The California Gov. Race

[AjDeath]

Gory Elephant- it is so sad that you have been blinded by your conservativism. You have lost touch with the facts. Yet, on many topics in principle, I very much agree with you- I do not support affirmative action, nor many of our failed social programs, nor do I think most of our present social programs have any positive effect on the future or even the present( although health care seems to me to be a right all americans shiuld have if we are going to live under this tyrannical, money hungry, murderous state, they at least ought to keep us alive)

Many democrats supported the war, and very few raised a big stink. And just what may I ask has the war brought us? Nothing but more military spending, and big reconstruction contracts that help out the ever so greedy defense contract industry, the oil industry , and haliburton.

The Clinton administration with democratic support did the most to curtail welfare spending- and put strict limits on welfare- than any other american president.

Affirmative action was upheld by a conservative supreme court.

And the wealth distribution your punk president W. put in place- gave more money back to the wealthy- at the expense of our growing national debt.

I believe what AJ Death is trying to explain is that both political groups are guilty of the same idolarity- worshipping money and pol power- and doing little at all to help the citizens- nor to fix a gov in which serious cracks are starting to appear. Both groups are guilty- and part of the problem. It is obvious that neither group wants to fix anything they are responsible for- instead they would rather hurl pointless blame at the other party for the problem- rather than address the real problem- a broken political system.

Thank for eloquently stating something I do not have the patience to explain to most Americans anymore, they won't listen, the daily diet of prime time news is all they here, anyone know the lyrics to Transfixion by Meshuggah? What a parable for America these lyrics have become, "STARE BLIND!" Americans go right on believing that our Gov't is doing all it can for us and our rights get fucking ass fucked. In the packaging to Nevermores Politics of Ecstasy, it says, "Wake up, your rights are gone." More truer words I have not seen or heard spoken.. And these petty squables about money and social non-solutions our only doing one damn thing, making the system A LOT of money, and keeping power in the hands of the greed rapists, how else can you explain Strom Thurmond being a senator for his ENTIRE life!?

DO YOU WANNA KNOW THE REAL ISSUES?

Issue #1-Why did George W. sigh a Presidential Directive telling the FBI and the CIA to back off of Al Queda and Bin Laden only three months before 9-11? Pretty fucking interesting if you ask me, There is actually a class action lawsuit being filed by some of the FBI and CIA agents who got fired because they did not.

Issue #2- Can you guess which two families own one of the largest defense contractors in the world, (forget the name but I will find it)?

One family is the Bush's, the other is the Bin Laden's. IS this an important issue?

Issue#3-The PAtriot act, why was congress not allowed to view this law before voting on it? Have you READ it? No more do the FBI and CIA have to have a warrant to search your house, they don't even have to tell you, they go in, take your personal pessesions and not tell you at all, and then they can arrest you without telling you what for, the susnet clause excludes terrorist suspicions, so if you are suspected of terrorism at any time, evidence maybe used at anytime, no matter if it is 40 years down the road, pretty useful to Americans eh? Most of the congress men and women saw this vile piece of trash afterwards and could'nt believe the blatant rape and pillage of our constitution.

Issue#4- The TIPPS program, WELCOME TO 1984! What a huge fucking help for us, the gov't can know exactly what we are doing, then can arrest us with the Patriot Act, ha ha, let's all have fun!


And where is the news information on all of this, NOWHERE. WAKE UP< YOUR FREEDOM IS GONE!

(edit) Sorry for the grammatical errors, I was typing extremely fast.

 

[Gory Elephant]

Thank for eloquently stating something I do not have the patience to explain to most Americans anymore, they won't listen, the daily diet of prime time news is all they here, anyone know the lyrics to Transfixion by Meshuggah? What a parable for America these lyrics have become, "STARE BLIND!" Americans go right on believing that our Gov't is doing all it can for us and our rights get fucking ass fucked. In the packaging to Nevermores Politics of Ecstasy, it says, "Wake up, your rights are gone." More truer words I have not seen or heard spoken.. And these petty squables about money and social non-solutions our only doing one damn thing, making the system A LOT of money, and keeping power in the hands of the greed rapists, how else can you explain Strom Thurmond being a senator for his ENTIRE life!?

