Why does Europe have more hard rock and metal bands than the USA?

[Kaosaur]

Yes, believing one genre of music to be simply better than another and to state so publicly is pretty moronic.
Most people with a clue recognize it to be a matter of personal taste.

 

[AeonicSlumber]

Yes, believing one genre of music to be simply better than another and to state so publicly is pretty moronic.
Most people with a clue recognize it to be a matter of personal taste.

Fucking facepalm. I'm done here. Unless you're trolling of course, then we can laugh it off and hug it out.

 

[dcowboys311]

Slayer > crunkcore.

Fact, not opinion.

 

[Kaosaur]

Fucking facepalm. I'm done here. Unless you're trolling of course, then we can laugh it off and hug it out.

You obviously missed the part "to state so publicly".

Would you not say the same thing about somebody telling you "my god is better than your god"?

Have some frigging sense here, please.

 

[Prog_Please]

ALL music is "manufactured to sell". Anyone who tells you they don't want to sell records and then offers records for sale is lying to you. Anyone who offers a download and a buy option wants to sell you something too. If somebody didn't want to sell it to you, they wouldn't.

I don't generally consider myself the most informed of metalheads, but I will strongly disagree with this statement.

Its so wrong I don't know how to explain the wrongfulness of the statement.

Look at like post-metal. Are you going to really tell me something like "Battle of Mice" was "manufactured to sell"?! At the ISIS concert, I talked to one of the guys and he said they would give all their stuff away for free if they didn't need to eat and travel to the next city.

But yeah, I don't know what to say other than this statement is 100% fail.

 

[AeonicSlumber]

You obviously missed the part "to state so publicly".

Would you not say the same thing about somebody telling you "my god is better than your god"?

Have some frigging sense here, please.

So stating opinion makes me a moron? I should keep my opinions private and not be allowed to express myself? Excuse me? I still fail to see where you're getting at here and it just seems as if you're arguing this for the sake of it when in reality you're just digging deeper and deeper. Quit picking e-fights for no reason like some kind of internet warrior. It's really annoying. You're not a moron for saying "my god is better than your god," either by the way. It's a matter of opinion. One I disagree with granted, but still opinion nonetheless.

To elaborate, I prefer most hip hop to most metal because I have personally found maaany metal bands to be unlistenable but I can find something interesting in even a Kanye song.

 

[Kaosaur]

Well, generally when you go spout religions in other peoples' faces, they consider you to be offensive and yes, a moron. Now talking about genres of music isn't as "serious" but it's largely the same deal here.

 

[Wyvern]

Is all about perception, the media, the economical(sellings) factor and who you talk too. Some years ago an Italian friend of mine went back home on a trip and decided to brought me a metal album. He came back telling me he couldn't find any metal band in Italy! Not that Italian bands are great or anything, but to say he couldn't find an Italian metal band...

Of course he IS NOT into metal so he didn't know what to look for anyway. I'm sure that people in USA can find a lot of good metal bands (without going to extreme sounds) if you look around closely, that what Internet (MySpace specially IMO) is for, just to mention a few in the last few years: Tetrafusion, Scale The Summit, Bone Shaker, Benedictum, Black Tide, Cage, Crescent Shield.

For me I rather take thrash bands from USA than from Europe, for power I'm more into Europe than USA. For doom I have no preferences same for progressive.

I think (my believe I have no scientific basis to support this) Europe due to size allows more contact for fans with bands, festivals, zines, Internet, etc. The media is more equilibrated, while in USA media and business are towards the best sellers: pop, hip-hop, core, etc. Besides touring Europe is easier than touring USA (size again), so what are the chances to see a band you like in Europe vs in USA (depending where you live of course)?


And with all due respect speaking that socialism in Europe force bands to rebel and express themselves is just plain idiotic. Socialism in Europe is very different from socialism in Latin America. You can't compare Sweden with Venezuela (trust me I live in the front yard of socialistic LA). Go see the living standards in Scandinavian countries and trust me is not due to the right-wing and conservative parties. Besides when a country is under opression, rock is one of the first things to get outlaw (how many bands are in Arabic countries? In pre-90 Russia? In pre-83 Argentina?), a country where bands flourish, touring, selling albums, showing on festivals, magazines in the open are not living in an political opressed country...left or right :Smug:

 

[Kaosaur]

I don't generally consider myself the most informed of metalheads, but I will strongly disagree with this statement.

Its so wrong I don't know how to explain the wrongfulness of the statement.

Look at like post-metal. Are you going to really tell me something like "Battle of Mice" was "manufactured to sell"?! At the ISIS concert, I talked to one of the guys and he said they would give all their stuff away for free if they didn't need to eat and travel to the next city.

But yeah, I don't know what to say other than this statement is 100% fail.

I still don't agree with you. I like bands that want to give their music away and personally I think that's the way things are going and support any band that does as such. A large segment of what I listen to is post-metal. But having to sell their music is a compromise they have to make. Sure they want to give it away, but they want you to buy it because they have to be able to eat and go to the next city. If they really really really didn't want to sell it they would find some other place to get the money from but they can't. So yes. At the end of the day, they want (need) you to buy their shit. If they weren't going to sell it, it wouldn't have been put on a physical disc.

