So america is gonna get bombed

Aggressor, Iraq is the UN's problem, I would leave it at that If I were president of the US. I would leave Saddam to his own Machinations until he did do something that was really devestating. Then I'd say, I told you so. The UN isn't going to do anything about it. You say a lot of people will die in the attack, well, more will die anyway if somebody doesn't do anything about him. I was hopping the UN would do something, but obviously, they haven't. Also, I'm not in the Military. I'll defend my home before I go protect what someone doesn't have the guts to protect.
 
Man, I see that the two novels I wrote before didn't sink in.

If there is a war in Iraq, there won't be huge losses. All this bullshit about Bush finishing his dad's war is total crap. Again, I see people speaking THEIR OPINIONS like they are FACTS. I want to know what makes you think there will be huge losses on both sides? Their army and air force is decimated, and the conflict will be less challenging than the original gulf war. I'm so fucking sick of armchair Presidents and Generals. It's fine to give your opinion, but you people are in NO POSITION WHATSOEVER to make any kind of factual statement on what you KNOW is going to happen. This is the fact of the matter: Iraq has presented a threat to the world since the gulf war, and no one has been willing to take a stand except for the US and England. Everyone has become bleeding heard liberal pacifists who are safe in their own little world and don't want to know anything outside their little bubble. Well it's time to wake the hell up.

You know alot about North Korea? Bullshit. Bullfuckingshit. I'm here, man, I'm right fucking here! I'm 60 fucking miles from North Korea, I KNOW WHAT THEY'RE CAPABLE OF! You wanna know why we don't attack North Korea? BECAUSE ALTHOUGH THE NORTH KOREANS WOULD LOSE, THEY WOULD SLAUGHTER MILLIONS OF SOUTH KOREAN CIVILIANS. NORTH KOREAN ARTILLERY WILL RAIN DOWN HELL UPON SEOUL IN A MATTER OF MINUTES, ALL THE WAY FROM THE DMZ. MILLIONS OF PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES WILL LOSE THEIR LIVES, EVEN THOUGH WE WOULD WIN THE WAR. DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA HOW MANY PIECES OF NORTH KOREAN ARTILLERY IS AT THE DMZ? THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS UPON THOUSANDS, WHICH ALL HAVE THE CAPABILITY TO REACH SEOUL AND MY BASE WHERE I'M STATIONED. Those are NOT acceptable losses. Just because someone presents a greater threat doesn't mean you go up to them and slap them in the face. You walk softly and carry a big stick. AND, the notion that Saddam Hussein doesn't present a threat to anyone is the dumbest thing I've heard in my entire life. Why don't you ask all the Kurds who are fucking dead now because he gassed them FOR HIS OWN PLEASURE if they think he presents a threat. The ones who survived and are dying every day because of bio and chemical warfare will agree as well. Why don't you ask his people that he's performing experiments on WHILE THEY ARE STILL ALIVE, THEN PERFORMING AUTOPSIES ON THEM WHILE THEY ARE ALIVE if they think he's a threat. Let me tell you something. Saddam Hussein is the Adolf Hitler of the last 30 years.

I want you to meet allied pilots patrolling the skies over Iraq, protecting the no-fly zone, getting locked up and shot at EVERY SINGLE DAY SINCE 1990. I want you to go up to them and tell them TO THEIR FACE that Iraq doesn't present a threat to anyone, preferably after a mission as soon as they touch down. When you see them step out of their cockpit white as a sheet with a brown stain in their pants and clutching a picture of their family, I want you to go up to them and tell them that. Also ask about how often they deploy there...once a year for three months at a time. Tell the American, British, and German pilots that Saddam doesn't present a threat to anyone, and that what we're doing doesn't matter. As soon as you do that, I want you to look in their eyes and see that mortal fear they felt from seeing an SA-5 SAM launch at them a few hours earlier turn into absolute rage as they punch you right in the fucking face. And they do this every day, for three months at a time, once a year, since 1990. They leave their family, knowing for a fact that they are going to be shot at by SAM sites in Iraq for three months straight. They have a bigger chance of dying than anyone else, and you THINK SADDAM DOESN'T PRESENT ANY DANGER TO ANYONE? As soon as I see Norway's F-16s leading the charge on patrolling the no fly zone, I'll shut my mouth. Until then, you should shut yours because you know nothing about this.