DO YOU WANNA KNOW THE REAL ISSUES?

Issue #1-Why did George W. sigh a Presidential Directive telling the FBI and the CIA to back off of Al Queda and Bin Laden only three months before 9-11? Pretty fucking interesting if you ask me, There is actually a class action lawsuit being filed by some of the FBI and CIA agents who got fired because they did not.

Issue #2- Can you guess which two families own one of the largest defense contractors in the world, (forget the name but I will find it)?

One family is the Bush's, the other is the Bin Laden's. IS this an important issue?

Issue#3-The PAtriot act, why was congress not allowed to view this law before voting on it? Have you READ it? No more do the FBI and CIA have to have a warrant to search your house, they don't even have to tell you, they go in, take your personal pessesions and not tell you at all, and then they can arrest you without telling you what for, the susnet clause excludes terrorist suspicions, so if you are suspected of terrorism at any time, evidence maybe used at anytime, no matter if it is 40 years down the road, pretty useful to Americans eh? Most of the congress men and women saw this vile piece of trash afterwards and could'nt believe the blatant rape and pillage of our constitution.

Issue#4- The TIPPS program, WELCOME TO 1984! What a huge fucking help for us, the gov't can know exactly what we are doing, then can arrest us with the Patriot Act, ha ha, let's all have fun!


And where is the news information on all of this, NOWHERE. WAKE UP< YOUR FREEDOM IS GONE!

Bah, another bitter conspiracy theorist.

ISSUE #1 - Give me a fucking break. What does your assertion actually mean? Do you suggest that Bush knew it was going to happen? And ALLOWED it to happen? Be serious. I am so tired of listening to liberals accusingly ask "What did Bush know?" What difference does it make what Bush knew? What if he KNEW, I mean really KNEW, that 19 muslim fanatics were going to do what theydid. What could he really have done? Can you imagine the liberal uproar if he issued a directive that no muslims can get on planes??? Hell, they are killing him NOW, with every single move he makes they resist and fight it. Even AFTER thousands were killed.

ISSUE #2 - So fucking what? Are you telling me that Bush is the first politician with ties to a big business? Whatever.

ISSUE #3 - For those of you who want an intelligent assessment of what the Patriot Act REALLY means to the average citizen, instead of hysterical denunciations by whining liberals, see the story at:

http://www.city-journal.org/html/13_3_straight_talk.html

ISSUE #4 - not familiar with this one!!

 

[speed]

You know the tragedy of your beliefs GoryElephant is that you are willing to become a subservient slave to the state, in exchange for what you think is more security. No, you are wrong on the Patriot Act, every freedom taken away by the state for security leads us further and further down the path of communism and fascism- of Caesarism- of a politcal state enslaving all of its citizens to make all seem free. If we are all enslaved- we are all free, is the philosophy you seem to be pining for.

Shame on you- you should not consider yourself a conservative. A conservative is one who believe the state should not involve itself too directly in the affairs of its citizens- conservatives used to be pacifists as well-Goldwater, Dewey et. You however wish for more governmental power in the Patriot Act. You support a war, created with no facts- and constantly being distorted by conservative propaganda( a solider is dying every day- they have footage ususally but we the american people never see this footage- I can if I watch German or British stations- nor do we see the many riots, and shootings in Iraq- all becuase of propaganda).

When did conservatism become in favor of big gov, of restrictive freedom reducing measures, of war mongering? It sounds as if its on the way to Nazism.

Shame on you and your party for destroying any faith I can ever have in our pol system.

 

[speed]

To all the non americans out there. Gory Elephant is an excellent example of the common patriotic American of today. Beware.

 

[AjDeath]

@GloryElephant-Thank you for contering my points with NOTHING! Ignoring something remotely uncomfortable or because you wish it not to be is a completely human thing to do. You give no pertinent rebuttals, just nothing, The Bush's and the Bin Laden's own A DEFENSE CONTRACT COMPANY, are you so completely blind as to ignore the implications of this! Oh, wait, I am just a conspricy theorist, I love how you explain all of this away by saying I am a Liberal. Well, surprise, Iam not, I am MY OWN FUCKING MAN! IMO the whole scam of our gov't should be wiped off the chalk board. Here is a quote for you, "When oppression still exists, none can be free." Exept oppression isn't about the color of your skin or your religion anymore, it is about those in power who HAVE the money and want to keep it that way, and No! I can not come up with a better system, i am simply stating the current system is slowly killing all of it's serfs.

