extol's "synergy". . .

[ChiefB]

Interesting discussion.

I do have a problem with bands that associate / affiliate themselves to one 'corner of the ring' such as a religious band. The music created by religious bands always exhibits a one sided discussion on how they (the converted) see and interpret the world around them. For example, a band that has a multitude of interests will have a wider portfolio of material than a band dedicated to serve a particular religion or cause. To serve only a single cause merely creates preachy music.

My review of Tourniquet (review on Royal Carnage) was very fair because I only concentrated on their music not their religious beliefs. Their album on a whole did not stand up technically and hence was given a score to reflect that. But I did mention that they use their music to spread the word of the Gospel and I do feel that the band were being excessively preachy and using the goodwill of Marty Friedman to promote the sale of their album.

If you take this discussion further, we can state that these groups are only targeting a particular demographic, otherwise why label yourself as Christian Rock - which is a dichotomy in itself!.

As food for thought, what about a band that preaches the message of Islam, they may sound absolutely brilliant but does the adage 'I thought it was about music' still apply?

Chief B

 

[bloodfiredeath]

Hypocritical, eh? What's hypocritical about choosing not to be subjected to views I loathe and which do nothing but aggravate me?

Agreed.

My acknowledgement of being hypocritical is a personal thing for me. I tend to look the other way in certain forms of music, where a religious aspect being included just seems to fit. For example, I love Willie Nelson, and he is deeply religious and has put out several albums entirely of gospel songs. For some reason, that doesn't bother me at all, or stop me from listening to Red Headed Stranger.

However, in any form of metal or punk music, I find the topic completely nauseating.

And I will admit that I have never heard Extol, nor seen their lyrics. I have no interest in doing so either. My judgement is based upon what I have read about them in other forums and websites. If I am wrong, then so be it, but I doubt it.

 

[Black Winter Day]

As food for thought, what about a band that preaches the message of Islam, they may sound absolutely brilliant but does the adage 'I thought it was about music' still apply?

if th music is good, i personally would listen to them

 

[J.]

To avoid replying numerous times, I'll just give my view.

Purposely avoiding a band or bands strictly because you don't agree with lyrical content is absurd in my opinion. I thought metal heads were suppose to be open minded. At least, they like to claim they are. You could very well be depriving yourself of good music by taking this stance.

Moreso, people who avoid "Christian rock/metal simply because they think it's preachy, and yet listen to preachy anti-Christian music are hypocrites. For example, Zyklon is very anti-Christian. Not necessarily in the ways of say Immolation, Deicide, or Vital Remains. Zyklon (whose lyrics are written by Faust) takes a strong anti-Christian stance, and even has notes in the booklet stating these ideals. That is called preachy. Bands like Immolation, Deicide, and Vital Remains take the less-intelligent path, by just blasting away at Christianity in the ho-hum sense. Still, their lyrics are preachy. Ive read Benton's lyrics. How are Tourniquet's or Extol's lyrics preachy, and those aren't? Yet, metalheads have no problem listening to Deicide. Incidentally, anything Benton does should be scoffed at, seeing how he was suppose to kill himself at age 33, and wussed out. Pansy.

Like i said, lyrics shouldn't matter. Isn't metal all about open mindedness and progression? I am a Christian. I listen to Graveland, Immolation, Zyklon, Emperor, etc. So what? It's all about the music. I may not agree with the lyrics, but it's not like I take the lyrics to heart and burn down a church for my pagan ancestors.

I've had this discussion before, so I'm pretty certain of what will be said next, but I'll wait and see.

 

[NAD]

However, in any form of metal or punk music, I find the topic completely nauseating.

I must agree. It just seems a bit hypocritical, no? Sex, drugs, and rock n' roll being the bane of the church and all.

Either way, I've never heard Extol. If I come across them along with the other 4 million bands I've never heard, so be it.

 

[NAD]

Preachiness is kinda goofy no matter what side it comes from: conservative, liberal, anarchist, nihilist, atheist, religious, etc. If I agree with a stance obviously I'll at least enjoy the view, just as if I disagree with the perspective I will generally dislike it.

 

[bloodfiredeath]

First of all, no, I do not think it is 'all about the music.'

Isn't metal all about open mindedness and progression?

