Singing and Playing? Ugh...

[MegaMustaine]

So I've recently realized, that I needed to learn how to scream. After practicing for a few months in my car, i have decided that in the future, I want to be able to play metal and front my own band. (a la Laiho, Matt Tuck)

Anyways, I know people have asked similar things probably, but is there really any technique? Obviously I can do basically things that aren't complex, but screaming during complex breakdowns and pretty much most riff I play, really has me troubled. I'm a young dude, and with practice over the next 4 years (going to college in a year) maybe I'll get it down. But I have trouble enough getting my songs to play tightly with just guitar at my shows. Any tips for singing and playing at the same time?

 

[Metaltastic]

I have a really hard time with it too - my only advice is to just slow it down ridiculously and work up from there! Also, try and identify where the rhythms of the vocal line and guitar part sync up to use as a frame of reference

 

[beyond dead]

i found playing and singing similar to playing a drum beat (most guitarists won`t understand ) you have to stop concentrating on one thing. its also similar to riding a bike. if you think about losing balance, you will. its satisfying when you finally nail a vocal line against a riff with a different pattern.

 

[Chryst Krispies]

Practice with very easy shit first then move on.
Make sure that you know the riffs very well before attempting.

 

[ParsonsMatt]

When you first started playing guitar, it was hard because your right and left hands were doing TOTALLY DIFFERENT THINGS.

But you synced them up, and now its very easy for you to multitask.

Don't think of the vocal line as a totally separate thing, but rather something you need to sync up with the guitar.

 

[MegaMustaine]

Thanks for the advice guys. All other input would be appreciated.

 

[J the TyranT]

its all about this:

learn your riffs to the point your hands can run through that shit in their sleep.

When you're wickedly comfortable doing it... you wont have to put any real thought into what you're playing... as you'll just have it DOWN:

Ever skateboard? The first time you tried doing tricks... you could barely do it at all... after you get good, you can do tricks over railings, down staircases, whatever.... because you've got it DOWN... you're not worried about the kickflip itself.. you're worried about clearing the railing and not falling on your face.

Getting to the point where you can concentrate on something else.. because you're THAT comfortable with the primary routine.. that's what you need to get at.

Sidenote: Its much harder when the rhythms dont match up. If the riff is a staccato sort of pick in a 3/4 vibe... but you're singing to match the 4/4 drums... welcome to hell.

- J

 

[J the TyranT]

One more thing to add to my last line earlier.

You familiar with Savatage's "Edge of Thorns"?

[ame]http://youtube.com/watch?v=MWCndiZfrTc[/ame]

Not so hard to play OR sing... but singing while playing in this particular song is a pain in the ass because of the timing. The double picks between the sliding chords while singing in a non-matching rhythm... that fucks my shit up. Yet I can play and sing a fair share of Megadeth, which by all accounts SHOULD be much harder... there's no fuckin logic involved here.

 

[johnny dove]

well when i first started doing death metal vocals (about 6 years ago i think), i figured as soon as i get the riffs totally down like nobody's business then i'll be able to sing over them no prob. then i tried it and it didn't work out. the only thing i can say (and this is what i've done and it's worked) is just play the shit how it's supposed to be (like full speed) until you get it. some riffs and vocals patterns are harder to nail down and yeah it's definitely easier when they match up (which you can totally do if you're fronting your own band...) and sometimes it just seems like it's gonna be a jumbled mess. like if you happen to come up with a song, record it on your own doing everything separately, and then try to play and sing after the fact to see if you could pull it off live.

just practice until you get it.

 

[PhilR]

I briefly handled lead vox + bass in my old band. I basically had to write lyrics that fit around the rhythm of my bass parts. Being a ham-fisted bastard on the bass doesn't help either. Main reason I've never attempted backing vox in my current band is because the vocal pattern rhythms conflict with what I'm playing too damn much and I just end up getting one or the other completly wrong.

Some got it, some don't I guess.

 

[HatewerK]

I'm trying to learn to do that too, but since I'm not a singer and never was before, I tend (quite obviously) to concentrate too much on my vocals - and that's a bad thing, cause you need to be 100% relaxed both in playing and singing, to eventually put all of your concentration on the syncing of the two, rather than on the single thing.

Then again I watch Necrophagist's Muhammad and cry hot tears of FAIL

 

[cobhc]

First song(and last) I tried this with was Demon Of The Fall by Opeth, up until the first clean section, then I'm screwed, can't do growls for long enough lol. But up until then, it syncs pretty well, and that might be a good starting point.

 

[if6was9]

It's a thing i've been working on on and ff for a year or 2.

What I've found helps a ton is to know both the singing and the playing inside out. if you can hear the vocal in your head when your playing the riff, its half the battle. from there you can work on humming it and work up to full blown singing it along with the riff.

I also find it easier to do when playing along with stuff- like drums or another guitar,that kinda of thing where it forces you not to slightly change it outta time to suit where your struggling.

I still struggle with it alot- i do backing vocals and the occassional lead bit in my band and alot of times the bit goes over a different rhythm or follows a conflicting pattern, i find it especially hard when do really loud screams that take alot of concentration on their own anyway- I seem to mess up the guitar a bit more in those parts.

 

[deanbailey]

I think the best option I can think of is to tab your guitar (or bass or drum) parts in something like 'Guitar pro' or 'Powertab' then Tab out the vocal Rhythm in another track for each syllable, so just like your guitar parts, you know where on the grid the vocals need to be.
Then, like "ParsonsMatt" mentioned where you have to learn to make your right and left hand get used to working together when starting out on guitar, you need to learn to do the vocals and guitar at the same time as if learning a new instrument.
The easier you can do each individually the easier you can do both together. (guess thats a no brainer)

It takes time, but so does perfection.

 

[Bloodsoaked666]

Tons of practice!!!

I almost gave up n singing and playing as I thought I would never get it down. I just kept practicing and practicing and more practice and it was like....shit, I just sang and played the whole song.

Once you get it you will never look back!

 

[Rupturemetal]

If you already recorded the material you could play and sing along with it,kinda like singin with the radio. Play along with it and listen to how you sing it, then start singing while playing, should kind of guide you .....uuugh....Drugs are bad Mmmmmkay

 

[Metaltastic]

Here's a question for the guys who are capable of singing and playing - is it a lengthy process to be able to do it for each new song you learn/write, or is it kinda like once you are able to do it for one song, it's much easier to do it for any? Cuz I feel like syncing up the rhythms and practicing and all will work great for one song - and then you have god knows how many others to have to conquer as well!

 

[MegaMustaine]

I had a similar question. Cuz I'm constantly writing new material. If it takes me a certain time to get ONE song down with vocals, I can't imagine how I could do it for all my stuff.

 

[if6was9]

well while i haven't gotten it totally down yet i do find its getting easier for every song- the first few are definately the hardest!

 

[Deus.exe]

Here's a question for the guys who are capable of singing and playing - is it a lengthy process to be able to do it for each new song you learn/write, or is it kinda like once you are able to do it for one song, it's much easier to do it for any? Cuz I feel like syncing up the rhythms and practicing and all will work great for one song - and then you have god knows how many others to have to conquer as well!

In my experience the first couple of songs it difficult but after a while it becomes natural. Even though on a few new songs I can get a bit stumped but after a bit of practice i'm nailing it.