Is pop starting to borrow from the Prog and power scene?

[edgeofthorns]

(System of a Down)




Yep, they are so amazingly crappy.

Why, they're so crappy that, when SoaD were performing upstairs at the Tabernacle a few years ago, and the ProgPower pre-show party was happening simultaneously downstairs at the Cotton Club, some of the ProgPower main-stage band members were overheard wishing they could be upstairs watching System of a Down. Yipes! They sure got fooled, huh?
I'm told some of those PP musicians were taken upstairs via the backstage stairs so they could go watch that 'crappy' band.

SoaD are one of the most unique acts to be heard on mainstream American radio in the last 5 years, maybe longer. I don't like all of their songs and you'll find that even mallcore kidz tend to be sharply divided on them. They have undeniable musical talent, though, and in a nation where radio is a desolate corporate wasteland, "different" bands like SoaD, 3 Inches of Blood and Coheed & Cambria realllly stand out.

I'll add Shadows Fall to your list. Heck, those guys have pretty much brought Testament style thrash metal to the mainstream again! I don't think anyone on here would say that Shadows Fall aren't talented....I hope not anyway!

 

[edgeofthorns]

As more of generally what's happening, I would probably say it's vice versa, that more of the "prog" and power scene, and metal in general is starting to borrow more from the pop scene.

Yeah, I think you can say that! I'd agree!

 

[Kenneth R.]

Green Day is absolutely atrocious and should never even be mentioned on this forum. They and their kind make me sick to my stomach. I hate that shit!

thats too bad that you're so closed minded. over the years they've vastly improved as a band and their latest release is borderline prog. (dare i say it, knowing the fanboy herd will gasp at that one). popular music is getting much better because what is popular is better.

 

[adaher]

As far as our music going mainstream, I don't know. I kinda miss being able to just go to the record store the day a new CD comes out.

If I'm LUCKY, the new Stratovarius might be available in some stores on Sep. 5. Otherwise, it's order and sweat, hoping it will get here before I leave for Atlanta on Sep. 12.

 

[urinalcakemix]

So GreenDay is better than SOAD?

Whatever kid....

Meh.

 

[AngraRULES]

Meh.

lol

 

[Barking Pumpkin]

thats too bad that you're so closed minded. over the years they've vastly improved as a band and their latest release is borderline prog.

...like Octavarium?

oooh...BURN BURN BURN



.....sorry......>_>

 

[Yngvai X]

I give my props to BOTH System of a Down AND Green Day. Green Day puts on a hell of a show live, for which I think they are to be commended. They realize that a concert is more than just about the music for most people. As for System of a Down, those are some creative sons a bitches! While I can't typically sit and listen to an entire album all the way through, a few songs here and there are refreshing.

What I wish I could see is how people on this board would react if prog/power music did get extremely popular. Right now we think it's cool when we see Nightwish being sold in Wal-Mart or Helloween videos getting played on MTV2 because they are exceptions. But what if everytime you turned on the radio they were playing Rage or Running Wild or Pink Cream 69...I think it would lose it's aura that we all appreciate.

I've noticed most underground music fans (as we are somewhat underground here) are quick to jump on Americans for "having music fed to them" or "being fairweather fans of bands", but the truth is, you WANT it to be like that. You don't want too much of our beloved prog/power in the mainstream. If other people don't like metal, so what? It's more personal like it is. EVERYONE on here has had some kind of really cool experience with these prog/power bands. They appreciate us because we take the time to SEARCH out their music and when we go to shows, we don't act crazy and mosh, but we respectfully listen (for the most part) and I think a lot of that comes from the mystique and relative obscurity of the music itself....besides, what would be gained from widespread recognition of these bands? The fact that we could get htem in concert more often? It just doesn't seem like a good trade off to me.

...okay, I'm not sure how much of that makes any sense and I'm not re-reading it...I'm going to bed now.

