If you have a session coming up, and the guitarist INSISTED on using his Crate Blue Voodoo halfstack... would you capture the DI to reamp it?
I'm considering it... :Smug:
I'm considering it... :Smug:
reamping behind their backs...
- Thread starter AudioPhile777
- Start date
Glenn Fricker
Very Metal &Very Bad News
Absolutely. Been there, done that. As long as you don't tell 'em, they don't know any better & they think their amp sounds great. Go with what works for the song, not with what works for the guitarist's ego. At the end of the day, the only thing that really counts is what's coming out of the speakers.
-0z-
-0z-
LSD-Studio
HCAF crusher
what OZ said!
Usually I don't act too "Your amp sucks!" but just tell them: let us record a riff thru it and thru my amps and then just decide in a blind-test what works best for your song....
so they hardly have any chance but picking the best sounding amp.
ALWAYS capture the DI!!
Usually I don't act too "Your amp sucks!" but just tell them: let us record a riff thru it and thru my amps and then just decide in a blind-test what works best for your song....
so they hardly have any chance but picking the best sounding amp.
ALWAYS capture the DI!!
everybody's x
My name is Damage
Ermz
¯\(°_o)/¯
Soundlurker
Member
- Nov 19, 2005
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Aaron Smith
Envisage Audio
Haha, before I even read your post and had just seen "reamping being their backs...", I immediately thought "YES!".
!I totally dissagree here. I would totally hat it if this was done to me. Your idea of what sound the song needs and theres may be totally different. And personally if i found out this was done to me i'd break there arms.
There amps, there sound, let them do as they wish. Its your job to do the best you can with what they give you.
There amps, there sound, let them do as they wish. Its your job to do the best you can with what they give you.
That´s absolutely right. But, since I head to learn it the hard way, I allways pick up the DI-Signal additionaly, for there´s the possibility to change the sound if it´s not possible to get a nice one with the provided equipment.
If a band or their guitardude likes a sound I don´t like... so what? It´s their songs and tunes. But if they bring some crappy stuff that will sound like shit, no matter how much tweaking you do, then I´m happy to take my DI and smoove run it through an amp that sounds better.
smy1
Member
Sorry, but I disagree. The job of the engineer/mixer/producer is to make the band sound as good as possible within the budget/timeframe that is given to you. Just because Joe Guitardude THINKS his sound is great, doesn't mean it will end up great on the recording later. Most of the time you get business *because* people like the sounds you get and it is very detrimental to your business as well as the records you produce if you give in to the people knowing less about recording than you do. Especially if you can trick them into believing that it was their "AWESOME KILLAH BRUTAL SOUND, BRAH" all along.
Also, a lot of musicians are actually happy you made stuff sound better if you tell them later on.
A little story:
In 1996 I recorded a nu-thrash band to 16track tape. Their drummer was less-than-stellar and he kept fuckin up the takes. So was everyone else, really. After two days I brought in my band's drummer and we fixed some fills that the original drummer could not play. When we told him, he was happy saying "man, everyone will think I am really cool!!"
After day 4 (out of 10) the band hadn't finished tracking ONE song completely, so the engineer and I (who basically spent the day sitting, rewinding the tape saying "once again" and then read porn-magazine articles out loud to each other until the band fucked it up again) decided to get the band drunk early in the day by telling them they are too uptight and needed to "relax by having a few drinks ... after all, you guys dont play your killer gigs sober, do you?".
From day 5, we would start recording at 10, only record one pass in the beginning and then pretend to record everything, while the band got more and more drunk. After 5 hours of pretending and reading porn magazines, we sent them home saying "AWESOME!!!! YOU RULE! THIS IS THE BEST SHIT EVAAAR!!" and bring in my drummer to completely re-record everything they played till about 7 o'clock. Once he was done, I spent the remainder of the evening re-tracking guitars and bass. We left some of the wah guitars and leads, but except for vocals, not one note on this album is played by the original band. After the album was released everyone in the local scene loved the sound and the heaviness and today the band is signed to a good indie-label and is touring a lot. They eventually became really good players, too. To this day the band doesn't know that they are not playing on the album.
As my friend Jeff "Critter" Newell always says: "The producer's job is to steer the band into a direction and make choices for them. That's easy. The hard job is making the band believe it was all their idea in the first place!!" ...
~BURNY~
Member
- Apr 20, 2005
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Well you don't have to do it behind their backs imo. Just record the crate in the best way possible and the DI signal as a backup.
Don't be afraid to discuss about it and prove you can do better with another amp if you truly think you can. In the end the guy probably wants the same thing as you. A great sound.
I know it's great fun to bash musicians. I do it all the time. Convincing someone can be great fun too and you will probably earn more respect.
Also don't be too closed minded. Not everybody wants "that sneap sound".