People who say that the US should mind it's own business are right and wrong. Right because we're all sick of playing policeman. Wrong because NO ONE ELSE WILL STEP UP AND PLAY POLICEMAN. As soon as that joke of a council called the United Nations grows some balls and sticks up for themselves, we'll happily go home. But that will never happen. So until then, we'll just keep doing everyone else's dirty work. And while we're doing that dirty work, we'll keep absorbing the spears that the world is throwing at us for the simple fact that we are American. We'll do it simply because it's the right thing to do, and someone has to do it, because no one else will. Opinions are like assholes; everyone has one, and they all stink. When I see a reply that doesn't start with, "Well, I think.....", I'll start taking some of you seriously. No one pays you to fucking think, and no one cares about your opinion. We'll continue with this long after your spit has dried off our faces. I haven't seen a compelling case against the war yet. All I've seen is people blaming Bush and blaming the military and blaming the US. No one has presented a thoughtful, compelling case against it. It's all been estimates and guesses...yeah...like you're in a position to make an educated guess on warfare. I watch the History channel too, you know, but that doesn't make me an expert. I'm an expert at this because it's my fucking job. Just because I watch The Firm, it doesn't make me a lawyer.
 
Originally posted by xenophobe


Personally, we should close the borders, FUCK "Free Trade" and let the world fend for itself WITHOUT American involvement, military support or financial aide for a few decades, but then we would be deemed uncaring and evil for that too. :guh: [/B]

Well xeno I agree with the last part of this,maybe U.S. should stop acting as the world's police,not because I hate the U.S. or anything,but just to see how the world turns out.Maybe it will improve maybe it won't. The excuse is what I don't get.As I said before,U.S. complaining about Irak having nuclear weapons is like Bill Gates complaining about people having a computer.if they created them and they have them why won't others? now every country has at least one(except latin american and african countries but that's just because there's no money for them)

On the closing the borders I have to say this: will you or any other white computer owning university going people do the jobs latins and blacks have done for years? those jobs are the base of the world's greatest economy. maybe not the gardeners or the maids but what about the people who do those jobs that everyone else refuses to do? those are a big income for the U.S. citizens and government and maybe 40 years ago african americans could do it but not anymore,they also want to go up in the social ladder,as everyone else in U.S.(I won't say America because America is a continent found in 1492 not a country created in 1779 or whatever year was that I forgot)
U.S. has a lot of compromised interests with the rest of the world and the "free trade" is what mainly supports the economy that allows you all to get online and have a job where you are not putting chips together or moping the floors in a factory.
 
I have no idea why people think it's ok for countries to have nuclear weapons, just because we have them. IT'S NOT JUST US, PEOPLE!!!!!! WHY CAN'T YOU UNDERSTAND THAT?!?!?!?!?

Russia, France, The US, and China are the countries allowed by the UN to wield nuclear weapons in war...(I think the fourth is China, but not 100% sure...that's pretty scary). In any case, there is a reason for this. None of these countries are going to use them pre-emptively...they never have and never will. Countries like Iraq and North Korea, however, WILL. THAT is why they cannot have those weapons. Do you actually think that the United States is going to up and nuke a country because we feel like it? If you do, you are either paranoid or uneducated. The argument that "Well the UNITED STATES HAS WMD!!!!!!! WHY CAN'T WE??" is ridiculous. It sounds downright childish. Ask yourself this: what do these countries need nuclear weapons for? What does Iraq need nuclear weapons for? What does North Korea need nuclear weapons for? Protection? FROM WHOM?!?!?!?! The fact of the matter is, that the United States is like a hitman...if you see us knocking on your door, you've done something really bad, and you are going to be punished. We don't topple governments in our spare time. Another thing, all these people from the Eastern Hemisphere are chucking spears at us and calling us names and just spreading flat out LIES about the United States. HAVE YOU EVER BEEN TO THE UNITED STATES? DO YOU KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT THE UNITED STATES? BECAUSE I'VE PROBABLY BEEN TO ALOT OF YOUR COUNTRIES, AND I KNOW FIRST HAND ABOUT YOUR COUNTRY.

Now before we get into another pissing match, I think I'll end it right here. It just pisses me off that SO MANY PEOPLE are so blind and so ignorant to the blatant facts, and I'm talking about AMERICANS! I have a little more understanding from other countries' citizens...they don't know that much about our country aside from the papers and news, unless they've lived here. I see Americans spreading bald-faced lies every day about us, and I see even more people rallying behind them, just like sheep. They're all a bunch of sheep, and they just want to fall in behind the leader. Think for yourselves and draw your own conclusions based on EXPERIENCE, NOT WHAT YOU HEAR. Idiots.
 
I just think it's a huge contradiction to talk about how the american government fights for freedom of speech and so on and then bash the "tree-hugging hippies" for their anti american sentiment and tell them to shut up.

