Progressive Metal That Doesn't Suck?

jonnykungfu said:
Does anyone know of any prog-metal that doesn't suck? I think the idea of prog-metal is the perfect idea, but I've never heard it actually pulled off. Dream Theater blows (with the exception of some of "Awake"), Evergrey and all those other power-prog bands are boring as shit, and Theory in Practice just sucks ass.

I like Opeth, but I don't consider them to be prog-metal in the sense that I'm referring to. I'm looking for something with strong song-writing as well as lots of instrumental interplay, time signature changes, etc. (No pure Malmstein wank-offs). I'm not looking for bland "complex" brutal death or bland early '90s fusion-death. Or Gordian Knot. I'm thinking along the lines of Zappa or Magma but in a metal sense.

Any ideas?


Hmmm..... without sounding like a complete idiot, what sucks to you, other people might like. Have you heard Dream Theater's "Images and Words" ? I am not as big on DT as many, but that release to me is far and away their best.

Another cool band is Pagans Mind. They are a combination of powermetal and prog, but for people out there that like the heavier stuff, you get a pretty fanatical drummer in the vein of Vinnie Paul from "Cowboys" era Pantera.

Vanden Plas is a great prog-metal band, but it is melodic metal even more than prog. It lacks power for some, but few will argue the quality cover to cover of the songs. If it doesn't HAVE to be heavy, this band is the shit.

Balance of Power is another one. They used to be a melodic power band, but made a line-up chage with their vocalist and their latest is pretty cool. The new singer sounds like a modern version of Geoff Tate (this is no bullshit) as many get compared to Tate, but this guy's pipes are incredible. It is probably closer to powermetal than prog, but it's tough to differentiate between the two sometimes.


Bryant
 
Holy christ. I completely forgot about this post. I never looked at it after I posted it.

Anyways, when I said that I don't like early '90s fusion metal, I'm referring to CYNIC. Cynic blows ass. Atheist is fucking excellent though.

And like I said, Malmstreen shred-fests are dull as shit, and so are Dream Theater rip-offs (as well as Dream Theater). Most of the stuff you guys recommended is just bland shred crap.

When I refer to progressive, I'm not referring to Genesis and Pink Floyd. I'm referring to music that is truly PROGRESSIVE, as in Magma, Frank Zappa, 5uu's, Thinking Plague, etc.

I need to check out some of these recommendations and get back, but if you have any new ones based on my ramblings here, tell me them.

Oh, and Devin Townsend, for the most part, is the most bland music on the face of the earth. Terria is excellent though.
 
Voyager - Element V - Australian prog metal at it's finest.

Oh and just a reply to that DT comment earlier - I love some prog metal, but I can't stand the absolute wankfest that is Dream Theater.
 
How is my Devin Townshend comment contradictory at all?

I don't like Townshend much, and also don't find him very "progressive". Just because he doesn't shred doesn't necessarily mean I like him.

I like complex instrumentation and a certain degree of "wankery", as long as it's not just senseless wankery (i.e. Dream Theater, Spiral Architect). Frank Zappa's instrumental compositions are a good example of what I'm looking for, but in a metal context. It's very complex and technical, but it's all helps to further along the piece. Listen to the Hot Rats album. You'll thank me for it. Also, Magma is extremely technically blessed, but it's all very subtle, and has a nice amount of minimalist repitition in it.

The progressive metal bands I'm into that I've heard are:

Atheist, Sigh, Fates Warning (except their latest stuff has been all crap), Opeth (to a certain extent... I like their more mellow and melodic stuff, but sometimes they just get really aimless), Meshuggah's Destroy Erase Improve, some Mike Patton projects (Tomahawk is fucking worthless though), John Zorn (not necessarily metal, but has influences), Pain of Salvation's rare moments of non-cheese (but geezus christ can they be fucking horrible when they want to be), some Arcturus is okay, but some is dreadful, Maudlin of the Well, Voivod, and a few more.

