Why does Europe have more hard rock and metal bands than the USA?

[edgeofthorns]

Ahhhh ... what an interesting and obscure thread this is ... full of good comments, but also full of so much bullshit that it's hard to walk through it all.

First, a couple of "setting things straight" comments:

1) No, Finland is not one of the Scandinavian countries. There's a big misunderstanding there, as Finland is part of the Nordic Union (Norway, Sweden, Denmark/Greenland/Faroe Islands, Finland and Iceland), whereas Scandinavia only covers Sweden, Norway and Denmark.

2) As an ex-Dane, I take offense in Denmark being called a socialist country. Really???? We haven't had anything you could remotely call a socialist government for the past 12 years in Denmark, and before that we had a government led by "Social Demokratiet" which isn't far from the "Democrats" over here. In Sweden they have a pretty "liberal" party in charge, so calling them socialist is also pretty rough.

3) I've seen several here say that the governments in Europe support bands with money for tours, equipment and recordings. Ehhmmm ... no! Yes, you can in certain countries APPLY for those kind of grants from the government, and that is awesome, however, chances of getting them are slim. You need to know the right person or get your application in the hands of exactly the guy who understands what you want. Over the past 13 years I've worked with 40+ European bands and done tons of tours/recordings/etc and I can only remember 2 situations where bands actually did get those grants. Chances are for any band better to ask a big company to be their sponsor and get money that way.

Okay time to answer the original question:
Q: "Why does Europe have more hard rock and metal bands than the USA?"
A: Europe does NOT have more hard rock / metal bands in Europe than USA.

What would I base that on?
- well, I receive a ton of mails every single day from bands that wants to work with Intromental, and most of those comes from ... you guessed it ... USA! Does that mean that I sign more US based bands than Euro bands? No! I probably sign more European bands, and why I do that is a completely different discussion altogether.

As far as touring opportunities go - well, it makes sense that a lot of European bands gets to tour whereas US bands don't really do that. The distances from one large city to another in Europe are smaller than over here in the US. It'll be more expensive setting up a US tour than a European one.

As far as labels go - yes, there seem to some of those on this board to be a larger concentration of labels in the metal scene in Europe than in the US, but again, that's because you look at it from the power/prog side of things. If you want to play death metal / metal core / hard core etc, you should probably sign with a US label (and there are tons of labels for those genres over here). So why is that skewed between US and Europe? Well, the fact is that your potential market in the US consists of the young kids who like something hard/evil and "rebellious" (to use a word from earlier in this thread) - so of course the labels here aim for that audience and sign bands in the genres that will appeal to the young kids. In Europe however you don't really have that abundancy of youngsters into metal (sad but true) and the old farts rather want another style of music. I know I'm cutting it straight to the bone here and the comments above are very general (and there are a ton of exceptions to the rules), but that's basically it.

So, in short - the question about why there are more hard rock/metal bands in Europe can be answered with a "ehmmm ... there aren't, but thanks for opening up a long discussion about it"

c.

It's actually interesting to read remarks from someone that knows what the hell he is talking about.

~Brian~

 

[J-Man]

It's actually interesting to read remarks from someone that knows what the hell he is talking about.

~Brian~

Yeppers, it is always good to see Claus post, and disspell the misconceptations a lot of people have about the European music scene

 

[TheLongshot]

As far as labels go - yes, there seem to some of those on this board to be a larger concentration of labels in the metal scene in Europe than in the US, but again, that's because you look at it from the power/prog side of things. If you want to play death metal / metal core / hard core etc, you should probably sign with a US label (and there are tons of labels for those genres over here). So why is that skewed between US and Europe? Well, the fact is that your potential market in the US consists of the young kids who like something hard/evil and "rebellious" (to use a word from earlier in this thread) - so of course the labels here aim for that audience and sign bands in the genres that will appeal to the young kids. In Europe however you don't really have that abundancy of youngsters into metal (sad but true) and the old farts rather want another style of music. I know I'm cutting it straight to the bone here and the comments above are very general (and there are a ton of exceptions to the rules), but that's basically it.