Edit: Also, when a large group of artists in a particular genre are trending towards the same behavior, how can you not recgonize that as a marketing plan? It's one of the most effective ones their is. One of the major purchase considerations for me actually buying this stuff is the fact that it's hard to get and they give stuff away!

 

[AeonicSlumber]

Well, generally when you go spout religions in other peoples' faces, they consider you to be offensive and yes, a moron. Now talking about genres of music isn't as "serious" but it's largely the same deal here.

Keep going, you're only asking to be added to my ignore list!

 

[AeonicSlumber]

EDIT: Wow, OP you have no idea what socialism is... Please read my first post to see the BENEFITS of socialism in the music industry.

 

[Kaosaur]

Dude, at this point you're doing back and forth where all I'm trying to do is contribute to an actual discussion. Who gives a flying crap about who is on your ignore list? Maybe you should stop trying to escalate this before Glenn or Deron step in and ban the both of us.

Edit: I also should point out that several people have noticed that your posts typically descend into this sort of arguing and "OMG YOU CAN'T READ" statements. Quotations not mine. Who is the one trolling who here?

 

[rdyfrde]

According to Metal-Archives:

Denmark: 609 bands
Norway: 1125 bands
Sweden: 2999 bands

United States of America: 14446 bands.

I'm not quite sure what you mean by metal diversity, either. Norway, while having a great metal scene, is primarily known for black metal. Sweden, same deal, but with death metal. Denmark isn't really known for anything.

US is known for death, thrash, and black metal.

And when did Finland stop being a part of Scandinavia? Better tell Sonata Arctica then.

Though amazingly enough when I look at the CDs that I own, the US bands still outnumber all other continents 5-1. I guess I'm an anomaly.

 

[Kaosaur]

Well then I hope Finland has more than 9713 bands. Because that's really important here. Though if you want to be technical:

"Scandinavia[1] is a region in northern Europe that includes, and is named after, the province of Scania. It includes Denmark, Norway and Sweden, though Finland is often considered a Scandinavian country in common English usage, with Iceland and the Faroe Islands sometimes also included."

Thank you wikipedia.

 

[dcowboys311]

IIRC, it's debated whether or not Finland is part of Scandinavia. It changes from book to book. Those 3 countries are the ones that are universally accepted as being the Scandinavian ones.

 

[lady_space]

Dude, backpedal faster. You attacked me and called me ignorant when in reality you totally misread my shit and now you're on some random mumbo jumbo. His post was euphemistically saying "UNLESS WE KILL OFF BIG BAD HIP HOP METAL WILL NEVER B WHERE IT SHUD B... BAWWWW."

Funny, I think you're the ONLY one who read Paul's post that way. His was not "ignorant" at all, and I really don't think that's what he was saying at all.

You constantly whine about people "misunderstanding" you, yet you seem to do a lot of misunderstanding yourself. Quit being a hypocrite at least.

 

[Diamond45]

IMHO it started around 1990-1991.

Hair metal was on it's way out and was getting way long in the tooth.

Summer of 1991, some band called Nirvana got really popular. Anything else in the "rock" set of genres was considered "old school". That went for metal as well.

Sadly, not much has changed since then. The only "rock" that's half way popular is "modern" or "alternative" rock. But the numbers of people who listen to that have gone way down. Most young people in the US (sadly) listen to either country or rap/hip-hop. Rock of any sub-genre isn't even on their radar.

I'm not blaming Nirvana for changing the face of music, as it was pretty much stuck in a rut at that point with overplayed hair metal and cheezy 3 chord wonders. They filled the void. But nothing else of significance has come in the fill the void of a worn out genre of alternative/modern rock. Rock is pretty much dead as far as the public is concerned.

Also, others have touched on it as well - "surveys" and "focus groups" have said that rock is dead as well. We all know those corporate suits want to play what's popular now, not what COULD be popular if they actually played it.

Finally - prog and power metal genres just won't go over well simply by the name "metal". General public considers metal to be thrash, speed or death metal. They wouldn't even give power or prog a chance! Maybe if they changed it to "rock" it could work. But of course then the people on here would cry foul

Oh well.... prog and power are the best underground genres IMHO, and that's what counts to me.

 

[lady_space]

IIRC, it's debated whether or not Finland is part of Scandinavia. It changes from book to book. Those 3 countries are the ones that are universally accepted as being the Scandinavian ones.

There are different definitions of Scandinavia. It is generally accepted to include Norway, Sweden, and Denmark, by the strictest definition; Finland, Iceland and the Faeroes are often included as well, generally speaking, in that order (i.e., most would also include Finland, a few lesser would also include Iceland, etc.). Finland used to be part of Sweden, and part of Russia, and the language is very separate, hence the "uniqueness" of Finland.

However, I think the definition of Scandinavia is the least part of this argument that needs to be defined. It strikes me as a wee bit ridiculous to use this extremely small slice of the metal community to base any arguments on, that would then supposedly apply to anythign but this small slice. I mean, you can't even use this forum as a cross-section for all PP attendees.

 

[Harvester]

 

[Cheiron]

Diamond45, I disagree with you. While alternative rock has seen its decline, hard rock and post-grunge still do quite well. With the right packages they are filling arenas. White kids still have rock on their mind.