re-knowing The Knowing

metalprof

metalprof

Ken Luther
Mar 11, 2005
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Valparaiso, IN
faculty.valpo.edu
I hadn't listened to The Knowing for a long time, so I put in the car player for a couple of spins. Overall, it wouldn't be my favorite ND album, since only every second or third song really grabs my attention. In fact, my favorite songs on the CD are tracks 3 (Shadows of Light), 6 (In Faith), and 9 (In Memories Past). In between are a few songs with mellower, more "meditative" parts that are almost spoken word pieces (like the early part of Aura Blue). My favorite of the mellower tracks is Searching the Betrayal, and the female vox help it out a lot. (I hope I matched the song title with the song correctly!)

Having said that, the track In Memories Past is one of my favorite ND songs. That deep, brutal riff would be right at home on a Sabbath album like Master of Reality. Or maybe a Trouble CD. Just great stuff. I think it got played live the first time I ever saw ND at Chicago Powerfest in 2003.

Today's assignment is for everyone to put in In Memories Past and play it loud!

Ken
 
I have praised this album many times over the past year (as it was my first ND disc I ever got). I stopped since Larry pisses all over any praise I have ever given the album........ :lol:
 
No no, come on that's not true at all. Honestly I'm more than happy to see people praise anything we've done, we're proud of all of it really. The only time I say anything is when people get on the whole trip of "The Knowing is the best thing ND ever did" or "Why don't you sound more like The Knowing", that sort of thing. And even so, everyone is entitled to their own opinions there. We're very proud of that cd in it's own right, but we don't feel it's the ultimate thing we've ever done by any means. But I'm quite glad that people enjoy it as much as they do, it's still flattering.

"The Knowing" was written and recorded at a tough time for me, personally. I have alot of negative connotations in my mind regarding the making of that album and what was going on with my life back then. You can listen to music I wrote like "Last God" and see what a miserable son of a bitch I must've been haha But I do have some fond memories such as Eric, Mary and I sittiing in Mary's apartment and piecing together the ideas that ultimately became "In Memories Past" and having fun with it. I still love that song but the guys in the band feel that it doesn't really fit in with where we're at now so it doesn't get played anymore and I can see why. It's difficult choosing songs from "The Knowing" to be played live because so many of them just don't translate as well in the live setting.

I always felt that Mary, Eric and I should've done a stoner-doom side project thingy, in the vein of "In Memories Past", because it would've probably sounded pretty cool and been a way to get that stuff out of our systems. By and large it just didn't really fit in with the ND sound.

I think "The Knowing" was a unique album especially for it's time, and it was the cd that really got us worldwide attention, and I'm proud of that. I don't want to piss all over people's praise and affection towards that cd. But for us, when people say it's the best thing we ever did or that we should go back to sounding more like it, is like telling a writer that you liked it better when they wrote short stories in high school or telling an athlete that they were cooler when they played varsity basketball or something. What we did back then is a snapshot of where we were at during that time and at that age, and we've moved on as artists and as people, so we just can't relate to it in the same way that perhaps other people who are just the listeners can.
The listener might connect more with where we were at seven years ago than where we are now, and that's fine, but they have to understand that it's different for us and accept it.
 
Larry, thanks for writing that.......
I was just goofing around, based on your replies when we ask for songs like "Silent Tomorrow" to be performed live.

Novembers Doom definitely grows and evolves with each and every release.

Every fan has his or her favorite album / song.

As fans, I know it is easy to say, "THIS would be the perfect setlist to perform live". Though from a band's perspective, certain songs simply don't fit well with the current material. I definitely see what you mean by this.

Regardless, this album is EXTREMELY appreciated!
 
thanks for that Mission Statement Larry! ha ha ha!
J/K
I see exactly what you are saying about old material. I understand the memories tied in to the songs/timeframe. But honestly, I think you should still play songs from every album live, And I have a great example. (granted they are a huge band that has been around for ages) Iron Maiden, playing all their new material and nothing from, Iron Maiden through 7th Son. That would be horrible!!!!! And I hear they are doing something like that. When I saw them for the DOD album tour, I was bullshit because I didn't get to see any songs for Somewhere in Time! I honestly didn't give a fuck about Dance Of Death at all! Having never seen them, I wanted SIT and SSOASS!!!! So it could kinda be the same for you guys, no? other hand, It's your guys' band, and can do whatever you guys want lol!
That's the beauty of being in the band lol!
 
dan of bereavement said:
When I saw them for the DOD album tour, I was bullshit because I didn't get to see any songs for Somewhere in Time! I honestly didn't give a fuck about Dance Of Death at all! Having never seen them, I wanted SIT and SSOASS!!!!
Click to expand...

Chicago didn't get the DANCE OF DEATH Tour.
That album was great.
 
Actually, wasn't it the Dance of Death tour I saw in Tinley Park with Dio and Motorhead? That was a great show.

We do still play songs from almost every disc, except "Amid..." which is just too difficult to figure out how to make anything from that cd work in the context of the current ND set. And we still contemplate throwing in a reworked version of one of those songs too, someday.

