone rolled back all the way. If Drive is 0 it doesn't really boost a whole lot, even with Level all the way up. Once you start cranking the Drive pot it soon starts to give that solid state/plastic kinda sound with lots of harsh highs.

The guy in the store also gave me a Big Muff to try out. Don't know why since I asked for Overdrive pedals but I figured I'd try it anyway as I haven't played one yet. I didn't expect it to be what I was looking for and it wasn't. It's fun though. Can definitely see it getting used for some Stoner Rock (or some STYE/In Flames ).

Since I wasn't blown away buy the SD-1 (or the Big Muff ) I figured why not try the TS9? It's way out of my prize range but since they carried it in the store I thought I'd just check it out side by side with the Boss. Well, what can I say... I'll have to save up for it, no matter what. I don't really know how to describe it but the sound was just what I was looking for. Not really distorting (like the SD-1, even though it's supposed to be an Overdrive) but just adding that little extra.

On a sidenote those Boss pedals gotta have the worst Bypass ever! They had one of those Boss "checkpoints" with all their pedals patched to the wall in the store. Obviously the signal goes through some pedals before it finally hits the pedal you wanna try out. So when the SD-1 (and all the others were on bypass) it almost sucked all the life out of the amp, no kidding. I barely could get any harmonics out of it, no matter if the SD-1 was on or off. When I plugged the TS9 straight between my guitar and the amp everything sounded fine. No problems getting it to squeel.

I tried the pedals with my own guitar through a JVM 410 Head. Tested 'em with all the modes on the first three channels.

Btw I bought a DS-1 on eBay by accident a few years back. Sold it again a few weeks later. I can only +1 everything that's been said about it in this thread so far.

 

[Mikaël-ange]

DS1 sound really good for Satriani lead like with keeley mod btw. But only for that

 

[Notuern]

It seemed ok but it does take away Bass for sure, even with the Tone rolled back all the way. If Drive is 0 it doesn't really boost a whole lot, even with Level all the way up. Once you start cranking the Drive pot it soon starts to give that solid state/plastic kinda sound with lots of harsh highs.

Not really distorting (like the SD-1, even though it's supposed to be an Overdrive) but just adding that little extra.

From what you are saying i am guessing that the pedal is broken.. true that it almost doesnt output when you pull the drive all the way down(Same thing happens with a TS-9.).
The SD-1 and the TS-9 are almost identical.
The SD-1 lets more low end through then the TS-9.. basically take everything the TS-9 does with the frequencies of the sound, and pull it back by 250hz and you have the SD-1's frequency response.
And apart from that, the only difference is that the SD-1 uses assymetrical clipping(Like tube amps.), and the TS-9 uses symmetrical clipping(solid state amps.).

Its fine if you prefer the TS-9, most people do.. but the things you are saying is not true to what the SD-1 is.
So my guess is that you have tried out a defective pedal or something(Especially the part that its more of a distortion, since the SD-1 is more transparent then the TS-9.).

 

[HeadCrusher]

Well I'm not saying that particular pedal was perfectly alright (How would I know and after all it probably has been tryed by countless dudes who don't know what they are doing). However there was still a night and day difference from the SD-1 to the TS9. And the TS9 DID push the signal a fair amount with Drive all the way down at 0.

 

[Notuern]

Well I'm not saying that particular pedal was perfectly alright (How would I know and after all it probably has been tryed by countless dudes who don't know what they are doing). However there was still a night and day difference from the SD-1 to the TS9. And the TS9 DID push the signal a fair amount with Drive all the way down at 0.

Ive A/B'ed my SD-1 between with my friends TS9, and while you definitely could hear a difference, i wouldn't say that its a night and day difference.. the TS9 sounded less transparent(The SD-1 blended with the amps own distortion better imo.), and it FELT slightly less dynamic then the TS9(But i couldn't hear a difference in dynamics when my friend played.).
Anyways, go for it!
They are pretty close in the sound, but i am pretty confident that you will like the sound of the TS9 over the SD-1(The SD-1 is grainier and may cause mud when down-tuning.).

In the end, it comes down to personal preference.. but i wont ever agree that the SD-1 is harsh sounding!

 

[HeadCrusher]

Well maybe it really was that particular pedal, dunno... What settings do you use on yours? Guitar/Pickups/Amp?

 

[Notuern]

The setting i tend to use the most is:

Drive: 9-10 o'clock
Tone: 11 o'clock
Level: (Set so level doesnt change between on/off.)

And relatively low gain on the amp(Just a little bit more then AC/DC.), but then i play 80's heavy metal(Ratt, Dokken, Cinderella etc.).

