Lately I`ve been playing with the idèa of doing some live PA jobs. I know my way around a studio quite well, but have never done any live concerts as an engineer. I guess some of you guys are experienced live engineers and I would really appreciate some advice and "tips`n`tricks" about this profession.
How many of you guys do live sound?
- Thread starter Amadeus79
- Start date
flhctroll
Member
I originally bought my gear for studio use then got some live gigs here and there. Now my Live work keeps me busy and the Studio is secondary.
My job is live sound and providing PA stuff for gigs..
Well obviously doing live sound is very different to working in a studio, but I guess it will depend on what systems you are working with, and of course the venue and bands.
My tips:
Alot of musicians can be stupid, turning up for gigs without power leads, cables, plectrums, drum keys always seems to happen.
Not every venue is going to be equiped with a Midas hertiage and a lovely 30K rig with tons of headroom.
Get used to using Behringer gates and comps.
Bands will borrow your gaffa tape and not give it back.
Bands will can play really badly when drunk.
Dont take tour managers to seriously.
Not all touring sound engineers have a clue what they are doing.
Buy yourself some ear protection for nights in busy clubs
Always have a torch
Always have a black marker
Carry a small first aid kit somewhere
Guitarists ALWAYS want to be on 11
I always try to mix with the audience and the system in mind before the band, if it sounds nice and the system is operating well, then everyones happy.
1 thing that is exactly the same is the old crap in = crap out, but the band will probabaly try to blame the engineer or monitoring..
All I can say is do it, have fun and you'll pick up whatever else you need to know on the way..
Well obviously doing live sound is very different to working in a studio, but I guess it will depend on what systems you are working with, and of course the venue and bands.
My tips:
Alot of musicians can be stupid, turning up for gigs without power leads, cables, plectrums, drum keys always seems to happen.
Not every venue is going to be equiped with a Midas hertiage and a lovely 30K rig with tons of headroom.
Get used to using Behringer gates and comps.
Bands will borrow your gaffa tape and not give it back.
Bands will can play really badly when drunk.
Dont take tour managers to seriously.
Not all touring sound engineers have a clue what they are doing.
Buy yourself some ear protection for nights in busy clubs
Always have a torch
Always have a black marker
Carry a small first aid kit somewhere
Guitarists ALWAYS want to be on 11
I always try to mix with the audience and the system in mind before the band, if it sounds nice and the system is operating well, then everyones happy.
1 thing that is exactly the same is the old crap in = crap out, but the band will probabaly try to blame the engineer or monitoring..
All I can say is do it, have fun and you'll pick up whatever else you need to know on the way..
elmuchoescadawg
Member
I do live sound and in some respects its more presure than recording because you only have one shot at the mix, the monitors are louder and can be more prone to feedback. Having said this one only have one performance to deal with and you also have the random factor that anything could happen.
Anything you want to know specifically?
Anything you want to know specifically?
Yeah, that`s the thing that`s bugging me. That I just have one shot. I`m a bit scared of screwing things up hehe.. I would like to know all the techniqual stuff e.g. if you route the instrumens the same way as you would do in a studio; a group for drums, another one for all the guitars etc. Do you find that you use gates, comps and eq the same way as you would in a studio situation. How to avoid feed back, what to send to the monitors to the different musicians etc. I would basically appreciate all techniqual and common sense advice I can get 
Keep it coming, guys! Great replies so far
Keep it coming, guys! Great replies so far
Ermz
¯\(°_o)/¯
I had that same initial hurdle you have when I started a few months ago.
Once you do your first gig.. as soon as the first band's set starts and things start to flow, you'll feel that weight being lifted off you, and being replaced with some pretty intense adrenaline. The mix is happening in real time, there's no second chances, so you've gotta get it right. Yet, at the same time, keep in mind a majority of live sound engineers have no idea what they're doing, so if you screw up in some way at a small gig, the crowd will be more or less used to it.
Things I can suggest:
Get a program called Simple Feedback Trainer and learn all the 31 band graphic frequencies by ear. Know what to pull out when it presents itself as a squeal.
Carry a kit with you:
Masking/electrical tape
Gaffa tape
Black markers (multiple, in case one fails)
Torch (extra batteries!!!)
A reference CD
Working microphone leads
Cable tester (you'll be surprised how much inhouse shit doesn't actually work)
If your budget allows it, also try to carry a few extra mics with you, in particular a bass drum mic (most venues have shit inhouse gear and as long as your kick sounds shit hot, you can build the mix around it).
I read a book called Live Sound Mixing which helped a lot. Written by a local Australian. I'm sure you'd have an equivalent wherever you live.
Try to go out and assist at a few gigs before you attempt it solo.
That's about all that comes to mind so far.