With each new album we find it harder and harder to fit in the older material, because the honest truth is that we enjoy playing the new material much more. Of course we have to keep the audience in mind and make sure that you'll still hear "Not the Strong" or "With Rue and Fire" and so on. Ultimately though, if we're playing songs that we personally can't enjoy and get into, then that's going to come across to the crowd and that's not good. But also, the difference between a band like Maiden and us, is that they usually get around 2 hours of stage time if they want, whereas we're lucky if we get 45 minutes in most cases. The songs on "The Knowing" all average over 6 minutes in length and it's just hard finding the space to make them fit. Plus they weren't really written with the "live" perspective in mind, so when we played those songs live, they just never sounded as good as they did on the cd. So between limited stage time and the fact that alot of the material doesn't translate as well live, those songs just don't get focused on much when making set lists. However, we'll still pull out a song from "The Knowing" from time to time. The setlist for Europe is sizing up to be a pretty good representation of our catalog, I shall say no more about that.

Man I personally can't stand "Seventh Son...", either. I know it's become a favorite of alot of people over the years. I saw them on that tour and I think I fell asleep, I was wishing Megadeth (who opened) would've kept playing. Not knocking anyone's tastes, I just didn't see the infatuation with that disc. Then again I'm one of the minority who preferred the 1980-1982 era of Maiden.
 
NvmbrsDoom5 said:
Actually, wasn't it the Dance of Death tour I saw in Tinley Park with Dio and Motorhead? That was a great show.

We do still play songs from almost every disc, except "Amid..." which is just too difficult to figure out how to make anything from that cd work in the context of the current ND set. And we still contemplate throwing in a reworked version of one of those songs too, someday.

With each new album we find it harder and harder to fit in the older material, because the honest truth is that we enjoy playing the new material much more. Of course we have to keep the audience in mind and make sure that you'll still hear "Not the Strong" or "With Rue and Fire" and so on. Ultimately though, if we're playing songs that we personally can't enjoy and get into, then that's going to come across to the crowd and that's not good. But also, the difference between a band like Maiden and us, is that they usually get around 2 hours of stage time if they want, whereas we're lucky if we get 45 minutes in most cases. The songs on "The Knowing" all average over 6 minutes in length and it's just hard finding the space to make them fit. Plus they weren't really written with the "live" perspective in mind, so when we played those songs live, they just never sounded as good as they did on the cd. So between limited stage time and the fact that alot of the material doesn't translate as well live, those songs just don't get focused on much when making set lists. However, we'll still pull out a song from "The Knowing" from time to time. The setlist for Europe is sizing up to be a pretty good representation of our catalog, I shall say no more about that.

Man I personally can't stand "Seventh Son...", either. I know it's become a favorite of alot of people over the years. I saw them on that tour and I think I fell asleep, I was wishing Megadeth (who opened) would've kept playing. Not knocking anyone's tastes, I just didn't see the infatuation with that disc. Then again I'm one of the minority who preferred the 1980-1982 era of Maiden.
Click to expand...


Yeah, I fully understand what you are saying, and when it comes down to it, you should play songs you enjoy playing. and if the old stuff doesn't do it for ya's, it doesn't do it. We still play at least one song from every release we have, basically 3 songs lol, 10+ minute songs are tough. ha ha! But yeah having a 2+ hour set is a valid part of your point.

as for Seventh son, that album was awesome!!!! Not knocking the older albums or anything, I just loved some of the harmonies on that and Somewhere in Time.
 
NvmbrsDoom5 said:
"The Knowing" was written and recorded at a tough time for me, personally. I have alot of negative connotations in my mind regarding the making of that album and what was going on with my life back then.
Click to expand...
You the artists get many inspiration from those bad times. When I read Paul's lyrics like 'my bride Arline to comfort me when I am...' I think: "fuck, seems like Paul is suffering. That sucks" but the songs are fantastic !!!
Anyway I wish the best luck for you guys :), although you were converted to lazy musicians who write boring stuff :p
 
NvmbrsDoom5 said:
Actually, wasn't it the Dance of Death tour I saw in Tinley Park with Dio and Motorhead? That was a great show.
Click to expand...

That was the "Give Me Ed Til I'm Dead" tour.
It was a greatest hits tour, a couple months prior to the release of DANCE OF DEATH.
They did premiere the track "Wildest Dreams" from DANCE OF DEATH on that tour.
That was indeed a killer tour. Also, an amazing set by Dio as well (Who previously I found to be rather lackluster live).
Any set by Motorhead is amazing. They did their set total RAMONES style, straight through with very few stops.

Any other useless Maiden trivia you need to know, just ask! :headbang:
 
Septembers Marc said:
Yeah, why did Adrian Smith ever leave the band. Was it because of Steve?
Click to expand...

Not that I am aware of.
I always thought it was more of a creative differences thing, and his desire to do something different.
He did more of a hard rock band, called ASAP.

Later on, he appeared on some Dickinson solo material.

When Bruce then rejoined, he did as well.
(Ed Hunter tour).
 
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