Finished mix, Slate content, & API!

Glenn Fricker

Glenn Fricker

Very Metal &Very Bad News
Mar 6, 2005
4,146
15
38
22 Acacia Avenue
Hey guys,

This one was up last week as an "in progress" and, after some good advice from a few forum members, tweaked & finished.

Kick is Slate kick 5, at a 70% mix. Snare is about 30% Slate. It just added enough transient to give me what I wanted to hear. The rest of the kit is natural, including 421's on the toms... man, they were really worth the price!

Guitars were a single 57 (rare for me these days, but it doesn't hurt to mix it up once in a while) 5150 green channel & vintage 30's running into an API 512c.

One of these days, I'm going to post a full preamp shootout with what I have available. Should be interesting.

BTW, sorry for the timing issues.... I got a call to lay down the drums 2 days before the session because the drummer was leaving town for a job. Now, normally I'll tell a band to go practice to a metronome (learned my lesson last year) but it was either do it this way or no session at all. There just wasn't time. ...actually we cut drums for 3 songs in 4 hours...including setup! It was literally "finish the drums & drive to the airport." Given the rushed nature, I think it turned out pretty good. Best of all, the band loves the sound & wants to come back. ...and well practiced to a metronome.

Anyway, enjoy!

Oh yeah, here's the link:
http://www.myspace.com/spectresound
It's track 1 on the hi-res player: "Within these flames" by Aquila.
 
Sounds great dude!

In your opinion, do high end preamps make a huge difference in the outcome of guitar tone? I'm having issues with my tone being too weak, not in your face enough.

What kind of processing do you usually use on guitars? Rhythm mainly..

-Joe
 
J.DavisNJ said:
In your opinion, do high end preamps make a huge difference in the outcome of guitar tone? I'm having issues with my tone being too weak, not in your face enough.

What kind of processing do you usually use on guitars? Rhythm mainly..

-Joe
Click to expand...

Yes & no. The most important thing for a heavy rhythm tone is the player. The sound is in the hands. The followed by the guitar... i.e. what pickups/wood etc. etc. That's why I love Schecters. Then the amp, how it's set, the cabinet, mic position, & then finally the preamp.

I hope to do a shootout with some pre's this week & post a blind test... you can decide for yourself how much of a difference it makes.


As for processing, I find with the API's, it takes very little. They're a little 'colder' than Neve, so I'll buss the guitars out & EQ them as a whole. Rolloff at 75hz, boost at 95, a small shelf at 380 or so cutting about 1/2 db, another boost at 4k, & 10k as well. That, and a little multiband compression from 100-375hz to step on the chugging mud. Hmmm... "Chugging mud" Not a bad name for a group!


Anyway, thanks for the comments guys! Much appreciated!

-0z-
 
Sounds great hands down :)
IMHO mic preamp is of great importance for the recording. A good mic pre just adds it's mojo to the guitar/amp tone and you will rarely need to adjust more than 1-2 db's here and there, just to make it better fit in the mix.
If you can get your hands on a API 312 type pre, if you already didn't, I highly recommend checking those. Incredible punch. These, together with SCA N72 (one of the better Neve 1272 clones out there) are my go to pres for recording heavy guitar sounds.
I agree that APIs sound little more transparent than Neves, which I find better for rhythm guitars. Leads sound better through the Neve to my ears.
 
-Gavin- said:
It helps that Glenn is the king of micing amps :D
Click to expand...


I thought Andy & James were the Kings... I'm merely the Court Jester.:)


That being said, chalk the guitar tone up to sheer perseverance rather than talent. It took me eight years to master the art of recording heavy rhythms!
For the longest time, after asking the question "What the fuck am I doing wrong?" to the wrong people (*cough*gearslutz*cough*) I finally found this forum. A number of you put me in the right direction.... Less gain, tubescreamers, Vintage 30's, constructive critical feedback, etc.... and I'm forever in your debt! If we ever have a "Sneap Con" I'm buying a round for everyone!

-0z-
 
synchu said:
Sounds great hands down :)
IMHO mic preamp is of great importance for the recording. A good mic pre just adds it's mojo to the guitar/amp tone and you will rarely need to adjust more than 1-2 db's here and there, just to make it better fit in the mix.
If you can get your hands on a API 312 type pre, if you already didn't, I highly recommend checking those. Incredible punch. These, together with SCA N72 (one of the better Neve 1272 clones out there) are my go to pres for recording heavy guitar sounds.
I agree that APIs sound little more transparent than Neves, which I find better for rhythm guitars. Leads sound better through the Neve to my ears.
Click to expand...

There's no doubt the preamp is very important. I stand by the statement that the player is the most important, however. I've had situations where I've thrown everything I can think of at certain players, but to no avail. If the technique isn't there, the tone never will be either.

BTW, you're the second guy to mention the 312. Ever A/Bed against a 512?
 
OzNimbus said:
There's no doubt the preamp is very important. I stand by the statement that the player is the most important, however. I've had situations where I've thrown everything I can think of at certain players, but to no avail. If the technique isn't there, the tone never will be either.
BTW, you're the second guy to mention the 312. Ever A/Bed against a 512?
Click to expand...

I stand by you staying behind the statement that the player is the most important whatsoever and forever :) There is no second thought on this. Then it is the arrangement, then it is the producer ...etc.

I didn't have the chance to have 312/512 in side by side comparison, just sharing my experience with the 312 clone, very close to Brent Averill 312 design, with slightly optimized op-amp. I have a choice of the original 2520 op-amp and a 990 op-amp within mine and the original sounds great on recording guitars. But I listened extensively to both 312 and 512.
Should you have the chance to try out a 312 type pre - do it :)

I would recommend for an elaborate preamp comparison the following site:
http://www.thelisteningsessions.com
a perhaps the following links are the most interesting:
http://www.thelisteningsessions.com/session2.htm
http://www.thelisteningsessions.com/session10.htm
It is expected that a 512c will be included in the tests, as well.

Accept my apologies, if I am repeating something that has already being posted here.
 
It is a custom made for me by a very knowledgeable tech/designer here. All Cinemag transformers, high quality caps and elements, bullet proof housing...
API still makes them. The model is 3124+, which is 4 x 312 pre's. Sells around $2500.
You can check http://www.seventhcirclestudios.com/SCA/SCA.htm for some DIY and already assembled pres.
A12 preamp is based on API 312 design. SCA pre's are highly regarded by a bunch of professionals (M. Wagener comes to mind...).
 
Ok, that's what I thought. I believe Lasse has that & is very happy with it.


Did a little research on the 312/512 thing, and the consensus over on GS is there isn't that much of a difference... I will say this though: they've been fantastic on everything I've miked them with. I only wish I had grabbed them about 6 years ago!
 
^agree. That's just small different flavour to add, if you want. But at the end - whatever floats your boat, dude :) And it floats well, if I may add.
It sounds great as it is.
 
Thanks for the response dude...!

I need to get hip on these EQ terms though...roll off, yadda yadda. Does this refer to using a parametric EQ? I usually just try (without success) to use the channel EQ in Logic, which seems to be pretty good.

-Joe
 
man I need Slate's drums.

vox are a bit hot for my taste and I wish the guitars were a hair louder, but they sound fantastic and i'm a guitar player so maybe that's why

nice work

how did you treat the leads? sounds really nice
 
Conservative approach to drums recording + modern edge from slate samples =
Tits!
Can't wait to hear such a combination with a tighter band.
You deserve it Glenn.
 
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