Separating the musician from their personal beliefs - is it possible?

[eppst1]

This is something I have struggled with for a while. With the internet the way it is, especially platforms like Facebook, you can get to know musicians a little better than you could ever before. Sometimes, you find out things that you don't agree with.
For example, my mom passed away my first week of my senior year in high school. A band I really liked just put out a new album at the same time and it really helped me get through some really difficult times.
Fast forward to recent times. The main guy (I guess you can call him that) in the band added me as a friend on FB. For me, it was a pretty exciting thing. I get to interact with someone that I admired and whose music helped me when I was younger. Well, the I started noticing some not-so-good things. His posts were *very* right wing (which alone isn't terrible - lots of people out there like that) but, started to notice a very anti-Muslim theme. Lots of links to places like Breitbart and their ilk. I confronted him on his posts and he told me I didn't know what I was talking about (I had even posted data/counter viewpoints). Eventually I had to "unfriend" him and stopped following his band on FB. Now I can't listen to his music.
Another example I can think of his Varg Vikernes and Burzum. I never go into his music but his racist viewpoints are well documented. I never got into his music, but I won't because I know what type of person he is.
Anyway - the reason for the post. Has anyone else run into situations like this before? How did you handle? Am I over reacting to the situation?

 

[Mardoch]

If I know the people making the music are shitty people it taints the music. I am unsuccessful at separating the two, and I don't think I'd want to be. Why should I fund shitty humans?

 

[CiG]

Nope never. I prefer when artists have different/interesting/alien viewpoints.
I listen to bands like Ice War or Indian Nightmare who are very anti-west and rather far-left, I listen to Fatherland or Graveland who are right-wing nationalists, I listen to Nekro Drunkz and Anal Cunt who are extremely politically incorrect/apolitical/offensive and I listen to many bands with members who are religious and I am not.

Occasionally they might say something that pisses me off but that's just a good reminder that we are all individuals with different views and part of living in the liberal west that makes it so much better imo than the rest of the world is that we aren't all of one mind, preordained by some authority, religious, political or otherwise.

In fact, the only kind of people who really bother me are people who are closed-minded and like to stay safe in their echo-chambers never hearing views that challenge them.

@eppst1 btw what was the band?

 

[Slammed]

I generally don't care about left/right stances made by musos and bands just like I don't care much about religion or satanic stances made by bands. What shits me more is when people make the assumption you don't like the music of a band/muso because of their stance on something and not because the band sucks.

 

[CiG]

What shits me more is when people make the assumption you don't like the music of a band/muso because of their stance on something and not because the band sucks.

Or the flip, people only like a band or musician because they agree with their views.

 

[eppst1]

Nope never. I prefer when artists have different/interesting/alien viewpoints.
I listen to bands like Ice War or Indian Nightmare who are very anti-west and rather far-left, I listen to Fatherland or Graveland who are right-wing nationalists, I listen to Nekro Drunkz and Anal Cunt who are extremely politically incorrect/apolitical/offensive and I listen to many bands with members who are religious and I am not.

Occasionally they might say something that pisses me off but that's just a good reminder that we are all individuals with different views and part of living in the liberal west that makes it so much better imo than the rest of the world is that we aren't all of one mind, preordained by some authority, religious, political or otherwise.

In fact, the only kind of people who really bother me are people who are closed-minded and like to stay safe in their echo-chambers never hearing views that challenge them.

@eppst1 btw what was the band?

I guess our opinions differ then. No way I could listen to someone that I know is racist, for example. I'm not saying that their views have to align perfectly with mine, but I think a line can be drawn somewhere when I will no longer support/listen to their art.

I don't want name the band, really not the point of the post.

 

[CiG]

I want to check the band out, I don't care about the point of the post, is this not a music sharing site?

Also, I don't care about racist views. There are plenty more damaging and destructive views out there, like communism and socialism, I still listen to music themed as such or played by artists who espouse such historically murderous views.

 

[Slammed]

I agree, look at all the shit that was created when bands like Morbid Angel and Deicide started singing about Satan (and they weren't the first ones to do it). One didn't have to believe in what the bands were saying to like them. I've had a MA Altars t-shirt with the "dead your god is dead" lyrics on the back since it was first released. Just because I wear it doesn't mean I live by it. Same goes for the SOD Speak English or Die shirt, although I will admit I stopped wearing that in parts of Melbourne in the 90's because of other people who couldn't separate a band t-shirt from a personal belief.

Same goes for Christian bands. I don't have to believe in the lyrics to listen to Mortification, I don't even have to have the same faith to be friends with Steve, he's a great bloke that doesn't ask for your church card before he'll talk to you. Then there is perhaps the most noted Christian metal(ish) band of all, Stryper. People don't have to be wankers to listen to them just because Michael Sweet comes off as one.

 

[Mardoch]

Nope never. I prefer when artists have different/interesting/alien viewpoints.
I listen to bands like Ice War or Indian Nightmare who are very anti-west and rather far-left, I listen to Fatherland or Graveland who are right-wing nationalists, I listen to Nekro Drunkz and Anal Cunt who are extremely politically incorrect/apolitical/offensive and I listen to many bands with members who are religious and I am not.

Occasionally they might say something that pisses me off but that's just a good reminder that we are all individuals with different views and part of living in the liberal west that makes it so much better imo than the rest of the world is that we aren't all of one mind, preordained by some authority, religious, political or otherwise.

In fact, the only kind of people who really bother me are people who are closed-minded and like to stay safe in their echo-chambers never hearing views that challenge them.

@eppst1 btw what was the band?

I definitely respect that anti-echo-chamber method you've got. For me, though, I've only got x dollars and x hours, and I'm not going to blow that allotment on people whose views I find repulsive. I listen to music I like while arguing the points with people I don't see eye to eye with, so I get my cake and eat it, too.

