Don't Mourn The Dead In Blacksburg

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It is disquieting that at least some of the people would actually line up as told, and while I am sure Scourge of God would have donned his KFC bucket and struck down each bullet with those burly muttonchops, I have to ask, really, what do you expect? These are (were) some well-to-do math students.

While still at distance from the approaching carnage some students wisely bailed while they could, others played dead and some organized to barricade the door on one classroom.

http://www.philly.com/dailynews/local/20070418_Refusing_to_cower__he_saved_lives.html

There was also a 75 year old Jewish Prof. who apparently blocked the door to his classroom and died shielding the rest of the students.

People seeking more info behind the economics, implications and "culture of cruelty" behind many such attacks in the USA shuld definitely check out Going Postal by Mark Ames.

Excerpt here: http://www.exile.ru/2005-November-04/going_postal.html

That link was interesting. We should really feel sorry for Beck being bullied by those greedy selfish people, and sympathise with him. It would have been a shame if anyone would have stopped him once he had got started.
The society we live in promotes psychopaths and those liked by psychopaths - so it is no wonder some people who are trodden on feel aggrieved. Odd how the killer is NOT the psychopath but his victims were. (In the Beck case, not in the Virginia University case).
 
This comment, among others, are some of the most callous and idiotic opinions I've ever seen anyone put their name behind. Then again, I'm sure that YOU are just a weakling who would not voice these opinions in real life. In sum, until you've been in the same situation and attacked the guy with the automatic rifle, shut your pompous asshole of a mouth.

He had two small caliber pistols. Effective range: 8 feet. I can cover 8 feet in less than one second, so can any other healthy human being. If the alternative is waiting to be executed, then you bet your bippy I would take the chance at living on my feet rather than the certainty of dying on my knees.

But then again, I'm not one of the broken sheeple.

On a lighter note, the Holocaust Survivor(tm) bought it on Yom Hashoah. So, apparently, there is a god, and he is Wotan.
 
I can't believe the sheer stupidity of some of the 'arguments' in this thread.

I had respect for this forum and its 'mature and intelligent discussions', until people started responding to Scourge of God's ignorant remarks in a manner that lends them credibility.

There is no appropriate response to such an unashamed display of ignorance other than ridicule.
 
The ignorance is yours, kid. If you don't know how to avoid discussions you find distasteful, maybe you should stick to the kiddie pool. Or at least head over to the CoB forum. That seems more your speed, eh?
 
I don't find your argument distasteful. I never said that.

I Do find it:

1)weak
2)unconsidered
3)one-dimensional
4)founded in emotional attachment to the issue
5)childish

You had a good idea, yet you worded it in a way that will discredit it in the eyes of serious thinkers
 
You mean the kind of 'serious thinkers' who suspect an 'emotional attachment' to an 'issue' involving absolutely no one known by anyone involved in the debate? The kind of 'serious thinkers' who tell others how THEY should react to internet posts? The sort of 'serious thinker' who pimps trash like Aborted on a fifth rate music site?

If you've got a dictionary handy, you might try looking up the terms 'serious' and 'thinker,' since it's obvious that you grasp neither concept.
 
Scourge has the ability to make a coherent and reasoned argument on this forum, which he has done. One doesnt have to agree with him; only make a very, very intelligent argument to refute him.
 
I saw this Saudi news article on the shooting, and thought it very interesting. I dont support, or condone, or have any position on the article, but would like to post it, as it is interesting.


Arab News, Saudi Arabia -- Heavy Price

The massacre of 32 students at Virginia Tech University has left Americans dumbstruck. It is the latest and so far the most bloody in a series of murderous attacks at US educational institutions. At each of the appalling crime scenes, youngsters have settled grudges or played out video game fantasies with powerful automatic weapons. And those weapons are sold over the counter in virtually each of America's 50 states. However at this hour of America's horrified grief, in which all decent people worldwide share, it is worth pointing out that there is a lesson here which, on past evidence, no US administration will choose even to hear, let alone learn.