The problem here is that I'm mainly into black metal and some death or thrash when I listen to metal, but my non-metal music is almost entirely really unique, avant-garde, complex, and bizarre (5uu's, Zappa, Magma, Thinking Plague, King Crimson, Doctor Nerve, Mr. Bungle, etc.). And I'm trying to bridge the gap. The only bands that even come close to bringing me the progressive feeling of these bands are Atheist and Sigh. I want something a nice amount of chaos and heaviness, but almost complex and unique. So, I'm not looking for the latest Rush wannabe or generic Dream Theater clone, but something new. It doesnt' necessarily have to be prog-metal, but some form of metal with unique elements. I would even fit Nokturnal Mortum or Dub Buk into this category.

To the bands I've already been recommended:

Voyager - I've never heard, but I'll look them up... Are they easy to find on Soulseek? I just read a review of them and it sounds like my kinda thing.

Mekong Delta - I believe I've heard them, but I'll check them out again.

Dream Theater - I'm not trying to sound bitchy, but obviously I've heard of Dream Theater (and hate them). Please recommend something slightly underground. Dream Theater embodies everything I loathe about prog-metal to a T. I used to be a huge fan (when I used to listen to shitty music), some of their stuff is musically decent, when they're not ripping off Rush or Tool, but overall the vocals suck more than anything that ever sucked, they wank too much, and they're boring.

Pagan's Mind - generic and bland.

Vanden Plas - same thing, if I remember correctly.

Balance of Power - I don't like Geoff Tate, and so I doubt I'd like this.

Devin Townshend - really boring for the most part. Terria is melodic and good, City is decently chaotic and fun, but other than that, I don't like him.

Symphony X - one of the only Dream Theater clone type bands that I actually like, but not necessarily something I would listen to often.

Transatlantic - not really metal at all, and I hate Spock's Beard (I like the Flower Kings though, oddly enough). Decent, somewhat.

Rush - not metal, and a band I loathe for the most part. They have some decent songs, but from the start they were a Genesis rip-off (after they stopped being Led Zeppelin rip-offs), and not a really good one (Genesis was a shitty band in the first place).

Opeth - everyone's heard of Opeth. I like them somewhat. The Drapery Falls is good and I love the My Arms, Your Hearse album. Plus their ballads are great. They were the band that got me into extreme metal and for that, I'm grateful. But they're nothing brilliant.

Watchtower - I remember hating the vocals, but I'll check them out again, as I always hear great things.

Symbyosis - sounds like my kind of thing. I will download.

Sun Caged - doesn't really sound like my thing.

Illogicist - I remember them being tech-death, but I'll download again.

Mars Volta - not metal, but pretty good, if a bit "fluff". It's a good CD to listen to in a car.

Anacrusis - I've heard great things and some horrible things. I'll give it a listen.

Psychotic Waltz - I downloaded a few albums of theirs, but haven't listened yet.

Cynic - blows ass. I've never heard the demos, which I've heard were better, but all the stupid robot noises are fucking crap and the music bores me.

Ayreon - fun, but cheesy.

Threshold - not a big fan.

Arabesque - will check out.

Pain of Salvation - some really good songs, some godawfully cheesy ones. I like the Patton influence though.

Mr. Bungle - awesome band. Too odd for a lot of people, but lots of fun. Patton is great live too!

Confessor - sounds cool. I'll download it.

Zero Hour - odd that I like this band, considering I don't like Spiral Architect (I don't hate them, they're just too wanky for me... better than Dream Theater by a long shot) much. By the way, liking prog doesn't mean I have to like Dream Theater. I could kick your ass in the prog knowledge game, so fuck off.

Queensryche - fun cheese.

Arcturus - like I said before, some of it is good, but some of it is dreadful.

Frantic Bleep - will check out.

Stratovarius - I like them to a certain extent, but wouldn't consider them prog necessarily.

Gorguts - I love Gorguts.

Andromeda - crap. sorry.

Liquid Tension Experiment - really crap.

Disillusion - I'll check it out.

OSI - just as bad as newer Fates Warning. Bad nu-metal cliches, hardly any prog at all.

Textures - will check out.

Peccatum - not really prog and pretty godawful. The new album has some okay moments.

Age of Silence - will check out.

Ram-Zet - I can't get into them.

Sigh - really great.

Lykathea Aflame - not prog, but I like them.