Don't be afraid to discuss about it and prove you can do better with another amp if you truly think you can. In the end the guy probably wants the same thing as you. A great sound.
I know it's great fun to bash musicians. I do it all the time. Convincing someone can be great fun too and you will probably earn more respect.
Also don't be too closed minded. Not everybody wants "that sneap sound".
Yeah i agree with di'ing, just incase. But only reamping if its what they want. Imagine someone like James Murphy going in with an amp a producer doesnt like, but it has the sound he is after for that recording and they totally change it? Do you think he will be happy with the end result. I dont!
~BURNY~
Member
- Apr 20, 2005
- 5,091
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I bet he'll be more than happy if the producer's name is Andy Sneap or Colin Richardson. But that's another story.
James?
smy1
Member
Totally true. A high level player with lots of recording experience will probably not work with a producer unless he has a lot of respect for his abilities and wants to work with him because of a certain sound ...
Ermz
¯\(°_o)/¯
Sorry, but I disagree. The job of the engineer/mixer/producer is to make the band sound as good as possible within the budget/timeframe that is given to you. Just because Joe Guitardude THINKS his sound is great, doesn't mean it will end up great on the recording later. Most of the time you get business *because* people like the sounds you get and it is very detrimental to your business as well as the records you produce if you give in to the people knowing less about recording than you do. Especially if you can trick them into believing that it was their "AWESOME KILLAH BRUTAL SOUND, BRAH" all along.
Also, a lot of musicians are actually happy you made stuff sound better if you tell them later on.
A little story:
In 1996 I recorded a nu-thrash band to 16track tape. Their drummer was less-than-stellar and he kept fuckin up the takes. So was everyone else, really. After two days I brought in my band's drummer and we fixed some fills that the original drummer could not play. When we told him, he was happy saying "man, everyone will think I am really cool!!"
After day 4 (out of 10) the band hadn't finished tracking ONE song completely, so the engineer and I (who basically spent the day sitting, rewinding the tape saying "once again" and then read porn-magazine articles out loud to each other until the band fucked it up again) decided to get the band drunk early in the day by telling them they are too uptight and needed to "relax by having a few drinks ... after all, you guys dont play your killer gigs sober, do you?".
From day 5, we would start recording at 10, only record one pass in the beginning and then pretend to record everything, while the band got more and more drunk. After 5 hours of pretending and reading porn magazines, we sent them home saying "AWESOME!!!! YOU RULE! THIS IS THE BEST SHIT EVAAAR!!" and bring in my drummer to completely re-record everything they played till about 7 o'clock. Once he was done, I spent the remainder of the evening re-tracking guitars and bass. We left some of the wah guitars and leads, but except for vocals, not one note on this album is played by the original band. After the album was released everyone in the local scene loved the sound and the heaviness and today the band is signed to a good indie-label and is touring a lot. They eventually became really good players, too. To this day the band doesn't know that they are not playing on the album.
As my friend Jeff "Critter" Newell always says: "The producer's job is to steer the band into a direction and make choices for them. That's easy. The hard job is making the band believe it was all their idea in the first place!!" ...
Ahahah that kicks so much ass. I think that's fullfilling the job description down to a 'T'.
discordless
More than Music, Noise
i like what neurosis said bout steve albini "we like albini , we play, he records" - aprox but that was the idea.
the thing is that if id go to a studio with a weird circuit bending amp and id record it and on the tracks it would be a crunchy crushing engl id break the legs of whoever did that haha
some dont like it "good" ,some may like a good "bad" sound
its really a subjective matter.
the thing is that if id go to a studio with a weird circuit bending amp and id record it and on the tracks it would be a crunchy crushing engl id break the legs of whoever did that haha
some dont like it "good" ,some may like a good "bad" sound
its really a subjective matter.
smy1
Member
The notion that Steve Albini does nothing to the sound of Neurosis is completely wrong. Otherwise they wouldn't book him.
That's why you *talk* about what the band WANTS in the first place and have them bring reference cds. Then you decide how to get there ...
Obivously if they told you they want to sound like Primus and you make them sound like Meshuggah, you missed your mark ...
discordless
More than Music, Noise
Seizure.
Member
hahah thats a good example indeed, but i think that you (as an engineer) can tell which artist has his own good "bad" sound and which just has an outright bugly sound hahaha..
I love reamping though, i'm at it right know, got me a old JCM800, a Framus Cobra, and a Brunetti 059 stacked up next to a marschall with V30´s and i can do what i want with them! i love reamping soooo damn much hahaha
I love reamping though, i'm at it right know, got me a old JCM800, a Framus Cobra, and a Brunetti 059 stacked up next to a marschall with V30´s and i can do what i want with them! i love reamping soooo damn much hahaha