And thrashmetal78, you speak like if the american government isn't getting anything out of this or any other war it has waged, they're not going to war because they want to make the world a better place, if they have attracted the hatred of so many people around the world it's because they just do what's good for them, ok they can because they're the most powerful country right now, but don't expect all the people to celebrate your fucking wars and tell you everything's ok, you think you know so much more than everybody here just because you're in the army? what are you, some lowly lieutenant or something? because someone of a higher rank who would truly know about things wouldn't bother to write in this forum.
 
Actually I'm in the Air Force...and I wish I were an officer, but that requires a Bachelor's Degree and that's what I'm working on right now. Yeah, I'm enlisted, a Non-Commissioned Officer, SSgt. to be exact. I control aircraft through radar and radios, and fly with the fighters on occasion. I'm no peon, but I'm definitely not a policy maker. I just do what I'm told and relay those orders to people underneath me. I never led anyone to believe that I know everything that's going to happen, because I don't. No one knows but the bigwigs in Washington. What I do know, however, is that there is a lot more to this than you think, and a lot more to it than the media is showing. THAT was my point. Also, a Lieutenant is an officer, and higher ranking than me. However, lieutenants are very inexperienced, and rely on their NCOs for guidance and experience. A lieutenant is just a brand new officer, and doesn't know any more than an airman about active duty air force, until he gets more experience. Being higher in rank doesn't mean you know more. Experience means you know more. Still, I'm working on my degree so I can go to OTS and become an officer. See, there's a catch though. My job was originally an officer's job, released to the enlisted corps in '92, because it was found that we could do the job better than the officers, since they had more Battle Management skills they needed to hone. In short, I'm doing the exact job of an officer, and I'm doing it better. Not that they did poor work, far from it. It's like this...the enlisted corps focuses on the job at hand, and the productivity of that. Making rank will fall into place. The officer corps, however, is much more political. It's all about where you're stationed, what you're in charge of, and frankly, who likes you. An officer is going do his best in anything he/she does...however, they won't be doing that forever. They move to more supervisory positions as time goes on, and focus less on controlling. Enlisted are just the opposite...we become experts in our one task, rather than a jack-of-all-trades. Sure, I'm no big deal dude. I'm just a SSgt. in the Air Force, but I'm supporting the officers appointed above me, and they (hopefully) are supporting me as well. We're AWACS on the ground, pretty much, and we basically tell the fighters where to go, where the bad guys are, and what they're doing in the air. We then commit them to those enemy fighters and blow them out of the sky. That's my job, to make sure missiles are fired at the right targets and that bombs make their targets as well.

I write in this forum because I dig it, not because I want to throw my weight around. The point I'm making is that I know what's going on in the military and around the world, because I've been there, rather than some yahoo living in his parents' basement typing on a computer about how he knows what's really going to happen. That's all. I can't predict SHIT. I know only what's released to me, and truthfully I don't know a fucking thing about what's going to happen in Iraq, whether we attack or not. I just don't know. I hope we don't, and truthfully, I feel that we are going about this a little too fast. I'm a firm believer in getting backup, and although we've got backup from everyone but Germany and France, I still think we need them on board...as bad as I hate to admit it. I think we should exhaust every measure so that the world knows beyond a shadow of a doubt that we are right. We know we're right because we know specifics that others do not...however, the public doesn't know that. I feel that it should be one of our priorities to collect as much incriminating evidence as possible, so that we can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt what has to be done.

I do want to clear one thing up, however. I don't want people to shut up. I don't mind hearing what someone has to say, because that's what I'm over here for. If someone has a case against the war, I would like it to be a clear, concise, and well thought out argument...not "FUCK BUSH, HE'S A WARMONGER!!!", which is exactly what's happening. If you want to be taken seriously, you have to come at me with more facts and less attitude. I'm sure I've given attitude at one time or another, and that's my downfall. However, it angers me to the point of meltdown when I see people taking all this for granted, and not doing anything about it. Also, if you would read my other posts, you would see that I said, and I quote ...."I'm not about to sit here and say that the United States is going to pour billions into deploying to the Great Sandbox in preparation for a possible war, WHICH IS NOT CERTAIN, and not get some sort of reparations to offset the cost."...end quote. I understand why people don't like America...I just don't understand why they choose to blame everyone under the sun. America is a far cry from the perfect country...if anything, they are only in the top five in the world. I believe Norway was voted the best country to live a few years ago. America is full of corruption, evil, and hatred....JUST LIKE EVERY OTHER COUNTRY OUT THERE. But do you know why all those other countries don't get any publicity? Because we are the big kid on the block. With anything, the bigger an entity you are, the bigger a target you become for criticism. You know why you hate us? Because you can. Because you know that talking shit about America isn't going to start any kind of war. We take the moral high ground, and our country is the type of country where you can be a citizen of America, hate the country, burn the flag, spit on the people who defend it, and still retain all the rights of a person who loves everything about it. That's why our country is so wonderful. Why don't you go to Iraq and talk shit about Saddam Hussein? In less than a minute you'll get snatched up and your tongue will be cut out. This is why I don't mind hearing Americans talk shit. I mean, it hurts my feelings, and it hurts me really deep inside to know that my own people despise me, but they are free to feel that way, and I will continue to fight any country who challenges that right. I might dislike the people who mistreat us, but I'll never waver in defending that freedom. That's the difference between you and me.

