The Apostle In Triumph - Meaning of the Song

Wow, it really does sound like "so Judah fucked it up", lol. I dont hear the "in solitude I wander" at all. To worstcase, dont take everyones bad attitudes personally, this place is full of holier than thou assholes. Just shrug it off.
 
lol, the mind is a funny thing. I've always heard the whisper as 'in solitude I wander' cos it says so in the Orchid Booklet. So that is what he's saying. But when you concentrate on 'So Judah fucked it up' it sounds exactly like that's what he's saying hehe.

Orchid and Morningrise lyrics have always been a mystery to me.
 
100% percent it's In solitude i wander...
first of all, the whole song is told in first person("I am" mode)
and there's no point in telling something like, so Judah fucked it up...
listen carefully and you'll notice the "t" in "solitude"
anyways, the song is about the torment that the Christians and the apostles have suffered from the romans and saying that despite all the pain, they have prevailed
that's only my opinion...
 
CUZ IT DOEN"T SAY NOTHING IN THE LYRICS RETARD!!

Um, yeah, actually it does. Go to the Opeth page, click on discography, then Orchid, and finally The Apostle In Triumph. A new window will open with the lyrics. "In solitude I wander" is the first line of the song.

Case closed. Everyone kiss and make up. Cuh-lose The-red.
 
seems like el_Mariachi got it as the only one.. I also want to hear your opinions about the meaning, not only about that one line though thats the most interesting lyrical part of the song

anyways, the song is about the torment that the Christians and the apostles have suffered from the romans and saying that despite all the pain, they have prevailed
that's only my opinion...

Well if it really is about the Christians etc then my interpretation of the first line would add up, huh?

And btw, do you always believe into what a lyric page says? I can understand that you do most times, but in this case I think you should hear instead of read..

EDIT: IMHO This case is not closed in any way.. I wouldn't have a problem with you saying so if you was a moderator/admin
 
And btw, do you always believe into what a lyric page says? I can understand that you do most times, but in this case I think you should hear instead of read..

No? Why would some lyric should be interpreted differently from what the booklet says? There are cases that lyrics can (with intention) mean more things (phonetically), but 'so Judah fucked it up' is just, well, no. Although, I must say it does sound like it if you listen for it, had me smile.

For shits and giggles, just look at this thread, you'll see what happens to song meanings if you listen instead of read.
 
seems like el_Mariachi got it as the only one.. I also want to hear your opinions about the meaning, not only about that one line though thats the most interesting lyrical part of the song

Well if it really is about the Christians etc then my interpretation of the first line would add up, huh?

And btw, do you always believe into what a lyric page says? I can understand that you do most times, but in this case I think you should hear instead of read..

EDIT: IMHO This case is not closed in any way.. I wouldn't have a problem with you saying so if you was a moderator/admin

Jesus Christ you fail. Read the goddamn lyrics and then kill yourself. :saint:
 
this is kind of an interesting thread, but i seriously doubt it has anything to do with christianity, seeing as how they arent christian. they claim to be athiests, if anything. so i think its purely metaphorical.
 
Judah? Really? In the grand scheme of the Bible, he's sort of a minor character and rather beyond reproach, iyam. http://www.bartleby.com/65/ju/Judah.html

Obviously, the OP is thinking of Judas, as mentioned earlier in this thread. (Judas, incidentally, didn't fuck it up, afaic. He kind of made the made the whole resurrection possible and then is condemned to eternity in hell... sounds like a heck of a sacrifice iyam.)

Sometimes, you can interpret open-ended lyrics to mean a lot of things. But this goes beyond interpretation into making something mean something it doesn't. No matter how much it may SEEM like it's "So Judah fucked it up", it isn't. And even pondering that it COULD be is a serious waste of energy. Like trying to interpret The Moor as a story about a moorish man. Bad analysis. I think a lot of teachers get it wrong when they tell their students that they can interpret something however they want to. No you can't. Or at least you can't and have a meaningful discussion about it.

So it's not about Judah (or Judas, for that matter). What is it about? I haven't seen any really good discussion of that in this thread.

Oh yeah, it's not werewolves either....

I think the key to understanding is making sense of the lines:

"My spirit is hidden in the form of wisdom carved on a black stone"


You know, I'm thinking about an interview with Mikael where he talked about his early lyrics, and said that he basically tried to come up with artsy sounding stuff... Can't find it anywhere. I think he may have prefaced "Under the Weeping Moon" with that when I saw them last. Can't remember, though. Anyone else remember what I'm thinking about? I think it's a BWP-era interview...
 
@ soundave: Ok, I finally give up, I dont know too much about the bible.

So if the others migh understand this now: It is over with this line, tell me the meaning! I'm really tired of this..

Imo many lines of that song are very hard to understand if you dont know the real meaning, so I thought that only the mentioning of Judah (judas, whatever), no matter in which cause, made everything more religious. Whatever..

Well I'd like to see a discussion about the meaning too, but it seems like it is not possible to have one here. I have about 20 posts and realize that more than 50% of the members cant discuss anything.. just leaving their senseless 1-line-post in every thread to get more posts.. that's just sad
 
you are kind of right in both aspects.. it depends on what I want to hear when it reaches to that whisper :err:

mhm.. I dont know but maybe it is just meant to be symbolic..


