Machinated
Member
randy is indeed a king - the low end he gets in his mixes is recognisable almost straight away. there must be very few guys who can pull that off as well as he does.
The Randy Staub love thread
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Harry Hughes
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- Apr 25, 2009
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kev
Im guybrush threepwood
I too love his stuff, especially the nickelback. Very small amount of info available on the net from my searchings. Thanks to CFH for posting here. Can anybody with more experience touch on adding 100hz in the overheads? That seems like the anti christ.
kaomao
Member
He's really one of the best I say, but there's only one album that sounds weird, and that is http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Come_What(ever)_May I don't get that phasey guitar sound, the rest is so cool but those guitars as far as I remember sounded in a strange way.
I hope maybe it was a compilation mix problem, I ain't got the album, just this metal hammer compilation.
I hope maybe it was a compilation mix problem, I ain't got the album, just this metal hammer compilation.
MetalJonesy
more metal, more booze!!!
yeah i agree with ya on that one dude, the guitar tone has always bugged me since buying the record on its release!
slashvanyoung
Dopefish lives!
I always thought Raskulinecz mixed that one himself, apparently not. That mix is weird yeah, especially the guitars.
But it's just such a strong album (musically) that it doesn't really bother me.
----
How awesome a Raskulinecz + Staub collaboration can possibly sound, we've heard on the latest AIC.
I'm pretty certain that a lot of layering (with the adequate panning) + the PCM42 "trick" can get you in the ballpark as far as ultra-wide guitars go. A great mastering probably takes it over the top.
smy1
Member
Harry Hughes
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slashvanyoung
Dopefish lives!
Actually a good question because I don't think it's the "right" kinda mix for AIC. But on its own, detached from the band's context, I think this is one of the best heavy rock mixes I've heard.
Low end is huge, guitars are wider than a granny's snatch, drums are huge (especially the snare).
HDWR
Member
slashvanyoung
Dopefish lives!
You basically abuse a Lexicon PCM42 unit (digital delay, not produced anymore) in a way it wasn't really supposed to:
Let's say you have two hard panned tracks of distorted guitar, then you insert the PCM42 on one side (hardware insert) and just set a slight delay that'll make things bigger. But that's not all to it, the real magic lies in riding the built-in overload compressor of the 42's front end really hard (by turning the input way up) to get a really grainy, biting and big sound. You then have to adjust, respectively turn down, the output volume of the unit accordingly to get your desired level back.
Let's say you have two hard panned tracks of distorted guitar, then you insert the PCM42 on one side (hardware insert) and just set a slight delay that'll make things bigger. But that's not all to it, the real magic lies in riding the built-in overload compressor of the 42's front end really hard (by turning the input way up) to get a really grainy, biting and big sound. You then have to adjust, respectively turn down, the output volume of the unit accordingly to get your desired level back.
smy1
Member
Harry: both 
Slashvanyoung: I dunno, I listened to the first 3-4 songs of the album and really was not particularl impressed with anything. I didn't give it a critical listen though, cause I don't like the songs at all except "Check My Brain".
I also agree that the mix isnt the right style for AIC at all.
Slashvanyoung: I dunno, I listened to the first 3-4 songs of the album and really was not particularl impressed with anything. I didn't give it a critical listen though, cause I don't like the songs at all except "Check My Brain".
I also agree that the mix isnt the right style for AIC at all.
slashvanyoung
Dopefish lives!
What would you prefer? Weak low-end, narrow guitars, and small drums?
I think a less compressed mix (I don't know how much of that comes from the very loud mastering though) with slightly less huge guitars to give the vocals more room and less samples and processing on the drums to make them more dynamical would fit the band better. "A Looking In View" is the only song on that record that really fits this huge mix.
What Dave Jerden did with them was perfect IMHO.
On some systems I definitely agree with this, on others this mix is perfect. For instance: the album sounds great in my car, but on some headphones and smaller speakers it's almost a little tedious. I'm glad they tried something new with the production and mixing though.