 

[Gory Elephant]

To all the non americans out there. Gory Elephant is an excellent example of the common patriotic American of today. Beware.

Dude, what was that shot for? I thought I responded to your email respectfully.

 

[Gory Elephant]

You know the tragedy of your beliefs GoryElephant is that you are willing to become a subservient slave to the state, in exchange for what you think is more security. No, you are wrong on the Patriot Act, every freedom taken away by the state for security leads us further and further down the path of communism and fascism- of Caesarism- of a politcal state enslaving all of its citizens to make all seem free. If we are all enslaved- we are all free, is the philosophy you seem to be pining for.

Shame on you- you should not consider yourself a conservative. A conservative is one who believe the state should not involve itself too directly in the affairs of its citizens- conservatives used to be pacifists as well-Goldwater, Dewey et. You however wish for more governmental power in the Patriot Act. You support a war, created with no facts- and constantly being distorted by conservative propaganda( a solider is dying every day- they have footage ususally but we the american people never see this footage- I can if I watch German or British stations- nor do we see the many riots, and shootings in Iraq- all becuase of propaganda).

When did conservatism become in favor of big gov, of restrictive freedom reducing measures, of war mongering? It sounds as if its on the way to Nazism.

Shame on you and your party for destroying any faith I can ever have in our pol system.

You make some good points. Especially in the realm of big government, etc.. However, can a conservative not think that a larger governmental role in national security might not a bad thing? Without granting the government more power, how would you suggest that we combat terrorism on our own soil?

Also, did you read the story at that link I posted about the Patriot Act? I am curious as to what you think about it.

 

[speed]

I agree it was a bit much- sorry, but your position on this subject I see as possessing all the elements I find to be wrong with our country. I am sick and tired of listening to people giving their lives and souls to this increasingly repressive state, without the slightest twinge of thought- or questioning the states motives. When did Hegelianism come back into vogue( the infallibility of the state) ?

 

[Gory Elephant]

@GloryElephant-Thank you for contering my points with NOTHING! Ignoring something remotely uncomfortable or because you wish it not to be is a completely human thing to do. You give no pertinent rebuttals, just nothing, The Bush's and the Bin Laden's own A DEFENSE CONTRACT COMPANY, are you so completely blind as to ignore the implications of this! Oh, wait, I am just a conspricy theorist, I love how you explain all of this away by saying I am a Liberal. Well, surprise, Iam not, I am MY OWN FUCKING MAN! IMO the whole scam of our gov't should be wiped off the chalk board. Here is a quote for you, "When oppression still exists, none can be free." Exept oppression isn't about the color of your skin or your religion anymore, it is about those in power who HAVE the money and want to keep it that way, and No! I can not come up with a better system, i am simply stating the current system is slowly killing all of it's serfs.

The only one of your issues I did not respond to (except the Tipps one, which I am nto familiar with at all) was the one about the defense contract company. I thought I countered your other two issues with more than "nothing", did I not?

Regardless, upon further thought, you are probably right about Bush and Bin Laden, they are probably having lunch right now, while theyplan out their nefarious scheme to destroy the U.S.

 

[Gory Elephant]

I agree it was a bit much- sorry, but your position on this subject I see as possessing all the elements I find to be wrong with our country. I am sick and tired of listening to people giving their lives and souls to this increasingly repressive state, without the slightest twinge of thought- or questioning the states motives. When did Hegelianism come back into vogue( the infallibility of the state) ?

I am curious as to what you mean by "increasingly repressive state"? WIth the exception of (whether real or not) whatever freedoms the Patriot Act takes away, it is my interpretation of the current state of affairs that the citizens of the U.S. are more free than ever. Something which I believe is actually contributing to the decay of our society, incidentally.