That lesson is this: if a suicide bomber walks into a crowded market in Iraq and blows himself up along with 32 innocent bystanders, it is terrorism. If the same thing happens in America, it is not. Americans -- and by extension anyone in the country -- enjoy a constitutional right to bear arms. However anachronistic this may seem to outsiders given that the days of frontiersmen and citizens' militias are long past, there still remains a powerful lobby, funded by the weaponry manufacturers themselves, that defends what it claims is a fundamental right.

Yet at the same time, the Americans lose no time in insisting that others around the world surrender their weaponry -- whether the weaponry belongs to Afghan tribesmen, Iraqi neighborhood patrols or, on a larger scale, the nuclear arms of North Korea and the suspected Iranian atomic program. The scale of the weapon is irrelevant. There is an inherent moral contradiction in the rights that Americans seek to maintain for their own citizens and the demands they make on the citizens of other countries.
 
He had two small caliber pistols. Effective range: 8 feet. I can cover 8 feet in less than one second, so can any other healthy human being. If the alternative is waiting to be executed, then you bet your bippy I would take the chance at living on my feet rather than the certainty of dying on my knees.

But then again, I'm not one of the broken sheeple.

On a lighter note, the Holocaust Survivor(tm) bought it on Yom Hashoah. So, apparently, there is a god, and he is Wotan.

The point still stands: You have NEVER been in this situation; therefore, don't presume to know what you would do and do not criticize people based on your own flimsy assumptions.

Besides, the whole idea is flawed. Should we not mourn those who made mistakes? Is mourning someone based on the number of "good" things they have done in their lives? Should we start a scale, so that we can measure out whether we should mourn this person when they die? The whole idea is an unfounded load of crap, just look at its consequences.
 
The point still stands: You have NEVER been in this situation; therefore, don't presume to know what you would do and do not criticize people based on your own flimsy assumptions.

Besides, the whole idea is flawed. Should we not mourn those who made mistakes? Is mourning someone based on the number of "good" things they have done in their lives? Should we start a scale, so that we can measure out whether we should mourn this person when they die? The whole idea is an unfounded load of crap, just look at its consequences.

Now this is the way to argue with Scourge!
 
Generally, I don't think you should mourn people you didn't know just because they died a... special death. How are they different than victims of, say, car accidents? Both are victims of chance - wrong place, wrong time.

I don't understand why you should sympathize with the shooter? Society should not be blamed for his mental instability. If you're so unhappy about your life and you don't have what it takes to fix it, go ahead and kill yourself. What is the benefit in shooting others? Even if he did carefuly chose his victims, further supposing that people who are not to someone's liking should be shot, then why should we trust a mentally instable murderer's judgment? (also: those who are "worthy" will most likely sacrifice themselves to save others and stop the shooting, dying for nothing, so school massacres are not a very effective eugenic policy)
 
I saw this Saudi news article on the shooting, and thought it very interesting. I dont support, or condone, or have any position on the article, but would like to post it, as it is interesting.


Arab News, Saudi Arabia -- Heavy Price

The massacre of 32 students at Virginia Tech University has left Americans dumbstruck. It is the latest and so far the most bloody in a series of murderous attacks at US educational institutions. At each of the appalling crime scenes, youngsters have settled grudges or played out video game fantasies with powerful automatic weapons. And those weapons are sold over the counter in virtually each of America's 50 states. However at this hour of America's horrified grief, in which all decent people worldwide share, it is worth pointing out that there is a lesson here which, on past evidence, no US administration will choose even to hear, let alone learn.

That lesson is this: if a suicide bomber walks into a crowded market in Iraq and blows himself up along with 32 innocent bystanders, it is terrorism. If the same thing happens in America, it is not. Americans -- and by extension anyone in the country -- enjoy a constitutional right to bear arms. However anachronistic this may seem to outsiders given that the days of frontiersmen and citizens' militias are long past, there still remains a powerful lobby, funded by the weaponry manufacturers themselves, that defends what it claims is a fundamental right.