Ah, so we have all the "metal" that sucks while the good stuf is in Europe. Got it.

Seriously, tho, it does seem to skew that way. I look at SiriusXM and their metal station mostly contains all of those hard core/death metal bands. Meanwhile, Da Boneyard is basically treated like a classic rock station. No room for new music from old or new bands in that brand of metal. It sucks for me because I hate all the hard core stuff. It isn't music to my ears.

 

[Rycher]

Ah, so we have all the "metal" that sucks while the good stuf is in Europe. Got it.

Seriously, tho, it does seem to skew that way. I look at SiriusXM and their metal station mostly contains all of those hard core/death metal bands. Meanwhile, Da Boneyard is basically treated like a classic rock station. No room for new music from old or new bands in that brand of metal. It sucks for me because I hate all the hard core stuff. It isn't music to my ears.

Liquid Metal has been better since the merge with XM. I catch Iced Earth every once in a while. They've featured a lot of new releases over the past year from Stratovarius, Heaven & Hell, Megadeth, Amon Amarth, Arch Enemy, Children of Bodom, Dethklok, Lamb of God, Testament, etc. I've also heard Evergrey and Symphony X often in the past when they have new material out.

Jose Mangin has said that there are requests for more prog/power metal, but THE OVERALL DEMAND JUST ISN'T THERE YET.

Octone plays some Within Temptation, and new stuff from bands like Rammstein, Godsmack, Rob Zombie, and more of the radio-friendly stuff.

 

[Claus / Intromental]

It sucks for me because I hate all the hard core stuff. It isn't music to my ears.

My parents said the same thing about thrash in the 80's. "It isn't music to my ears".



c.

 

[SharkBlack]

Cool bro, so because I prefer hip hop to a lot of metal means that I'm a moron? lol irony.

Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar...

 

[Wyvern]

Piccard rules! And c'mon Glenn don't you love this forum?

 

[AMBR]

This thread is going places.

Sure? Reading not posting 'cause it just don't seem that way to me. Thanks to those posting lately who actually added a little illumination to an awkwardly phrased and subsequently debated topic. No diss to anyone, but wtf?

 

[lady_space]

Ann Marie for the win.

 

[Pellaz]

That's not what I meant at all, way to take my post out of context to suit a completely different argument.

Yeah...much as you did mine.




--Oh, thanks for the Picard/Riker facepalm pics, Glenn and Anne-Marie. This thread has now produced something of value!

 

[ratanda]

This thread is going places.

Sure? Reading not posting 'cause it just don't seem that way to me.

It was sarcasm.

 

[arnavut]

Ahhhh ... what an interesting and obscure thread this is ... full of good comments, but also full of so much bullshit that it's hard to walk through it all.

First, a couple of "setting things straight" comments:

1) No, Finland is not one of the Scandinavian countries. There's a big misunderstanding there, as Finland is part of the Nordic Union (Norway, Sweden, Denmark/Greenland/Faroe Islands, Finland and Iceland), whereas Scandinavia only covers Sweden, Norway and Denmark.

2) As an ex-Dane, I take offense in Denmark being called a socialist country. Really???? We haven't had anything you could remotely call a socialist government for the past 12 years in Denmark, and before that we had a government led by "Social Demokratiet" which isn't far from the "Democrats" over here. In Sweden they have a pretty "liberal" party in charge, so calling them socialist is also pretty rough.

3) I've seen several here say that the governments in Europe support bands with money for tours, equipment and recordings. Ehhmmm ... no! Yes, you can in certain countries APPLY for those kind of grants from the government, and that is awesome, however, chances of getting them are slim. You need to know the right person or get your application in the hands of exactly the guy who understands what you want. Over the past 13 years I've worked with 40+ European bands and done tons of tours/recordings/etc and I can only remember 2 situations where bands actually did get those grants. Chances are for any band better to ask a big company to be their sponsor and get money that way.