Being a free country doesn't mean that you can say anything you want without any repercussions. You find it ironic that we fight for free speech and then get pissed off about what we hear. That's the dumbest thing I've ever heard in my entire life. That's exactly what free speech is. You don't HAVE to agree with anything if you don't want to. BUT YOU HAVE THE RIGHT TO SAY WHAT YOU FEEL. I can tell a bleeding heart liberal fuckstain to shut the fuck up if I want to because he pisses me off. That's my right, and it's also his right to say something that pisses me off. THAT'S FREE SPEECH. No one ever said anything about you had to agree on the issue. Duh. Moron.

I thought that maybe the forum would appreciate a fresh outlook on things, someone from the inside who has experienced all of this first hand. I see that I have offended your sensibilities, and although I am sorry to offend you, tough shit. Suck it up. Deal with it.
 
i cant be arsed to read all this shit and dont even bother replying to me because i cant be fucked to read it...because to be honest i couldnt give a flying fuck if there was a war or not. Its all ive been hearing about recently and its starting to get annoying.....but...

There is a world outside america...
 
I just say, fuck the world. We gave them the internet so they can voice their stupid opinions.

Manuel, what do you want, US involvement or none?

And fuck you for implying that I'm some caucasian white collar worker. Are you some brown lettuce picking drug dealer? :mad:
 
I want to see how the world works out without involvement from anyone.

well, sorry for implying that but I think closing the borders will do less good to U.S. than people think
 
Actually, it'll end all the trade imalances... the US produces more goods than it can manufacture... So close the borders, import only what the US can produce, more money here, our quality of living goes up, while the economies who produce a large portion of goods for US consumers sink. Fuck them, but we'll get shit for that too.
 
Well I gotta accept that without those goods the other countries would go to hell really quick, but what about oil? Venezuela and Mexico have the greatest resources in America for it and provide a lot for the U.S.
In exchange Mexico buys almost everything from the U.S.,which sucks because there are enough resources here for producing but our governments suck even more than Bush
hehe
 
Screw the other countries. Close the borders, free trade is not good for the quality of living here. I personally could care less how less developed nations would do without our billions of dollars in governemnt and donated aide.

All these other European countries would be left to support all the world for a while, and see how much it really stinks to have to do it, but you know what, most of them don't give a shit either, and just want to Blame America for whatever....

Some people just need to talk shit without backing it up, and most of the people whining are from countries that do little or nothing positive in this world.
 
Well I can't agree with the fuck other countries,I live in another country
I don't have a problem with U.S. spending their money on other countries,because that also improves their economy,but I would like to see how the world turns out without a police,every country trying to solve their problems on their own.The UN is supposedly there for that
 
Well, everyone knows the UN has no real power or authority without the US. Sad but true.

Personally, I don't want to see anything bad happen to other countries, but if everyone wants us to stop policing the world, let them do it. They'll realize that SOMEONE will have to, and after billions are spent by them, they'd regret having the posistion against us that they do now.
 
Neither do I.
I don't want to see the US bombed because I have meet some pretty cool people there and I know the sterotype of all of them not giving a shit about anything but themselves is a lie.
Sad but true as you said,the world seems to need policemen
 
But if we close the borders, with no free trade, Gap and Abercrombie will have to pay tax on their clothes so they will decide to pay their slaves less than 11 cents per hour. America is really fucked up. Tony Blair and Vicente Fox are on par with Bush. Tony Blair kisses Bush's ass and Vicente Fox is just a complete idiot.

Steve
 
I don't have a problem with U.S. spending their money on other countries,because that also improves their economy,but I would like to see how the world turns out without a police,every country trying to solve their problems on their own.The UN is supposedly there for that

Some one on the street told me that the US was the UN and the funny thing is I believed him. The UN needs to take care of their shit and let the president deal with the domestic policies.