no country for old wainds
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Overrated "Classics"
- Thread starter Planetary Eulogy
- Start date
Lies and Perfidy
Gentleman of the Road
How about I shove my foot into your sphincter if you ever dare utter such heresy again?
Hmm, as long as we're starting trouble, Testament's The New Order = boring and utterly without impact. Testament is a live band.
Hmm, as long as we're starting trouble, Testament's The New Order = boring and utterly without impact. Testament is a live band.
How about Darkness Descends standing as the final product of Thrash; the crowning acheivement, the final fulfillment? I think eveything PE mentioned as why it is second tier, screams that DD went as far as the genre could go. They are second tier, but not in a negative sense, but in the positive reached the highest pinnacle of thrash sense. Id say every thrash band after this recording was thus totally derivative, and merely copying the thrash form without adding anything new to it.
anonymousnick2001
World's Greatest Vocalist
Yes Voivod sort of created their own style though; after Nothingface, I wouldnt say they were even dependent on the structure of thrash anymore.
I dont see anything special with Watchtower and Coroner, other than they were superb musicians.
I dont see anything special with Watchtower and Coroner, other than they were superb musicians.
Darth Kur
Misanthropic Naysayer
If you really think about it there isn't anything new under the sun. Everything borrows from something. Whether it be Rock N Roll borrowing from the Blues or Metal having Classical influences, Black Metal having Thrash elements, ect, ect, ad infinitum. As long as the musical piece in question is done well is all that really matters.
Jean-Pierre
Son of The Bitch
Jean-Pierre
Son of The Bitch
Today's Pick: Death Symbolic
Death is a classic example of how factors totally unrelated to music come to color judgments of a band. Chuck Schuldiner's long struggle with cancer and subsequent death has resulted in an almost hagiographical character to most discussions of Chuck and Death. As a result, objective analyses of Death's recorded output are scarce on the ground these days.
Despite the widespread myth that Death "founded" the death metal movement, in its early incarnations, the band remained essentially derivative of Possessed. Following the release of their debut Scream Bloody Gore (considered a landmark by some, but actually a second-rate copy of Seven Churches), Death suffered through several lineup changes and released two middling death metal albums in a style the scene had already passed by. Reforming with yet another line-up, Death released Human, which was easily the best work of Chuck's career (of course, the album also featured two members of Cynic, and Human was more than anything a continuation of the style developed during Cynic's demo years). However, this lineup also disintegrated as well (the pattern makes it clear that Chuck was a bit difficult to work with). The follow-up to Human, Individual Thought Patterns, was an attempt at further developing the style of its predecessor, but without Paul Masvidal to give the songwriting direction, it collapsed into an incoherent mishmash of ideas.
Death's next release was Symbolic, a record hailed as a stroke of genius by fanboys the world over. The truth, as usual, is something far different. While Symbolic does clean up the mess that was Individual Thought Patterns, it is not the unique work of brilliance that fanboys would have you believe. Rather, Symbolic is clearly the result of someone passing on Coroner albums to Chuck Schuldiner, because when you strip away all the hype, what you're left with is Mental Vortex and No More Color played in rock 'n roll idiom. Far from a creative work of genius, all Symbolic really amounts to is yet another example of Chuck Schuldiner making a living off the ideas of others.
Above and beyond a lack of any real creative vision, Symbolic suffers from other critical flaws. The mix is patented Morrisound, only more sterile and punchless than usual, its a sound so plastic that even were these songs masterpieces (which, of course, they arent), theyd still sound suspiciously like pop music. Worse, despite adopting a style that is, by its very nature, song rather than album driven, only Zero Tolerance, Crystal Mountain and Perennial Quest are strong enough to stand on their own (and the latter is marred by an irritating, Hey look how syncopated we can be, admire our skill stop-start riffing approach that foreshadows the descent into total wankery that is The Sound of Perseverence). Coupled with the fundamentally unoriginal nature of this music, the deficiencies in the mix and prevalence of filler make this a completely superfluous album that no one really needs to own.
Death is a classic example of how factors totally unrelated to music come to color judgments of a band. Chuck Schuldiner's long struggle with cancer and subsequent death has resulted in an almost hagiographical character to most discussions of Chuck and Death. As a result, objective analyses of Death's recorded output are scarce on the ground these days.
Despite the widespread myth that Death "founded" the death metal movement, in its early incarnations, the band remained essentially derivative of Possessed. Following the release of their debut Scream Bloody Gore (considered a landmark by some, but actually a second-rate copy of Seven Churches), Death suffered through several lineup changes and released two middling death metal albums in a style the scene had already passed by. Reforming with yet another line-up, Death released Human, which was easily the best work of Chuck's career (of course, the album also featured two members of Cynic, and Human was more than anything a continuation of the style developed during Cynic's demo years). However, this lineup also disintegrated as well (the pattern makes it clear that Chuck was a bit difficult to work with). The follow-up to Human, Individual Thought Patterns, was an attempt at further developing the style of its predecessor, but without Paul Masvidal to give the songwriting direction, it collapsed into an incoherent mishmash of ideas.
Death's next release was Symbolic, a record hailed as a stroke of genius by fanboys the world over. The truth, as usual, is something far different. While Symbolic does clean up the mess that was Individual Thought Patterns, it is not the unique work of brilliance that fanboys would have you believe. Rather, Symbolic is clearly the result of someone passing on Coroner albums to Chuck Schuldiner, because when you strip away all the hype, what you're left with is Mental Vortex and No More Color played in rock 'n roll idiom. Far from a creative work of genius, all Symbolic really amounts to is yet another example of Chuck Schuldiner making a living off the ideas of others.
Above and beyond a lack of any real creative vision, Symbolic suffers from other critical flaws. The mix is patented Morrisound, only more sterile and punchless than usual, its a sound so plastic that even were these songs masterpieces (which, of course, they arent), theyd still sound suspiciously like pop music. Worse, despite adopting a style that is, by its very nature, song rather than album driven, only Zero Tolerance, Crystal Mountain and Perennial Quest are strong enough to stand on their own (and the latter is marred by an irritating, Hey look how syncopated we can be, admire our skill stop-start riffing approach that foreshadows the descent into total wankery that is The Sound of Perseverence). Coupled with the fundamentally unoriginal nature of this music, the deficiencies in the mix and prevalence of filler make this a completely superfluous album that no one really needs to own.
no country for old wainds
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I think for your next one you should pick an album that even quite a high percentage of the elitist community likes. 
I actually agree with GOD on this one; Symbolic is an easy choice to bash. Now Darkness Descends still makes no sense to me; but I found your argument to be interesting and thought provoking, and thus, it elicited a big response from everyone.
Mormagil
bring back the corvee
I wouldn't call myself a Megadeth fan, but I enjoy their older stuff, and at one point I did own an inhaler and if I still wore glasses they'd be pretty thick. So you might be onto something.
DiscipleOfPlato
The Observer
To me Megadeth is something that should be stressed as overrated. 85% of their music is horrible cheesy garbage. If you're a megadeth fan you have an inhaler and wear coke bottle glasses.
no country for old wainds
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I'm a crap poster, thanks for noticing that and how worthless Megadeth are. I just come on boards and say what I really think, I'm not adding to anything.
DiscipleOfPlato
The Observer
And yes, Symbolic is an easy target, about a step up on the ladder of originality from Master of Puppets. I'd be lying if I said I didn't enjoy it though.
Life Sucks
and then you die
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