-> explains how you got about 4000 posts

Mikael doesn't swear in any of his Opeth lyrics. period. its not poetic at all, neither is "So Judah fucked it up" how is that poetic in any way at all?

@ soundave: Ok, I finally give up, I dont know too much about the bible.

So if the others migh understand this now: It is over with this line, tell me the meaning! I'm really tired of this..

Imo many lines of that song are very hard to understand if you dont know the real meaning, so I thought that only the mentioning of Judah (judas, whatever), no matter in which cause, made everything more religious. Whatever..

Well I'd like to see a discussion about the meaning too, but it seems like it is not possible to have one here. I have about 20 posts and realize that more than 50% of the members cant discuss anything.. just leaving their senseless 1-line-post in every thread to get more posts.. that's just sad

the 1-line posts are because of retards like you who don't do any research, and don't read the lyrics, and just listen and hear some horrible random shit like "So Judah fucked it up" and say that its poetic.
 
In solitude I wander....
Through the vast enchanted forest
The surrounding skies are one
Torn apart by the phenomenon of lightning
Rain is pouring down my (now) shivering shoulders
In the rain my tears are forever lost

The main character is using the rain to cover his tears. Since he is obviously crying about something.

The darkened oaks are my only shelter
Red leaves are blown by the wind
An ebony raven now catches my eye
Sitting in calmness
Before spreading his black wings
Reaching for the skies

Oak, is said to be the first tree created by God, and symbolizes protection. But, these oaks are, "darkened," and of course darkness symbolizes evil, or concealment. I am not sure if, "darkened," is an additional adjective to show that the protagonist is hiding, or that he his hiding because of something evil he has committed. "Red leaves," could just be the leaves of the oaks falling, or could symbolize something foreign. It's not really the common leaf color. An "ebony raven," could either represent death and darkness, or on the contrary, intelligence and ingenuity.



In this forest
Where wolves cry their agony unto the moon
My spirit is hidden
In the form of wisdom
carved on a black stone
The only way to follow

This part confuses me. My guess it that the protagonist is mimicking the raven's intelligence. For example, "My spirit his hidden, in the form of wisdom." and that he must follow it's lead in intelligence, "The Only way to follow."


Open your soul
Redeem, I am immortal

After self realization, the character finds his soul once again, and believes he is now unstoppable.

Blinded by a light
My soul is held up in glory
I engulf the skies
The apostle in triumph

I think it's just more of a description of the character finding his soul

Through the eternal flame I travel
As the rain keeps falling....

A "flame," symbolizes rebirth and purification. In which the main character just had. And this flame is, "eternal," meaning it has no ending, it will last forever.

Overall, I believe the song is about one of the apostles who has lost his way (emotionally, not physically) after making a mistake. He hides until he sees a raven. This raven cleanses him from what he has done, and this opens up his soul. The apostle now knows who he is once again, and he feels triumphant because of it. Perhaps the raven is a metaphor for God?

That's my two cents on it. Hopefully some of the meaning is correct. I'm sure there are parts I completely missed, but I was in a hurry.
 
That's pretty good, Pavelent. I like that you've analyzed what's there, and not what you bring to the song.

Here's some thoughts I've had recently about it (this has me listening to Orchid again, and though I shouldn't need an excuse...)

In solitude I wander....
Through the vast enchanted forest
The surrounding skies are one
Torn apart by the phenomenon of lightning
Rain is pouring down my (now) shivering shoulders
In the rain my tears are forever lost

Okay, not much to add except that there might be a subtle nod to Whitesnake here... whether Mikael meant to or not, knowing that he's a Coverdale fanboy, he may have had in the back of his mind, the lyric : "No one ever sees your tears/ When you're crying in the rain". I'm sure he didn't mean it, but I had to point that out.

Another thing to note is that it's an "enchanted" forest. A place of magic...

The darkened oaks are my only shelter
Red leaves are blown by the wind
An ebony raven now catches my eye
Sitting in calmness
Before spreading his black wings
Reaching for the skies

The oaks are darkened by the storm, of course. But, I like the double-meaning here, that only darkened oaks can provide shelter.

Ravens are portentous birds, no matter how you look at it. In some cultures they are a good omen, in some, bad. I think, given Mikael's tastes, he's going for the darker version. The kind that Poe wrote about, right? It quoth Nevermore. And what was the Raven speaking of? Among other things, a lost love. Death. A chance at reunion with the dearly departed Lenore. I think this may be a sort of intertextual symbol here. Ravens have become harbingers of doom, and betwixt and between life and death. Again, largely thanks to Poe.

In this forest
Where wolves cry their agony unto the moon
My spirit is hidden
In the form of wisdom
carved on a black stone
The only way to follow

A wolf's cry, to me, is one of the great sounds of loneliness and sorrow. It's something I've used to manipulate viewers in film sound design.

I agree that this next part is where the lyrics take a turn. We go beyond setting the stage. It's a great line, but I admit to not really getting it. I almost believe that he's either talking about the epitaph on a gravestone, or some sort of spell etched onto a stone. I'd like to go with the former, because I think it makes more sense. It reminds me of Poe's "Ulalume", actually, now that I think of it.

Open your soul
Redeem, I am immortal

Is this the aforementioned epitaph?

From here on, I don't have much to add to what Pavelent said, except that I think this involves a reunion with a departed loved one.

Incidentally, an apostle is also a messenger, outside of the religious connotation of the word.

Anyone else care to take a stab at this?