Once you do your first gig.. as soon as the first band's set starts and things start to flow, you'll feel that weight being lifted off you, and being replaced with some pretty intense adrenaline. The mix is happening in real time, there's no second chances, so you've gotta get it right. Yet, at the same time, keep in mind a majority of live sound engineers have no idea what they're doing, so if you screw up in some way at a small gig, the crowd will be more or less used to it.
Things I can suggest:
Get a program called Simple Feedback Trainer and learn all the 31 band graphic frequencies by ear. Know what to pull out when it presents itself as a squeal.
Carry a kit with you:
Masking/electrical tape
Gaffa tape
Black markers (multiple, in case one fails)
Torch (extra batteries!!!)
A reference CD
Working microphone leads
Cable tester (you'll be surprised how much inhouse shit doesn't actually work)
If your budget allows it, also try to carry a few extra mics with you, in particular a bass drum mic (most venues have shit inhouse gear and as long as your kick sounds shit hot, you can build the mix around it).
I read a book called Live Sound Mixing which helped a lot. Written by a local Australian. I'm sure you'd have an equivalent wherever you live.
Try to go out and assist at a few gigs before you attempt it solo.
That's about all that comes to mind so far.
metalkingdom
the kinder, gentler me
- Jan 1, 2005
- 1,634
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My only advice is to remember that live is not the same as being in the studio. I have a horror story that goes along with that. A few years ago, I went to see Stephen Perkins (Jane's Addiciton) side project play in Long Beach. He had Mike Watt on bass and some other really incredible musicians with him. Before the show, Stephen comes up to me and says, "Can you do our sound tonight?". I was thrown back by this, and although I really didn't want to do it, I couldn't say no to Stephen Perkins. So anyway, I go to the FOH position and start doing my thing. The normal FOH guy took off to go smoke a joint and he left me there all alone. I tried my best to make everything sound huge - and it did. After the show, I got a lot of kudos from people in the audience for the sound but was thrown back a little because the band didn't give me any props or even a thank you. Well, it turns out that they couldn't hear themselves onstage - because the monitors were being fed by the auxes on the FOH console - which I had turned to 0!!! Extremely embarrassing to say the least!
Seizure.
Member
Thats my problem too realy, when working on a cool FOH sound i tend to forget my monitor duty's!!
flhctroll
Member
Monitors are first priority. If the band cant hear themselves correctly they will play like shit. The crowd will notice that. Most people in the crowd dont know good sound from bad sound. They arent gonna notice the kick has the right gate on it or some shit like that. I always do a first verse/chorus mix then get up to the stage to check thier monitors. Of course I work in small clubs that I can do that. But then again, I suppose they would have a monitor rig if it was any bigger
metalkingdom
the kinder, gentler me
- Jan 1, 2005
- 1,634
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flhctroll said:
Usually that's true, but not always... especially when you're talking about world-class musicians. The crowd might not notice a gate on the kick, but they will definitely notice 60Hz pounding them into oblivion.
sorceron
ken
i started my audio career, ahem, if you can call it that... wait you cant. but yea i started out doing live sound actually. i used to chat with the sound man at a venue my band at the time would frequently play and ask questions about the job. one day he told me he was quitting and i should do it and i was was like "i dont know how" and the dude, dan, was like "just tell them you are a pro they wont know the difference". so thats what i did and it worked. luckily my first day this dude i knew jason rainey of the band sacred reich came in and he could tell right away i didnt know fuck all. he showed me the system and how everything worked and helped me out the first night and was like ok good luck dude. i worked there and a few other venue and also did some tours for 2 years!
flhctroll
Member
Andy Sneap
Metal Guru
one of my first gigs was doing all the in house sound at Rock City in Nottm. It amazed me how many live guys were blagging it. It really isn't as difficult as people make out, its just they blame the gear and room for their inabilities.
Brett - K A L I S I A
Dreaded Moderator
Yeah I have to agree, live mixing is quite easy (easier than studio work I mean), you have a bit of rush and stress at the very beginning of the show (especially if someone soundchecked after you and/or played before) and then it's fine. And if you fuck up, well, it's just a few minutes without any traces, so...
flhctroll
Member
Good sound guys blame themselves, shity guys blame the gear. I am in no way a great engineer but I have never once blamed the gear for shitty sound. I started with nothing and have worked my way up. I remember the engineer for a national act giving up on the system @ The Pig Pen in Iowa cause it was pretty beat up. But I got up to it and made it work for the local band I was working for. Oh well. The hardest part of live sound I think is making sure youve got enough power.
sorceron
ken
I think it's easier becasue if there's a fuck up, it's not going to tape, so unless you've mastered time travel you'll never hear it again. The biggest problems i have is guitarists who have to overcompensate and drown eveything out. that and drummers who rimshot every snare hit. and be prepared to have eveyone else tell you how to do your job, cuz everyone else is a sound expert. I'm considering carring a bat for the next guy who yell s: "soundguy sucks" cuz his favorit band is playing so loud you can't hear anything but guitars.
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