Epicureanism

[speed]

Of all philosophies, Epicureanism has always been the most unfairly maligned. The Christians burned his substantial works, and closed his schools. Yet, of all philosophies, I find Epicureanism to be the most benevolent and reasoned.

Epicurus' ideas are still in many ways, modern: he was one of the first atheists; he conceived of a atomic universe of atoms that had weight, and moved within the void of space, where motion was determined mechanically, not by gods; he held that only things created from atoms could exist--thus the idea of soul was dead wrong, as atoms that made up the brain, would cease to exist in their former form, the atoms would disperse, and thus ones mind or soul disappeared at death; he argued that if there was evil, then how could there be a god; and most famously, he held that pleasure free from suffering and pain, was the point of life--but he was no hedonist, and had a ethical system that was almost ascetic in its view of pleasure.

His ideas on death, are the most interesting, and ones I wish to share:
(this list is from the Internet Encylopedia of Philosophy)

1. Death is annihilation.
2. The living have not yet been annihilated (otherwise they wouldn't be alive).
3. Death does not affect the living. (from 1 and 2)
4. So, death is not bad for the living. (from 3)
5. For something to be bad for somebody, that person has to exist, at least.
6. The dead do not exist. (from 1)
7. Therefore, death is not bad for the dead. (from 5 and 6)
8. Therefore death is bad for neither the living nor the dead. (from 4 and 7)

Epicurus adds that if death causes you no pain when you're dead, it's foolish to allow the fear of it to cause you pain now.

Anyone who fears death should consider the time before he was born. The past infinity of pre-natal non-existence is like the future infinity of post-mortem non-existence; it is as though nature has put up a mirror to let us see what our future non-existence will be like. But we do not consider not having existed for an eternity before our births to be a terrible thing; therefore, neither should we think not existing for an eternity after our deaths to be evil.

So, do I have any converts?

 

[By Design]

i can tell this is a man that truly sat back and looked at the big picture. at least the picture that the living can see, not some mystical fantasy about a creator to whom communication or confirmation is impossible. accept for one who is chosen by others without such ability, to whom great power is invested.

although this is a nice theory of death (as seen by the living) but, it dosnt answer "why?", is it some cosmological coincidence? or, is there reason behind it?

 

[speed]

i can tell this is a man that truly sat back and looked at the big picture. at least the picture that the living can see, not some mystical fantasy about a creator to whom communication or confirmation is impossible. accept for one who is chosen by others without such ability.

although this is a nice theory of death (as seen by the living) but, it dosnt answer "why?", is it some cosmological coincidence? or, is there reason behind it?

Epicurus, according to I believe Lucretius, believed the universe was infinite, and that atoms had always existed--and would always exist. HE almost sounded like darwin with the few fragments left on his idea of the evolution of atoms. Of course he derived his ideas from the Pre-Socratic Democritus--not Parmenides or Pythagoras a Plato did, and expanded upon him. Hence, there was no creator if you will--atoms were always there.

 

[By Design]

Epicurus, according to I believe Lucretius, believed the universe was infinite, and that atoms had always existed--and would always exist. HE almost sounded like darwin with the few fragments left on his idea of the evolution of atoms. Of course he derived his ideas from the Pre-Socratic Democritus--not Parmenides or Pythagoras a Plato did, and expanded upon him. Hence, there was no creator if you will--atoms were always there.

"atoms were always there" well, after the big bang. but theres more to matter and the universe that cant be explained with atoms (including life), gravity is a big one. currently we only (i use this loosely) understand/connected the strong, and electro/weak (Einstein was a big help w/ E=Mc2). but, when humans figure out how to mathematically connect gravity with the other two, the universe will be the limit (literally). this is where string theory looks promising.

But, life is even beyond what string theory could hope to solve.

 

[derek]

I find Epicureanism to be very noble insomuch as it preaches the search for tranquility and peace (pleasure is probably the wrong word to use) and hopes to liberate people from their fears of death, and the wrath of the Gods. Those pursuits seem quite noble to me.