Yet at the same time, the Americans lose no time in insisting that others around the world surrender their weaponry -- whether the weaponry belongs to Afghan tribesmen, Iraqi neighborhood patrols or, on a larger scale, the nuclear arms of North Korea and the suspected Iranian atomic program. The scale of the weapon is irrelevant. There is an inherent moral contradiction in the rights that Americans seek to maintain for their own citizens and the demands they make on the citizens of other countries.
I've just noticed this one now. This is fucking moronic. Terrorists kill to achieve political or social goals, and the identity of their victims doesn't matter; they merely want to bring a change by using violence and harming innocents. School massacre is the result of mental instability, the murderer kills for pleasure, because of his anger, etc.
 
He had two small caliber pistols. Effective range: 8 feet.

Yeah ... that really is rather pathetic. 32 people with low caliber hand guns. Go back even ... 30 years and he most likely would have only been able to injure a few people. Our population is beyond pacified; we know how to read technical facts and fuck in a hundred positions, about it.


Arab News, Saudi Arabia -- Heavy Price

The massacre of 32 students at Virginia Tech University has left Americans dumbstruck. It is the latest and so far the most bloody in a series of murderous attacks at US educational institutions. At each of the appalling crime scenes, youngsters have settled grudges or played out video game fantasies with powerful automatic weapons. And those weapons are sold over the counter in virtually each of America's 50 states. However at this hour of America's horrified grief, in which all decent people worldwide share, it is worth pointing out that there is a lesson here which, on past evidence, no US administration will choose even to hear, let alone learn.

That lesson is this: if a suicide bomber walks into a crowded market in Iraq and blows himself up along with 32 innocent bystanders, it is terrorism. If the same thing happens in America, it is not. Americans -- and by extension anyone in the country -- enjoy a constitutional right to bear arms. However anachronistic this may seem to outsiders given that the days of frontiersmen and citizens' militias are long past, there still remains a powerful lobby, funded by the weaponry manufacturers themselves, that defends what it claims is a fundamental right.

Yet at the same time, the Americans lose no time in insisting that others around the world surrender their weaponry -- whether the weaponry belongs to Afghan tribesmen, Iraqi neighborhood patrols or, on a larger scale, the nuclear arms of North Korea and the suspected Iranian atomic program. The scale of the weapon is irrelevant. There is an inherent moral contradiction in the rights that Americans seek to maintain for their own citizens and the demands they make on the citizens of other countries.
That's almost as bad as American news stories. =)
 
Έρεβος;6084704 said:
Yeah ... that really is rather pathetic. 32 people with low caliber hand guns. Go back even ... 30 years and he most likely would have only been able to injure a few people. Our population is beyond pacified; we know how to read technical facts and fuck in a hundred positions, about it.



That's almost as bad as American news stories. =)

But I thought it very interesting to see how they (arabs) see us and our problems.
 
Έρεβος;6084756 said:
Yeah. Should get a story on the same thing from like 30 different countries and compare; that would be really interesting.

I got it from a article that had 5 examples (Canada, England, Australia, Saudi Arabia and South Korea). All but the Australians made rather harsh criticisms of American society, and the S Koreans of course aplogized and reiterated the boy was one rotten apple.
 
Mr Coltrane has taken the words right out of my mouth. Scourge of God you truly are a "scourge" It's too easy to "armchair" this topic, with all the mundane pre-meditated responses. As I've said before, be a part of the solution, not the problem. The treadstarters rationale is one part of this problem, this thinking pervades American society. We are de-sensitized to blood-letting. The blame can be cast from the top on down for this atrocious act. It's obvious and scary to realize we as a nation, and the last 3 Presidential administrations have NOT learned a FUCKING thing since Columbine. How many more people must die? Hey, Scourge alone in a room with you for 5 minutes is at this point, my greatest wish.
 
The treadstarters rationale is one part of this problem, this thinking pervades American society. We are de-sensitized to blood-letting.

De-sensitized? Quite the opposite; that is simply an invented term for those that think realistically. Most people have no stomach for reality, hence are only able to think in "oh-that-is-sad" terms. There is no small specific thing (like gov't/police action) to blame such as this on, and certainly not the type of attitude Scourge professes, in fact his attitude is on line with the type that is greatly needed. Was is to blame for this is naught but the entire modern society, and this type of thing will continue to happen, more often, as time goes on, in such a society. It doesn't matter specialized things we do; it is the whole that is causing the whole to fall apart, and these events are just pieces starting to fall off.
 
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