Urban, religion inspired lyrics?

[WIntersReflection]

Very true, thats what happens when a book goes through countless translations and retranslations AND human beings get involved... lets face it, religion is a business and one that can give a person a LOT of power over people's minds "We're to frightened to stray... buying a brief burst of heaven" (The Almighty: Jesus Loves you... but I don't). And when that happens, there are some people who will use that for their own ends.
I tend to look at ministers and all that less as teachers and more as lead story-tellers... they read from the book during the service because someone has to say something religious and I interpret what they say how I want to.

I also believe that while organized religions and Christian religions in particular (as that is the one I am most familiar with) have teachings of certain values, I consider some to be positive and some to be negative. I do embrace some of the values I was taught and ignore some of the others.

 

[Fangface]

The way I see it, there is either there is a "God" (or gods) or there was some aliens that dropped us off here because the human beings "self awareness" or "soul" if you will is unique to only our species and I personally think that it is a divine gift.

There is a very strong possibility that we are all aliens in fact, since many huge meteorits crashed on Earth billions of years ago, and probably brought their own bacteries that later on mixed with the ones already on Earth.

 

[ZeiMoT]

Well ZeiMoT sometimes people do switch religions, one of my best friends changed to a different religion then his family. It is more usual to stick with what you were raised with though.

Oh, yes, definetly, I'm one of those that switched. I was raised to be a christian. That is exactly my point, some people do not have the same possibility to make their _own_ choice.

The doctrine that I was raise by, is that which what was written in the bible was the truth. Every thought, well everything should be compared to what the 'word of god' had to say. I was tought that 'we' had the truth and that everyone else was wrong. Things happened in my life that made it possible for me to get away from my parents (don't get me wrong here, I love my parents). It took me many years to realize that the 'truth' can be a variety of things depending who one asks. I now 'believe' in nothing, which is not the same as disbelief. It's a
not-able-to-know-due-to-the-impossible-to-compute-not-enough-data state.

My lack of English words makes it impossible for me to explain it any better than that. Lets just say that I am open to 'the truth' if there is one (or many truths).

 

[WIntersReflection]

As the Alien said in Enemy Mine... "Truth is truth."
Personally, I am what I am I am, and expect people of ALL religions to respect that and not bother me to convert. I don't think that there's anything wrong with being a Christian... that is for following the teachings of Jesus and or worshipping him. I do think, however, that when groups of people place themselves or are placed "in authority" trouble begins abrewin' so to speak. People are failable and put people in a position of power like that and it will be abused sooner or later (not necessarily by everyone though). That goes for ANY religion because religion is power...
And thats my say.

Oh, yes, definetly, I'm one of those that switched. I was raised to be a christian. That is exactly my point, some people do not have the same possibility to make their _own_ choice.

The doctrine that I was raise by, is that which what was written in the bible was the truth. Every thought, well everything should be compared to what the 'word of god' had to say. I was tought that 'we' had the truth and that everyone else was wrong. Things happened in my life that made it possible for me to get away from my parents (don't get me wrong here, I love my parents). It took me many years to realize that the 'truth' can be a variety of things depending who one asks. I now 'believe' in nothing, which is not the same as disbelief. It's a
not-able-to-know-due-to-the-impossible-to-compute-not-enough-data state.

My lack of English words makes it impossible for me to explain it any better than that. Lets just say that I am open to 'the truth' if there is one (or many truths).

 

[ZeiMoT]

I do think, however, that when groups of people place themselves or are placed "in authority" trouble begins abrewin' so to speak. People are failable and put people in a position of power like that and it will be abused sooner or later (not necessarily by everyone though). That goes for ANY religion because religion is power...
And thats my say.

That is so true.

 

[Bryant]

The doctrine that I was raise by, is that which what was written in the bible was the truth. Every thought, well everything should be compared to what the 'word of god' had to say.

Zeimot, I am lucky that if I were to go to the church I grew up in, almost everyone there would want the chance to "save me" as I have long hair, and cigarrette (and sometimes beer) breath, but very few would look down on me. I have never been to Sweden, but in America, many people use Church as a social gathering. In a big "popular" Baptist church, I wouldn't fit in. The church I was raised in is not like that. They speak in tongues (I really would have a hard time explaining that) and play music, including electric guitar (though clean) in their service. They are both more conservative (the fact that only in the last 20 years women were allowed to wear pants) but also more liberal as everyone expresses their "belief" in different ways. People are VERY friendly and want to talk to you and get to know you even if you are a stranger.
As I said, I picked up on some of my Christian teachings later in life, but more importantly, I picked up on a few of the Holiness beliefs (that I chose to pick up on) and one of those teachings is that we are all special people. Every one of us is important and we all have something to say. I am a cross between that and a "hippie." I love people. I love to meet people and I don't mind telling people about me because I love myself to a very high degree.
As I stated before, I am not a Christian and don't pretend to be, but the religion (like other religions) have positive points about it. I try to pick and choose the good things about it and practice it, but as opposed to being "Christian" I practice "the golden rule" more than anything else.


Having said that...... If I can possibly be nice enough to everyone to convince them to do what I say...... my work is done. Think about it.


