I told James this story but I want to tell it again. Its facinating I think. I talked the guy that owns the studio next door, Trident, into buying an analog console. He was re investing into his studio and bought a Pro Tools HD3 and wanted a console too. We were convinced that stepping up from the TAC Magnum that he had to a pro console would "Make" the mixes. He bought a Neve V3 60 flying faders from the "Grand ol Opry" in Nashville actually. Really cool cause its recorded all the country greats. But anyway, nice console, well maintained,etc. Looks fantastic, huge. Compressors and gates and 4 band eq on every channel. 48k was the cost. Amazing cause it was like 250 k new back in '86. Anyway, we made some mixes on it and it was great. But then Juan started doing more mixes in "The Box". I was like "What are you doing?" And he was saying it was easier to do it in the box, automation was better, etc. And that he thought it sounded better. Im mastering next door and wasnt doing any mixes for a while so I just thought he was a moron. Well I recorded a band called Goratory over there and used the Neve eventually. I sent 16 busses out of the PT rig into the Neve. Was cool and the mix had a nice analog vibe. Ok, I was happy with it untill I got my computer re vamped over at my place and learned to run Nuendo. As time went on I did some mixes in Nuendo and really got used to doing it that way. Was irritating at first. I always mixed through consoles in the past. But Im doing death metal over here and realized how much more control I got with the workstation. And then I eventually figured out how to make it sound good too.
Ok in time my band Vile needed to record. I tracked all the drums at Trident on the Neve but then took them over to my Nuendo system and tracked the rest of the stuff at my place too. I have some nice mastering gear and 2 Calrec PQ 1081 eq/pres here as well. So the tones I was sending into Nuendo were great. Have a Crane Song STC 8 I used on bass, GML eq, etc, etc.
By the time I was done with this project, I was fully convinced that it was better to mix in the box than to use the Neve. Meanwhile Juan had tried to go back to mixing analog over at his place and kept coming to the same conclusion.
The console makes you lose fidelity. You get a mid bass bump and its overall, less accurate and less refined sounding. It does not add enough of anything to make it worth using. For tracking, yes, great. Its size impresses the clients too. But its just not worth losing fidelity, automation, recall, etc by using it for mixing.
But I do go back to the 40 Grit "heads" album we did a while back from time to time to hear what real analog sounds like. Tracked on a vintage 8058 Neve with Studer A800's. Mixed down on an SSL to modified Studer A80 1/2 inch. And man, I cant get over how glassy and pure the high end is and how 3 dimentional it sounds. Its really popping out at you.
So my conclusion is that if you have really high end analog, like this and have a simple mix, you should do it that way. But if you have to convert to analog to mix through a console, or have all analog but less quality analog, forget it. Digital is better.
Anyone else messed around with the comparisons? I know Andy has. Andy, can you tell me if Neve 8058 and Studer is better than Otari and SSL?
Or if either is better than Digital? For this kind of music of course, metal. What are your opinions of the differences in fidelity? Anyone else?
Colin
Ok in time my band Vile needed to record. I tracked all the drums at Trident on the Neve but then took them over to my Nuendo system and tracked the rest of the stuff at my place too. I have some nice mastering gear and 2 Calrec PQ 1081 eq/pres here as well. So the tones I was sending into Nuendo were great. Have a Crane Song STC 8 I used on bass, GML eq, etc, etc.
By the time I was done with this project, I was fully convinced that it was better to mix in the box than to use the Neve. Meanwhile Juan had tried to go back to mixing analog over at his place and kept coming to the same conclusion.
The console makes you lose fidelity. You get a mid bass bump and its overall, less accurate and less refined sounding. It does not add enough of anything to make it worth using. For tracking, yes, great. Its size impresses the clients too. But its just not worth losing fidelity, automation, recall, etc by using it for mixing.
But I do go back to the 40 Grit "heads" album we did a while back from time to time to hear what real analog sounds like. Tracked on a vintage 8058 Neve with Studer A800's. Mixed down on an SSL to modified Studer A80 1/2 inch. And man, I cant get over how glassy and pure the high end is and how 3 dimentional it sounds. Its really popping out at you.
So my conclusion is that if you have really high end analog, like this and have a simple mix, you should do it that way. But if you have to convert to analog to mix through a console, or have all analog but less quality analog, forget it. Digital is better.
Anyone else messed around with the comparisons? I know Andy has. Andy, can you tell me if Neve 8058 and Studer is better than Otari and SSL?
Or if either is better than Digital? For this kind of music of course, metal. What are your opinions of the differences in fidelity? Anyone else?
Colin
and whenever he can he also uses external analog effects (reverbs/EQ's..) , in combination with the automation/and some plug ins in Cubase.