 

[MelbCro]

I guess our opinions differ then. No way I could listen to someone that I know is racist, for example. I'm not saying that their views have to align perfectly with mine, but I think a line can be drawn somewhere when I will no longer support/listen to their art.

I don't want name the band, really not the point of the post.

Nothing in your original post suggests racism though. You mention being anti Muslim. Islam is a race now? Given the long history of anti Christian stances and themes in metal, I think is quite hypocritical to take exception when its thrown at Islam. And also I think the fact you consider Breitbart to mean extreme political views doesn't make much sense either. Breitabrt is vanilla mainstream American conservatism.

 

[CiG]

Breitbart is extremely Trumpian, it was a much more respectable and genuinely conservative outlet when Andrew was still alive and have become noticeably much more propagandistic since Ben Shapiro quit.

That said, I still don't care and as a liberal and a atheist myself I have zero issues shitting all over Islam. Anybody that interprets such a view as racist is simply capitulating to fundamentalism, authoritarianism and regressive religious bullshit.

 

[MelbCro]

Prior to Trump putting his hand up for the Republican nomination, Shapiro was one of the people championing for Trump to run. It's only when Shapiro saw that Trump wasn't going to toe the neocon line that Shapiro had a hissy fit. What better example of the Shapiro agenda than when Trump ordered the bombing of the Syrian airbase, Shapiro basically had an orgasm and couldn't stop moaning in joy about how wonderful it was. Regardless being 'Trumpian' is mainstream conservatism in 2017, there is nothing extreme about it.

 

[CiG]

I don't remember Ben Shapiro championing for Trump, he was always a Ted Cruz supporter as far back as I remember.

Not that it matters one iota, you can support someone and then change your mind once they start opening their mouth about policies. Also I know "neocon" is a bogeyman buzzword employed to poison the well of a discussion but it means little to me.

Do you think neoconservatism is extreme?

 

[CiG]

It's only when Shapiro saw that Trump wasn't going to toe the neocon line that Shapiro had a hissy fit. What better example of the Shapiro agenda than when Trump ordered the bombing of the Syrian airbase, Shapiro basically had an orgasm and couldn't stop moaning in joy about how wonderful it was.

"Hissy fit" = refuse to support and/or willing to criticise
"Shapiro agenda" = things he openly admits to wanting from politicians, presidents and government

This is exactly why I hate partisanship in politics, nobody talks straight it is all just propaganda.

So what you're saying is, Ben Shapiro is a neocon that likes it when the president acts strong on the world stage and even though he didn't support Donald Trump for the primaries, he appreciates it when Trump does something he agrees with? Wow what a controversial psychopath.

 

[MelbCro]

I don't remember Ben Shapiro championing for Trump, he was always a Ted Cruz supporter as far back as I remember.

Not that it matters one iota, you can support someone and then change your mind once they start opening their mouth about policies. Also I know "neocon" is a bogeyman buzzword employed to poison the well of a discussion but it means little to me.

Do you think neoconservatism is extreme?

Shapiro was calling for Trump back in 2014 long before Trump announced he was running. His reasoning being the Republican Party was a mess and that they needed a big name, as well as someone with experience in the business world. Boy did he change his mind once he saw Trump in action.

Neocon isn't a bogeyman buzzword, neoconservatives refer to themselves as such. Pretty sure I didn't call them extreme, I do call them shitty and they are absolutely responsible for a lot of the problems that the western world faces.

 

[MelbCro]

"Hissy fit" = refuse to support and/or willing to criticise
"Shapiro agenda" = things he openly admits to wanting from politicians, presidents and government

This is exactly why I hate partisanship in politics, nobody talks straight it is all just propaganda.

So what you're saying is, Ben Shapiro is a neocon that likes it when the president acts strong on the world stage and even though he didn't support Donald Trump for the primaries, he appreciates it when Trump does something he agrees with? Wow what a controversial psychopath.

Who called Shapiro a controversial psychopath? You think he is above criticism?

The way he left Breitbart was absolutely a hissy fit, something which ended up with a pathetic social media war with Milo. Of course Shapiro has an agenda, every human does. And Shapiro's is for a president that will bend over for Israel and continue the stock standard military interventionist policies. That's why Shapiro is a neocon because he supports those neocon policies. Trump ran on a campaign opposed do those things, where he would pull the US back from overseas military actions, and nothing that was happening is Syria was in anyway a threat to the US.

lol this thread has already gone off the rails

 

[CiG]

Neocon isn't a bogeyman buzzword, neoconservatives refer to themselves as such.

No, most neoconservatives don't seem to call themselves such.

Shapiro was calling for Trump back in 2014 long before Trump announced he was running. His reasoning being the Republican Party was a mess and that they needed a big name, as well as someone with experience in the business world. Boy did he change his mind once he saw Trump in action.

Criticising someone for changing their mind? For no longer supporting someone they might have two years prior? Are you some kind of ideologue?

 

[eppst1]

The racism is referring to casseteisgod's post. He mentioned bands that are racist (Fatherland/Graveland).

Nothing in your original post suggests racism though. You mention being anti Muslim. Islam is a race now? Given the long history of anti Christian stances and themes in metal, I think is quite hypocritical to take exception when its thrown at Islam. And also I think the fact you consider Breitbart to mean extreme political views doesn't make much sense either. Breitabrt is vanilla mainstream American conservatism.

 

[CiG]

Great bands.

 

[eppst1]

Powermad.

How is a type of government more damaging than racism?

I want to check the band out, I don't care about the point of the post, is this not a music sharing site?

Also, I don't care about racist views. There are plenty more damaging and destructive views out there, like communism and socialism, I still listen to music themed as such or played by artists who espouse such historically murderous views.