C_F_H_13
Protools Guru
For people not in the Vancouver scene, there's actually a specific bunch of samples that most people in van use to get that sound...nickelback or whatever.
Some of you may have these samples and not even know it, as they have been circulated a lot.
For kicks, there's a long standing joke that if you get a session from vancouver it'll have "•Death Kick" and "•Rockhead" and maybe "•Ludwig Dry". The first 2 are essentially the kick sound that's on every nickelback record.
Deathkick is this super processed punchy kick, rockhead is a "Boom" kick and the ludwig dry is a less processed more raw punchy kick.
When I combined all randy's samples from the safety session I got, it was mostly just a giant low end thud (both kick and snares) with either a low ring on the kick or a high brass like ring on the snare. After I compressed the shit out of them I realized that's how he gets the tone without having to cut the low end to get it.
Compression, automation and more compression. Then I think he tops it off with even more compression. And Finally compression. Maybe some limiting too.
Matt Smith
THEOCRACY
He has a couple of custom Sontec EQs, with one on the drum/bass buss and one on the master. He also makes a drum subgroup with the small faders on the SSL and sends to an outboard 384, and brings that up underneath the main drums in parallel.
Matt Smith
THEOCRACY
He uses an AMS unit for this. They also used one on the drums on the Black Album.
This forum rocks. C F H, you're a legend bro. I've been looking for info on Randy's techniques forever, and thought after the GS guys were hopeless there was no chance.
Now if you don't mind me inquiring further...
Is the crazy master bus compression a confirmed fact? That amount of GR sounds insane, and like it would absolutely stifle any mix. When I ran my GSSL at 4:1, 30ms and 100ms, if I did any more than about 2 to 3 dB the entire thing would just '2-dimensionalize'. Heck I just got it serviced so I could use the gentler 2:1 ratio, with 30ms attack and auto release more like CLA.
I don't suppose you happen to have those golden 3 kick samples on you? If you don't want to share, I totally understand. I've been building my own faux Nickelback kick/snares to use. The snare I'm happy with so far, but the kick lacks that low-punch.
Speaking of which, do you know whether Randy uses the ol side-chaining a sine-wave to the kick trick these days?
And fiiinally. Can someone elucidate on the PCM42 trick? I read up above, but about slamming the front-end of the unit... does that apply solely to the delayed signal? So essentially the outcome is a slapback delay that's really grungy and dirty... in many ways similar to what echoboy can do? Is the PSP PCM42 plug-in capable of doing this trick adequately? What sort of sub-divisons are the delays normally set to, and how are they panned?
Btw Jonesy: That 'some kind of monster' remix is monstrous.
Now if you don't mind me inquiring further...
Is the crazy master bus compression a confirmed fact? That amount of GR sounds insane, and like it would absolutely stifle any mix. When I ran my GSSL at 4:1, 30ms and 100ms, if I did any more than about 2 to 3 dB the entire thing would just '2-dimensionalize'. Heck I just got it serviced so I could use the gentler 2:1 ratio, with 30ms attack and auto release more like CLA.
I don't suppose you happen to have those golden 3 kick samples on you? If you don't want to share, I totally understand. I've been building my own faux Nickelback kick/snares to use. The snare I'm happy with so far, but the kick lacks that low-punch.
Speaking of which, do you know whether Randy uses the ol side-chaining a sine-wave to the kick trick these days?
And fiiinally. Can someone elucidate on the PCM42 trick? I read up above, but about slamming the front-end of the unit... does that apply solely to the delayed signal? So essentially the outcome is a slapback delay that's really grungy and dirty... in many ways similar to what echoboy can do? Is the PSP PCM42 plug-in capable of doing this trick adequately? What sort of sub-divisons are the delays normally set to, and how are they panned?
Btw Jonesy: That 'some kind of monster' remix is monstrous.
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