Borknagar - good band. some of their shit is boring, but overall, I like them.

Kekal - I have their albums on my computer, but haven't given them a good hard listen yet.

Solefald - blows. The most boring music I've ever heard, possibly.

Emperor - not even slightly prog, but I like Emperor.

Winds - horrible, boring, god-awful asscrap.

Vintersorg - Decent, not as good as Borknagar.

Pestilence - I've heard some of their earlier stuff, but I'll check out their last album.

Pineapple Theif - will check out.

Pendragon - they suck. Fuck off with your Dream Theater cock-chugging.


Anyways, thanks for the recommendations, and recommend more if you can.
 
If you like Zero Hour, maybe you should check out Death Machine.

Into Eternity is nice as well.

And now for some lesser known stuff:

Infinity Minus One (needs some getting used to, but great potential)
Alkemy (very jazzy approach, I like 'em)
Alarum
Ajalon (they sound A LOT like Rush, so maybe not a good recommendation)
Maelstrom
Actual Time (instrumental)
Enditol
Ephel Duath (clearly inspired by John Zorn's Naked City)
Nought (instrumental, still don't know what to make of them)
Extol
 
John Arch - A Twist of Fate

I don't think this has been mentioned...

Other than that, why not try some classic Prog?

King Crimson - Starless and Bible Black
Comus - First Utterance
Van Der Graaf Generator - Pawn Hearts
Camel - The Snow Goose
 
Nobody has mentioned the legendary Anglagard yet? Get Hybris and Epilog. Not really heavy but some of the best prog rock albums ever and way more complex than lots of 70's band. You might be interested in Anekdoten - Nucleus, Caravan - In the Land of Grey and Pink and Mastermind - Excelsoir, too.

The Metal Major is correct, get everything he mentioned. I also second Watchtower and Mekong Delta, though its more like tech-thrash than anything progressive.

As for prog metal... the majority of bands just try to show off really. I remember Adagio - Underworld as pretty enjoyable but almost everything from the genre is garbage. Avoid Ayreon, Liquid Tension Experiment, Winds, Andromeda, Pendragon and crap like that.
 
-ALieN- said:
Accelerated Evolution was a step towards a more i guess "poppier" sound than mostly true prog sound, but it still owns nonetheless. Everything Devy has made is so amazing.. it's really probably the most emotionally heavy music i've heard.

I whole-heartedly agree, he makes brilliant music
 
Gildamere, I'll definitely check out the stuff you listed. I've heard Ephel Duath and Extol. Ephel Duath reminds me of a nu-metal version of Mahavishnu Orchestra (the latter being good, the former being horrid). I can't really get into it. Extol is pretty awful in my opinion. But I will check out the other bands.

I've never heard John Arch's solo album, but I am a fan of his, so I'll probably like it. Of course, it DOES have Mike Portney, who I can't stand.

King Crimson is great (but why recommend Starless and Bible Black, when you could recommend Red - the greatest prog-metal album ever, or Absent Lovers - the greatest live album ever?).

Van Der Graaf Generator bores me, with the exception of Pawn Hearts, which is strangely, incredibly unique, where their other albums are garbage.

Camel is decent.

Comus I've never heard.

Anglagard is pretty decent, but nothing truly special, as they're somewhat of a King Crimson rip-off. Old Anekdoten is okay, but I don't like their new albums much. Caravan is hideous in my opinion. I can't stand Canterbury prog, with the exception of National Health. Mastermind doesn't do anything for me really.

I've heard of Adagio, but never really heard it, so I'll be sure to check it out.


Now all you prog fans should go and check out Gong, Magma, and Frank Zappa. It's essential!
 
jonnykungfu said:
Voyager - I've never heard, but I'll look them up... Are they easy to find on Soulseek? I just read a review of them and it sounds like my kinda thing.
I couldn't say.

I did find it hard to find on DC++, and I was searching for quite awhile. But I didn't have as many sources back then as I do now.
 
Ved Buens Ende and Windham Hell

I cannot deal with the Watchtower vocals at all. I have not listened to their albums in ages. I would like to see them remastered, and by "remastered" I mean the same, but with a decent vocalist or no vocals at all if need be.