I have no idea when Hegelianism came back into vogue. I personally am of the opinion that the government screws up everythign it touches. But when it comes to elements of national security, who else can do it?

 

[speed]

I read your article- rather one sided I would say.

Why do you think Terrorism can be fought, or stopped? Are you that naive? Surely you understand that America with its pervasive world capitalism- its unbridled arrogance( in thinking our system is best and must be imposed everywhere)- and its lack of any moral or religious justice, - makes a wonderful target for any terrorist who finds nothing but emptiness and injustice in his life. Why not attack America, the country that has been responsible for enforcing our repressive status quo on the world. We have not given a fuck about any third world country unless they go against our greedy interests. Furthermore, we have supported most of the repressive middle eastern regimes - as they provided us with oil( this is a proven fact)

So, lets say you were a young kid from the Middle East- you were poor- dirt poor, you believed in the divine justice and will of Allah. You watched American tV all day, saw american products- yet you were in effect a slave in your own country, you didnt see any of this oil money being sold to the americans- you saw the hated american supported jews repressing your palestinian neighbors. You see Americans putting all this attention and energy into Iraq- and not giving a fuck about your repressive gov. What would you do? Is not destruction of everything a valid option for you who have nothing?

Creating war, and murdering Iraqis only proves that America cares little for the freedom of the Middle East- only that the Middle East should become more servile to america

Im on a roll- I was sent over the edge by a coworker last night- and he was shocked when I let loose on him.

 

[AjDeath]

The only one of your issues I did not respond to (except the Tipps one, which I am nto familiar with at all) was the one about the defense contract company. I thought I countered your other two issues with more than "nothing", did I not?

Regardless, upon further thought, you are probably right about Bush and Bin Laden, they are probably having lunch right now, while theyplan out their nefarious scheme to destroy the U.S.

I love this guy. :Spin: I would like to apologize for the way I have stated things, you hit the wrong nerve man. But, I still cannot help myself from a little laughter here, the only thing you did was call me a conspiracy theorist and ask what politician nowadays isn't involved in big business, oh and call me a Liberal, which is a totally false statement, if you knew me, you would no I am a true independent conservative, with no ties to a poolitical party, just rational thinking with a strong desire to be free and an end of ignorance and lust/greed. A rational thought must be made by seeing all sides of the story, which you clearly do not wish to do, you only wish to free yourself from being disturbed, people like that bother ms, they just think of their own comfort, as long as it doesn't bother them, anything is OK, while the servants of their greed/lust continue dying, while they rape my paycheck, while they keep tabs on me, while they pass anti-sedition laws that could see me in prison for posting this, yes, if the Govn't wanted to they could do something about a "terrorist " like me, The Free Information law, and the Patriot act, not to mention the TIPPS program and other freedom raping laws make this a possibility, I really hope they do, I will spread dissention like they have never fucking seen, BTW, your eyes are open, is your mind? Sorry the Temptation...oh the strain...

 

[Gory Elephant]

I read your article- rather one sided I would say.

Why do you think Terrorism can be fought, or stopped? Are you that naive? Surely you understand that America with its pervasive world capitalism- its unbridled arrogance( in thinking our system is best and must be imposed everywhere)- and its lack of any moral or religious justice, - makes a wonderful target for any terrorist who finds nothing but emptiness and injustice in his life. Why not attack America, the country that has been responsible for enforcing our repressive status quo on the world. We have not given a fuck about any third world country unless they go against our greedy interests. Furthermore, we have supported most of the repressive middle eastern regimes - as they provided us with oil( this is a proven fact)

So, lets say you were a young kid from the Middle East- you were poor- dirt poor, you believed in the divine justice and will of Allah. You watched American tV all day, saw american products- yet you were in effect a slave in your own country, you didnt see any of this oil money being sold to the americans- you saw the hated american supported jews repressing your palestinian neighbors. You see Americans putting all this attention and energy into Iraq- and not giving a fuck about your repressive gov. What would you do? Is not destruction of everything a valid option for you who have nothing?

Creating war, and murdering Iraqis only proves that America cares little for the freedom of the Middle East- only that the Middle East should become more servile to america

Im on a roll- I was sent over the edge by a coworker last night- and he was shocked when I let loose on him.