Bryant

 

[ZeiMoT]

Zeimot, I am lucky that if I were to go to the church I grew up in, almost everyone there would want the chance to "save me" as I have long hair, and cigarrette (and sometimes beer) breath, but very few would look down on me. I have never been to Sweden, but in America, many people use Church as a social gathering. In a big "popular" Baptist church, I wouldn't fit in. The church I was raised in is not like that. They speak in tongues (I really would have a hard time explaining that) and play music, including electric guitar (though clean) in their service. They are both more conservative (the fact that only in the last 20 years women were allowed to wear pants) but also more liberal as everyone expresses their "belief" in different ways. People are VERY friendly and want to talk to you and get to know you even if you are a stranger.

I grew up in a church in which they spoke in tongues, so I know what the babbling sounds like, they practiced prophetical sayings as well.

As I said, I picked up on some of my Christian teachings later in life, but more importantly, I picked up on a few of the Holiness beliefs (that I chose to pick up on) and one of those teachings is that we are all special people. Every one of us is important and we all have something to say. I am a cross between that and a "hippie." I love people. I love to meet people and I don't mind telling people about me because I love myself to a very high degree.

I love people too Bryant, no matter if they are Wiccas, Christians, Mormons, Muslims, Buddists.. or something else... Religion is not an issue when it comes to whom I might/mightn't like/love. But I do not like the idea of how religion. Some say that it's not the religion that is wrong but the people who use it for their own purposes. Well, I can understand the idea, but whole idea of the bigger religions is that everyone is supposed to believe in a specific predefined way. I don't like that. Therefore, I cannot be part of any religion, since I cannot believe in what someone else has written that I should believe. The problem is - out of my point of view - that people who start to practice some religion are not thinking there own thoughts anymore, they get so influenced by the teachings, and they are afraid that someone will tell them that their thoughts are wrong, so they keep their real thoughts inside until their real thoughts are forgotten. Well, I have experienced it.

As I stated before, I am not a Christian and don't pretend to be, but the religion (like other religions) have positive points about it. I try to pick and choose the good things about it and practice it, but as opposed to being "Christian" I practice "the golden rule" more than anything else.

There is nothing wrong with "the golden rule", apart that those christians that I've met don't really practice it at all. It's just something nice to say.
But outside the walls of christianity I've met more people that practice this.
I guess that religious people are sometimes so religious that they do not have time to be in the real world. And that is not only among chrisitians, no, I've met mormons, muslims, wiccans that do the same mistake. They are so busy with how to interpret their religion that they forget to practice the parts that they so much wish to convince me is essence of their religion.
Funny, but 'the golden rule' is more or less what is proclaimed to be the essence in many (not all) religions. I've seen that being practiced by only 3 indivuduals so far compared to the many more that I've met outside religious institutions that practice the golden rule in everyday life.

Having said that...... If I can possibly be nice enough to everyone to convince them to do what I say...... my work is done. Think about it.

Bryant

I like the idea of keeping the good stuff and throw away the bad stuff. That is what I try to live by, even though one might not think so.
I bet it sound like that I feel hate towards religion and religious people, which is not the case at all. I probably use too many superlative so that I get misunderstood. This is only my lack of proper English words for some of the things I wish to express.

 

[WIntersReflection]

Lol, well ZeiMoT if you've never met a Christian who practiced the Golden Rule before... jot it down in your diary 'cause you just met one!

As for religion... I think you mean subscribing to an exact beleif rather then meaning that an individual's choice to believe in a specific God. I think that the Bible and all is a pick and chose thing, you have to decide for yourself which parts you believe. I think that and contemplating how God and the whole spiritual world is like is what keeps belief alive. Of course, I am not conceited enough to think that I have EVERYTHING right, lol. I'm only human after all but it feels right to me.

And Bryant, thumbs up my friend, thats a good rule to follow!

 

[ZeiMoT]

Lol, well ZeiMoT if you've never met a Christian who practiced the Golden Rule before... jot it down in your diary 'cause you just met one!

Don't get me wrong now, but, seeing is believeing. I've met alot of people that SAY that they practice this or that, but they don't live like they say they do. So, no offence WIntersReflection, but I haven't met you, I haven't seen the way that you live, and I've been fooled for so many times that I don't trust in words alone anymore. I'll keep in mind what you've said though.
I really hope it's true what you say, and I will try to believe that it's true.
No hard feelings?

 

[WIntersReflection]

Gee ZeiMoT, how on earth have people been treating you?

It sounds like you have run into every jerk in a ten mile radius and maybe 10 nice people from there?

:Shrugs: To be honest the only "trust" I expect the kind that seeing my posts should give you... hopefully by now the people here realize that, post wise, I'm a nice, friendly person. As for deeper then that, I don't expect anything, other then the odd person thinking occasionally, "I hope she's like that normally too. She's pretty cool!"

Now if I lived on your block, maybe I could eventually expect you to trust me offline, but that someone might expect that I hoped for that kind of trust from someone who was reading my words half a world away... it never even crossed my mind.

Don't worry though, I know what you are talking about, I've run into and am unfortunately related to many people who do not follow the Golden Rule... Drives me nuts.