Guitar: Aria Pro II RS Knight Warrior
Pickups: MMK45(Stock pickup.)
Amp(That ive used those settings on.): Ada MP-1, Randall RM100, Ampeg VL-1002, Carvin X100B

When i play a bit more "br00tal" music, i tend to pull the Drive and Level up slightly, just enough to get those epicz palm mutes and harmonics(With more gain on the amp obviously.).

 

[HeadCrusher]

Now that's really interesting! These are more or less the same settings that I used today. Only that I had the level pretty high since I wanted it to be louder when the pedal is on.

 

[Star Ark]

I thought the bass cut was half the point of the sd1? It tightens up the sound considerably, add a little more than half level to compress the signal, turn the tone knob a little to cut the mud, have the drive set almost zero and it gives me awesome tones on many different amps. Not good for sludge but awesome for intricate tight rhythms.

Although i haven't tried it with a ts7 or ts9 so I don't know which one is best.

 

[TheWinterSnow]

To compare

SD-1:
http://www.freeinfosociety.com/electronics/schemview.php?id=169

TS9:
http://www.freeinfosociety.com/electronics/schemview.php?id=10889

They are basically the same thing, only a few minor tweaks in component values, and I mean pretty damn small. The input impedance is high enough on the SD-1 that tone sucking does not happen. If "tone sucking" (Impedance mismatch) is happening, than there is something wrong with the pedal.

Both pedals have a maximum Av (gain factor) of 1, which means they do not boost the level of the signal, however because of the filtering that is being applied, the mids are actually amplified, so the pedals increase the mids and sacrifice the lows so that the output volume is the same as the input volume. If you are getting less, there is something wrong with the pedal.

 

[abt]

To compare

SD-1:
http://www.freeinfosociety.com/electronics/schemview.php?id=169

TS9:
http://www.freeinfosociety.com/electronics/schemview.php?id=169

They are basically the same thing, only a few minor tweaks in component values, and I mean pretty damn small. The input impedance is high enough on the SD-1 that tone sucking does not happen. If "tone sucking" (Impedance mismatch) is happening, than there is something wrong with the pedal.

Both pedals have a maximum Av (gain factor) of 1, which means they do not boost the level of the signal, however because of the filtering that is being applied, the mids are actually amplified, so the pedals increase the mids and sacrifice the lows so that the output volume is the same as the input volume. If you are getting less, there is something wrong with the pedal.

They look the same alright, that's because they are the same. I think you want this one:
http://www.freeinfosociety.com/electronics/schemview.php?id=1088

 

[aortizjr]

^^ Ha! At first I didn't read the title and then was like wow... identical.. different than what I remember

Anyway the circuits are nearly identical, but it is the little things that make a difference. Primarily in the diode clipping section. Things here can make a big difference. Even different colors of LED's instead of diodes can make a difference here.

Also some of the cap values can have an effect on low-end and high-end roll-off in the buffers and in the circuit itself.

I think you will find that almost all overdrives here are similar.

What bothers me is that, for boosting, you don't want much if any clipping. It is more like more gain with a midrange bump. In that case the caps and pots in the tone section make a difference as well.

Now if you are using it for tone as a dirt box, well then the clipping does matter.

But YMMV. With some amps I do like a little of both. High level for boosting and some clipping for flavor or a bit more saturation.

For blues tones I definitely like an 808 or Ts-9 or Bad Monkey type smoothness. Into a clean tube channel with some grit and boost, ala Bassman or even Hot Rod Deluxe or Champ, oh yeah...With some LED clipping..really oh yeah... For boosting Marshalls, Mesa's, Crate's, Sovtek's, etc. I try both and see what works, sometimes the SD-1 bite is just what is needed, but sometimes the TS-9 or 808 gives the girth and tightness without adding as much bite. All depends.

 

[TheWinterSnow]

you do want some clipping as clipping provides for an excitement in harmonics, which is a huge reason the TS and SD-1 push the amp differently. You can use a parametric eq with an adjustable gain boost to completely recreate the frequency response of the pedal and it would sound thin, lacking, harsh, hollow. The clipping is a huge part of what makes the pedals sound so much more different than just using an eq. I have tried this before, and I will say, parametric and graphic eqs are better left in the fx loop if you HAVE to use one). The clipping that will come out of the pedal will be light as anything substantial will cause noise, but it needs to be enough to add flavor and mid complexion to the tone, and it just so happens that having an SD-1 with the drive all the way down is just the right amount of clipping that is needed, its actually quite difficult to hear until you really dig into the strings.