I can appreciate your viewpoint, but I don't understand what youare saying? I am in many ways naive, but don't understand your point that since there will always be people who hate us, we should not fight their murderous actions. One does not follow the other.

I also have no problem at all with the oil thing. Like it or not, it is oil that makes this world go around (and NOT just for the U.S.). Of course we support those regimes when we need to, it is in our (and the world's) best interest that as stable an environment as possible be maintained in oil producing countries.

And, what about the good things the U.S. brings to the world? The medicinal advances? The industrial advances, the technological advances? the BILLIONS of dollars in aid it sends all over the world? The countries it has helped free from communist repression?

And, do you not agree that our system is the best our world has ever seen? Can you name one better?

 

[AjDeath]

Dan Lee is in a Federal Prison because of the oil lobbyists who seek to stay wealthy, who do you think controls our Gov't through support? Ask the damn Bush family about oil and the wealth it provides them.

 

[Gory Elephant]

I love this guy. :Spin: I would like to apologize for the way I have stated things, you hit the wrong nerve man. But, I still cannot help myself from a little laughter here, the only thing you did was call me a conspiracy theorist and ask what politician nowadays isn't involved in big business, oh and call me a Liberal, which is a totally false statement, if you knew me, you would no I am a true independent conservative, with no ties to a poolitical party, just rational thinking with a strong desire to be free and an end of ignorance and lust/greed. A rational thought must be made by seeing all sides of the story, which you clearly do not wish to do, you only wish to free yourself from being disturbed, people like that bother ms, they just think of their own comfort, as long as it doesn't bother them, anything is OK, while the servants of their greed/lust continue dying, while they rape my paycheck, while they keep tabs on me, while they pass anti-sedition laws that could see me in prison for posting this, yes, if the Govn't wanted to they could do something about a "terrorist " like me, The Free Information law, and the Patriot act, not to mention the TIPPS program and other freedom raping laws make this a possibility, I really hope they do, I will spread dissention like they have never fucking seen, BTW, your eyes are open, is your mind? Sorry the Temptation...oh the strain...

Uhh, OK.

 

[AjDeath]

Uhh, OK.

Allright, let me put it another way, without odd references to obscure books, the majority of people I meet in the world today are comfortable with being comfortable, to think of anything wrong with the world is uncomfortable, rationalizing your actions no matter what they are or what the cost is also a very comfortable ideal to lean on, what we, as Americans, are doing is rationalizing war for peace, killing humans to stop the killing, treating the world as nothing to gain everything. THIS is our reality, to rationalize, oh to rationalize, a very comfortable proposition and position to be in, to be infallible, to make no mistakes, to disregard hindsight, to repeat the cycle of hate and death, to give into mans basist desires, to feed off of the less fortunately like it was helping them, to play off of mans fears, to subjugate into freedom, to drown in order to save. TO REPRESS INTO SLAVERY. To ignore the constant itch of repression is a very easy and comfortable thing to do. I don't.

 

[speed]

Well said Aj Death- I see we once again totally agree.

I for one would just like our gov. and our society do something- anything. Maybe new election procedures, new foreign policy, stop shopping walmart- anything at all and I would be happy.

 

[Shell Shock]

Schwartzenegger - finally a candidate able to explain Bush's policies in the original German (c) Bill Maher .

I live in California, I have mixed thoughts about it. I don't think that a recall is that anti-democratic because it IS in our constitution, right? And yet something tells me that when you select an official - he or she must complete their term unless they do something really way out of the ordinary.. Since when has incompetence become a sin? . I don't think it will set a precedent (I don't believe in precedents) - but, dammit.. Something tells me that this ain't right when actors with no political experience can just take over like that...

 

[murderedbysound]

i would like to see arnie be the govoner but also have Gallagher in there as well...i would love to see him smashing water melons at every meeting

 

[AjDeath]

i would like to see arnie be the govoner but also have Gallagher in there as well...i would love to see him smashing water melons at every meeting

LOL! Gallagher! MAn, he sucks so much, and that hairdo, just cut it off! I like to call it a skullet. Did Devin Townsend cut his off yet? LOL Gallagher, geesh...