The funny thing is, as much as you complain about these bands having appeal because they are not popular, they're just not popular HERE. In Europe, its a completely different story. Metal in general is more popular. I wouldn't call it mainstream, but the underground is MUCH larger than it is here. Need I remind you of the "Blind Guardian Fest" that took place back in 2002? Their own 2 day festival (with bands such as Soilwork, Napalm Death, Rage, etc playing under them) in front of around 8,000 people. Pretty popular, wouldn't you say? Edguy was featured on German TV shows sponsored by McDonalds. And Nightwish pretty much is like Evanescence is here in Europe in terms of popularity. Not to mention all the summer festivals like Wacken (30,000+ people) which make Progpower look like a 200-seat bar venue. So the popularity issue shouldn't dictate how much or how little you like a band.

Although I also think its unfair to call any "metal" band mainstream. As much as I don't like metalcore or bands like Slipknot, I still wouldn't consider that mainstream despite the popularity amongst the "hot topic" crowd. If the stuff scares parents its not really mainstream

 

[dargormudshark]

A bit off topic but I felt this was relevant:
My sisters in law visited me last week, their ages are 13,15,16,18. They hung out for a few days and I used that time to try and turn them onto some good music. Well anyone that knows teens knows that I was wasting my time. Each one of them liked different types of music ranging from NIN to Slipknot to Green Day. I admit, I like some of that stuff; most of it I don't. What is sad is that they didn't make a choice to listen to that stuff; they've been force fed that stuff by the "corporate machine". These kids (kids in general) think they are being rebelious by listening to "their" music. They have absolutley no idea that they have been programmed to do so. I tried explaining to them about demographics but I might as well have talked to the wall. I hate to say it but the U.S. is turning into a cultural wasteland; all people care about is who looks good, whose dating who, or whose got the most money. Its beyond sad. Thank goodness for Progpower and the fans that keep the metal spirit alive.

Every once in a while we get fan mail from teenagers and it just blows me away that these young people listen to bands like Maiden, Priest, Edguy, Hammerall, etc. Too bad its such a minority.

Yan

I agree 100%, I respect you for saying it. I know a shit load of guys who are in bands who are afraid to say things like that for the stupidest reasons.

 

[Pellaz]

I'll add Shadows Fall to your list. Heck, those guys have pretty much brought Testament style thrash metal to the mainstream again! I don't think anyone on here would say that Shadows Fall aren't talented....I hope not anyway!

Ummm, is Shadow's Fall getting a lot of mainstream airplay and notice? I haven't heard them on radio here, but that's not surprising, since Atlanta radio really, truly SUCKS.* Even compared to smaller-market cities.

It'd be cool if they were getting some notice, though. They're not my favorite cuppa, but I like 'em fine. Plus, Brian Fair is an Ozric Tentacles fan, so he's automagically kewl in my book.





-=-=-=-
* except for WREKage, of course

 

[Jim LotFP]

This thread is based on a wrong assumption.

The question is not "Is pop starting to borrow from the prog and power scene". The answer to this is 'no'.

The real question is, and let's not limit this to prog and power metal, "Is the metal scene starting to borrow from pop?"

If metal is selling more and more and making a dent in the mainstream, the answer has to be yes.

You people really don't think mainstream success is going to come to metal all on its own, do you?

 

[Heavenly Call]

The real question is, and let's not limit this to prog and power metal, "Is the metal scene starting to borrow from pop?"

If metal is selling more and more and making a dent in the mainstream, the answer has to be yes.

You people really don't think mainstream success is going to come to metal all on its own, do you?

I've given this some thought and I'm just not buying this...can you give some examples to help me out??? It's pretty safe to say that Nightwish is enjoying more commercial success (to what extent is debatable) but what did they "borrow" from mainstream to help them?

 

[YanLeviathan]

I agree 100%, I respect you for saying it. I know a shit load of guys who are in bands who are afraid to say things like that for the stupidest reasons.

Thanks. I just say it because it truly saddens me how things work these days. It's not limited to music either; the same things happen in Hollywood. There are tons of great young writers/directors around that have brilliant ideas but they just get shot down because all the studios care about is guaranteed hits. Just look at all the crap that has been released the past few years; most of it is just re-hashed garbage. Big companies are just too scared to try new ideas.