 

[ZeiMoT]

Gee ZeiMoT, how on earth have people been treating you?

It sounds like you have run into every jerk in a ten mile radius and maybe 10 nice people from there?

You are so right.

I used to be the one who had oh so much faith. ​

Whatever I was told, I believed.​

How was I to know when truth was a lie and lie became truth.​

Hold me tight. Pray with me: 'Hallowed be thy name'​

You're my storyteller, feeding me lies.​

- ZeiMoT​

To be honest the only "trust" I expect the kind that seeing my posts should give you... hopefully by now the people here realize that, post wise, I'm a nice, friendly person. As for deeper then that, I don't expect anything, other then the odd person thinking occasionally, "I hope she's like that normally too. She's pretty cool!"

You seem to be a nice person, I'll give you that. And some (many) years ago, I would probably have said that you were one cool, nice person that I would trust with my life. I'm sorry WIntersReflection, but I cannot and will not trust anyone more than this. I just can't. I've been hurt by my own foolishness before and will not let that happen again, that's all.

I usually do not talk about this, I am probably stupid , telling this on the net for all the world to see. On the contrary, it might be a sign of recovery. Whatever.

Don't worry though, I know what you are talking about, I've run into and am unfortunately related to many people who do not follow the Golden Rule... Drives me nuts.

Drives me nuts too. Pleased to hear that I can make myself understood.

On with the show, let's pretend this was never discussed, the world is sane, noone lies and...

 

[WIntersReflection]

Ouch poor guy...

 

[ZeiMoT]

Ouch poor guy...

Not anymore. What doesn't kill you makes you stronger. And that is so true!

 

[Bryant]

You are so right.



I usually do not talk about this, I am probably stupid , telling this on the net for all the world to see. On the contrary, it might be a sign of recovery. Whatever.

I see nothing wrong with sharing your thoughts and feelings over the net. Sometimes it is easier to tell strangers (more or less) about those type of things than it is someone close to you. The rplies you receive will also be a bit less biased as well.


Bryant

 

[ZeiMoT]

I think your opinion is similar as Urban's, since that "subconscious choice" he mentionned can also relate to the fact that some people don't really have the choice in their beliefs like you said. It's not a real proper choice because of the exagerated influence of the context, but it's still a choice.

But it could be that I misunderstood one or both of you, my language flaws strike again

Hmmm... I think you might be right. I've given it some more thought, and, yeah, the "subconscious choice", might be something that I misunderstood. Whatever, I'll drop the subject.

 

[Bryant]

I think your opinion is similar as Urban's, since that "subconscious choice" he mentionned can also relate to the fact that some people don't really have the choice in their beliefs like you said. It's not a real proper choice because of the exagerated influence of the context, but it's still a choice.

But it could be that I misunderstood one or both of you, my language flaws strike again

Wasn't it Rush that coined the phrase "If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice" ? Any given person's beliefs just like any given person's personality and is based on a combination of factors that include nature, nurture and personal experiences. You can't help how your brain was pre-programmed when you were born nor the environment you were raised in, but I think as a teen and young adult you make many choices and go through many events in your life that impact your values and beliefs as an adult. I think those three factors are what determines the person you are and the particular values and beliefs you hold.


Bryant

 

[WIntersReflection]

To be honest I think it's an earlier saying then that Bryant... my Mom knows it and she loathes metal... lol but it IS a good one!

I don't know, anytime someones that unhappy ZeiMoT, I pat them on the back. So : pat on the back : :nods:

But still... I don't feel there is anything wrong with Christianity as a religion. The idea of people trying to love and take care of each other instead of killing one another is definately not an idea I object to. I think its a wonderful idea. Never have seen anything wrong with it, never will. You know... it seems there are two things you can't discuss with people Religion and Metallica... either way someone gets angry, lol. Probably both.

For some reason though felt like posting in this thread... I think I got tired of watching everyone talking about it and sitting around silently. :shrugs: Think I may go back to that or at least quiet down some.

 

[ZeiMoT]

I don't know, anytime someones that unhappy ZeiMoT, I pat them on the back. So : pat on the back : :nods:

You've got me all wrong. I'm not unhappy, not at all. I might've been that some 10-15 yrs ago, but that's all history now. Lyrics that I wrote during that period of time reflects that sadness. Actually most of my own music was written back then.

 

[Bryant]

To be honest I think it's an earlier saying then that Bryant... my Mom knows it and she loathes metal... lol but it IS a good one!

I suppose I am lucky in that way. My parents are indifferent towards metal. My Mom (who is not particularly religious) likes some of the vanden Plas softer stuff and even knows Ronnie Dio when she hears him, though she is ignorant about metal.


Bryant

 

[dargormudshark]

I suppose I am lucky in that way. My parents are indifferent towards metal. My Mom (who is not particularly religious) likes some of the vanden Plas softer stuff and even knows Ronnie Dio when she hears him, though she is ignorant about metal.


Bryant

My dad is kind of that way. He likes Priest, Maiden, Scorpions, Kamelot, VP, PoS, and DT. Pretty much everything else I like metal wise he makes fun of.