This bothers me. It frustrates me to see that over the years, the mentality of hardcore music has crept into metal. No, I am not open minded to everything, and I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

Moreso, people who avoid "Christian rock/metal simply because they think it's preachy, and yet listen to preachy anti-Christian music are hypocrites.

Is it hypcritical when you strongly agree with the anti-christian stance, yet strongly disagree with the christian stance?

 

[Black Winter Day]

but their beliefs shoul not keep you from at least hearing them, right?

 

[Black Winter Day]

Is it hypcritical when you strongly agree with the anti-christian stance, yet strongly disagree with the christian stance?

do you listen to satanic or heathenistic or rascist bands simply because of their "stances"?

 

[NAD]

What if lyrics mean a great deal to the listener? Some people identify with lyrics and ideas first, then the music comes as a backdrop. Granted, from what I have seen, most metalheads put music ahead of lyrics, but I have yet to meet every one of them.

 

[bloodfiredeath]

do you listen to satanic or heathenistic or rascist bands simply because of their "stances"?

Nope, but none of these offend me. christianity deeply offends me, that's the difference.

 

[J.]

This bothers me. It frustrates me to see that over the years, the mentality of hardcore music has crept into metal. No, I am not open minded to everything, and I don't think there is anything wrong with that.

So you're happy dwelling with whatever bands or beliefs you currently have without listening to another side of the issue? Are you completely opposed to progression in any way?

 

[Erik]

I don't really need to say more on this topic as bloodfiredeath seems to have more or less the exact same thoughts as me, but I'll put down some quick replies...

Purposely avoiding a band or bands strictly because you don't agree with lyrical content is absurd in my opinion.

Really? Christianity makes my blood boil. It's one of the things that really gets on my nerves. Even if a Christian band does not preach their beliefs through their music, the knowledge of them being Christians makes me uncomfortable. I cannot look past this. Is it "absurd" of me to avoid things which offend and disgust me? As has been said, this is not hypocrisy. Yes, I listen to some quite preachy Satanic or heathen bands, but those views are not offensive to me like Christianity is.

Isn't metal all about open mindedness and progression

I don't know where you got this idea from (*cough*hardcore*cough*) but it's certainly not one that will receive support from all too many metal fans.

Are you completely opposed to progression in any way?

Now this is just a total non sequitur...

 

[JayKeeley]

I thought metal heads were suppose to be open minded.

When it comes to elitism and bigotry amongst genres, I would say "metal heads" are generally the exact opposite.

 

[Black Winter Day]

if being a metalhead is synonymous with closemindedness, then count me the fuck out

 

[Lutz]

Isn't metal all about open mindedness and progression?

Metal is about blood, fire, and death.

 

[Black Winter Day]

and toddler-toy "ideals"

 

[Lutz]

Metal is also about witchcraft, blood and satan.

 

[JayKeeley]

if being a metalhead is synonymous with closemindedness, then count me the fuck out

I'm assuming you don't spend much time reading the other forums. It's actually quite shocking. I've seen people torn to pieces because they admit to liking a band or album that is generally disliked by the 'masses' for whatever reason.

There are two rules that seem to be apparent in metal forums:

1 - Who shouts the loudest (and with most authority) is typically considered 'correct' - more so for fear of further backlash.

2 - For some reason, some metal heads think it's their mission to convert others into liking or disliking a band or piece of music. Nothing can be accepted at face value.

 

[J.]

Really? Christianity makes my blood boil. It's one of the things that really gets on my nerves. Even if a Christian band does not preach their beliefs through their music, the knowledge of them being Christians makes me uncomfortable. I cannot look past this. Is it "absurd" of me to avoid things which offend and disgust me? As has been said, this is not hypocrisy. Yes, I listen to some quite preachy Satanic or heathen bands, but those views are not offensive to me like Christianity is.

So, does the knowledge of me being a Christian make your blood boil? Do I get on your nerves and make you feel uncomfortable?

I find some heathen bands and satanic bands quite offensive, yet I move past it.

I don't know where you got this idea from (*cough*hardcore*cough*) but it's certainly not one that will receive support from all too many metal fans.

pffftt..I don't know where you and bloodfiredeath get the idea that hardcore is open minded and progressive. Ever heard of those straightedge idiots?

Metal has progressed and will continue to progress faster than hardcore ever could.