im sad guys

[CiG]

I agree, I think it's hilarious and fun. Some people must want this forum to be a circle jerk or something.

 

[no country for old wainds]

im bad guys

 

[CiG]

 

[suckerleaf]

This thread is really serious.

 

[Omni]

I just want him to not derail every conversation with his annoying shitposts and attempts to be a dissenter. Sometimes he is pretty funny but he has gotten old lately because this is pretty much all he posts anymore.

The fact that I have been warned by Deron and Ozzman and told that I could be banned a few months ago but they're telling me that he might not be trolling makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

 

[CiG]

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Discogs used to have a seller listing for one of the bootlegs of what's now their debut album. That bootleg is also listed on discogs and has pictures of the front, back and LP itself. Metal Archives also has information about the same bootleg. Prove that those listings are false if you want to dispute them.

Explain why Terry Jones sings differently on those recordings and has the vocal traits of a much younger singer than he does on their later albums. He also speaks on one of the songs on Volume 1 and his speaking voice sounds significantly younger than he does on The Lords of Hypocrisy.

The photo that was posted clearly has a younger Terry Jones and Alan Jones in it. Alan Jones in particular is barely an adult in that photo. Other members of the band are also in photographs from that era (including that one) and participated in the reunion.

There's zero evidence that what you're claiming is true, yet there is substantial evidence that the band existed during the 1980s.

If you're talking about the ~1994 bootleg, I already addressed that. 1994 isn't early, it's only a few years before the official release.

There's still approximately a decade between the two, plenty of time for a voice to change.

How does the guy in the photo above look barely like a kid?

He easily looks like he's in his mid 20s to me, at the earliest. I think it's funny that there is clearly a different artifacting on the two Jones dudes compared to the other two guys, and considering how low resolution it is, it could easily be a photoshop for all I know.

Which early members of the band participated in a reunion? From what I've found, the Mizrahi guy mysteriously vanished to Israel or something, and I can't find anything about the Portch guy rejoining the band either.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

lol @ all the butthurt above. I'm not trolling, cry more if you're taking this as a personal attack on your way of life.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Also, I'm skeptical of the alleged cover of the 1982 cassette tape. I have not seen a single other demo tape cover from that early with that kind of printing resolution. Compare:

 

[CiG]

This is probably the most interesting subject on here right now. It deserves it's own page.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

And just to clarify, I don't mean to imply that the Jones guys are aliens and never actually existed as humans but used mind tricks to fool others, or anything like that. I acknowledge that there are photos of the Jones guys that look younger than as seen live now. I can accept that those fellows were probably playing at least some form of rock music in the 80s. I don't accept the entire story of the band, their recording dates, the supposed nature of their live shows, their release of a demo at all in the early 80s, or many other things. There are too many weird things there, and too little evidence when you can find multiple live bootlegs of other obscure bands like Slauter Xstroyes and Hell. I know that some bands have had their recording material lost/forgotten, but if their demo and live performances were so well known even if just in their local community, I'd expect to see a reflection of that in the underground community. The only reason I ever thought this in the first place was because I simply tried to find an early video of them and thought it would be cool, and was disappointed when there weren't any. Then I went to their website and found multiple things that seemed very hard to believe, and now I think of them as something of a Jacula.

 

[suckerleaf]

The truth is out there.

 

[Master_Yoda77]

Al Jones clearly looks like he's barely in his 20s there. The other duders in the band were probably closer to Al's age than Terry's. Based on my calculations, Terry was 16 when he had Al, so yeah, I don't see anything wrong in that picture. Go join their official forums and make these posts and see what they say. Seriously, anyone can join and I've love to hear what family of the band members have to say.

All this talk has just made me want to listen to Pagan Altar even more.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

I don't really care about anything the band themselves have to say at this point. Don't they frequently have silly public quarrels on their forums anyways? I don't give a shit about some trve kvlt Facebook-equivalent. Point is, basically every other notorious underground band of the 80s had something linking them to others; band members that played in other bands, zine reviews that mentioned them, posters showing the other bands they played with, footage containing an audience, anything. If someone simply scanned the entirety that alleged "Sounds" magazine that reviewed them in the early 1980s, it would be sufficient proof for me, but from what I can tell, all information about the band comes from the two related family members, or from that bootleg that first popped up in the mid 90s. No independent verification.

 

[Master_Yoda77]

Alright, Ozz. I got him on ignore. I'll give this a try.

 

[Master_Yoda77]

 

[CiG]

HBB is making some pretty good points. He's not merely pulling shit out of his ass here.

Someone should try to track down the guy that produced their 80's material.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Since it's a demo I assumed it was self-produced, but apparently that's wrong. Per M-A it looks like some guy named Phil Hearne produced the material found on the first two albums. I found an interview claiming that Phil Hearne worked with Michael Jackson, Ritchie Blackmore, and others, although I can't find any evidence of that Hearne guy having any involvement with either. Or evidence of this Hearne guy existing at all outside of being a producer for Pagan Altar.

EDIT: Interesting, unlike their main website the same interview actually names bands that they played live shows with, and they say that included Deep Machine, Angel Witch, and Iron Maiden. I would consider even Deep Machine to be a "well known" by the standard of this discussion, but the Iron Maiden thing is odd. Steve Harris kept a journal of basically all the shows he played in the 70s and early 80s, including location, how much he got paid, and who shared the stage. I've even seen listings from 1978 or so where Maiden cancelled because they'd be playing with Siouxie and the Banshees and other punk bands. I've never seen any record of Pagan Altar playing with Iron Maiden.

 

[CiG]

Okay so what about this live image?

To me it quite clearly looks old enough to be from the 1980's.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

Hmm, I had missed/overlooked that one. It does show an actual audience so that's a big plus, although I think it's still funny that the image is of course out of focus. Where did you get that image from? Google Image's reverse search doesn't like images hosted here apparently.