Anyway, we have our official Avian forum up and running if any of you would like to check it out you can find at: http://www.nocturnalhorde.com/forums/viewforum.php?f=49

Yan

 

[mtlheart]

I've given this some thought and I'm just not buying this...can you give some examples to help me out??? It's pretty safe to say that Nightwish is enjoying more commercial success (to what extent is debatable) but what did they "borrow" from mainstream to help them?

Nightwish has been progressing towards a more commercial sound with each album from Oceanborn on. Not that that's necessarily a bad thing, but it's a little obvious.

 

[Barking Pumpkin]

I've given this some thought and I'm just not buying this...can you give some examples to help me out??? It's pretty safe to say that Nightwish is enjoying more commercial success (to what extent is debatable) but what did they "borrow" from mainstream to help them?

I don't really listen to Nightwish or Lacuna Coil but I'm sure they've made their music more accessible......"Heaven's A Lie" sounds as much like Evanescence as it could without being Evanescence. Some other bands are the melo-death heavy hitters, Dream Theater, and some power metal bands I've checked out who are adopting some kind of obnoxious "modern rock" power metal sound. (I couldn't name any at the moment, but I'm pretty sure they're out there.) Some of these attempts are more successful than others.......In Flames for example missed the KoRn bandwagon by several years, the thing now is metalcore.

 

[Jim LotFP]

I've given this some thought and I'm just not buying this...can you give some examples to help me out??? It's pretty safe to say that Nightwish is enjoying more commercial success (to what extent is debatable) but what did they "borrow" from mainstream to help them?

Nightwish isn't "borrowing" from mainstream, they ARE mainstream. How many gold records does a band need to have before people will acknowledge this?

Notice how many bands are now making videos? Why would that be?

Don't you notice a lot of metal becoming more standardized in format and becoming generally more pleasing to listen to?

 

[Kenneth R.]

i don't understand why so many fans fear the "mainstream". if you have a sure-handed navigator, there won't be any wrecks.

 

[Jim LotFP]

i don't understand why so many fans fear the "mainstream".

Because the mainstream machine is designed to chew up, swallow, shit, and flush everything in its path.

It leaves no survivors.

That's one hell of a price for everyone to pay for the privilege of being one of many, instead one of few, fans at concerts for a few years.

 

[TheWhisper]

If metal is selling more and more and making a dent in the mainstream, the answer has to be yes.

You people really don't think mainstream success is going to come to metal all on its own, do you?

It has before. May I site bands like Iron Maiden, Judas Priest and Metallica, who had a million seller without so much as a video. Not saying that it will be again, but it happened once. These, and other, metal bands were selling millions and selling out arenas across the US.

I'm finding some of this amusing. The talk of prog being the underground music and bands who are punk influenced, like Green Day, are in the 'mainstream'. I remeber, in the late 70's, when punk was the underground music and was a response to the corporate, mainstream music that was prog.

As to the question of people fearing the mainstream, I don't think it is so much that people fear it, as some people like to see themselves as part of the underground scene...for arrogant reasons. It gives them an air of superiority about themselves. "I don't buy into that corporate bullshit that the media force feeds the masses of sheeple". What - the - fuck - ever! These kinda people really think this makes them a more sophisticated music conisoure. It is the same in other genres, as well.

I am a fan of country music and there are those who will only listen to what is called Alt-country...artists and music outside of the Nashville circle. These people won't listen to anything that they consider mainstream, there's that word again, country music. I will admit that most of the country music I like, just as with rock/metal, is not played on radio or tv, but I'm not one, that if an artists does break through, will call them sellouts, as others do.

I know I've said this before, but, if you like something, listen to it regardless of the genre, or whether or not it is considered commercial/mainstream/corporate. I don't try to over think it, I just listen to music I like...novel idea.

 

[Barking Pumpkin]

Mainstream is simply a biproduct of a style change......usually. I could care less if John Zorn was on MTV, but I care if he's making crappy music whether he's getting on MTV doing it or not. So many bands get exposure by making a style change, usually to something negative.

Strapping Young Lad is an example of one of the few bands I really love who are getting some definite exposure at this point (which means getting the same video played every single Headbanger's Ball.......bleck).