Okay time to answer the original question:
Q: "Why does Europe have more hard rock and metal bands than the USA?"
A: Europe does NOT have more hard rock / metal bands in Europe than USA.

What would I base that on?
- well, I receive a ton of mails every single day from bands that wants to work with Intromental, and most of those comes from ... you guessed it ... USA! Does that mean that I sign more US based bands than Euro bands? No! I probably sign more European bands, and why I do that is a completely different discussion altogether.

As far as touring opportunities go - well, it makes sense that a lot of European bands gets to tour whereas US bands don't really do that. The distances from one large city to another in Europe are smaller than over here in the US. It'll be more expensive setting up a US tour than a European one.

As far as labels go - yes, there seem to some of those on this board to be a larger concentration of labels in the metal scene in Europe than in the US, but again, that's because you look at it from the power/prog side of things. If you want to play death metal / metal core / hard core etc, you should probably sign with a US label (and there are tons of labels for those genres over here). So why is that skewed between US and Europe? Well, the fact is that your potential market in the US consists of the young kids who like something hard/evil and "rebellious" (to use a word from earlier in this thread) - so of course the labels here aim for that audience and sign bands in the genres that will appeal to the young kids. In Europe however you don't really have that abundancy of youngsters into metal (sad but true) and the old farts rather want another style of music. I know I'm cutting it straight to the bone here and the comments above are very general (and there are a ton of exceptions to the rules), but that's basically it.

So, in short - the question about why there are more hard rock/metal bands in Europe can be answered with a "ehmmm ... there aren't, but thanks for opening up a long discussion about it"

c.

Topic and discussion would make sense if the topic would imply Prog and Power Metal than the whole Metal genre. Prog and Power fans catalog will have more European Bands than American bands for sure.
On the other hand like you said, hardcore, metal core, death... metal genre, more bands in US. It was same way 25 years ago, US had more hair metal bands more and Europe had more power metal bands. I would not be surprised if this correlates to album sales as well.

So, simply, some specific genres are more popular in some continents than other, which results in more bands, record labels and sales for that specific genre on that continent.

 

[dcowboys311]

That's not necessarily true though. There are two widely accepted different types of power metal sounds -- American and European. American tends to be a bit thrashier. Stuff like Iced Earth, Nevermore, Jag Panzer, etc. European is the stuff that is sometimes referred to as "flower metal" haha. So even then it depends on person to person.

Most of the big prog bands are American, too. Dream Theater, Queensryche, Fates Warning, etc.

 

[arnavut]

That's not necessarily true though. There are two widely accepted different types of power metal sounds -- American and European. American tends to be a bit thrashier. Stuff like Iced Earth, Nevermore, Jag Panzer, etc. European is the stuff that is sometimes referred to as "flower metal" haha. So even then it depends on person to person.

Most of the big prog bands are American, too. Dream Theater, Queensryche, Fates Warning, etc.

2 points you mentioned:

First, power style is a little different in continents: Sure it has differences, one of the things makes music great, influence of geographic and demographic factors, but this has nothing to do with number of the bands.

Second, the size comparison of popular prog bands: Again we are talking about number of the bands, not size, creativity, quality vs of bands in Europe vs US.

 

[dcowboys311]

2 points you mentioned:

First, power style is a little different in continents: Sure it has differences, one of the things makes music great, influence of geographic and demographic factors, but this has nothing to do with number of the bands.

Second, the size comparison of popular prog bands: Again we are talking about number of the bands, not size, creativity, quality vs of bands in Europe vs US.

And you said that people into Prog/Power metal will have more Euro bands. This is not the case all the time, because a lot of people dig the American sound but think the Euro sound is too happy. So why would they buy those bands?

Also the number of people only into "surface level" prog like DT and Queensryche far exceeds the number of people who now about bands like Circus Maximus.

 

[arnavut]

And you said that people into Prog/Power metal will have more Euro bands. This is not the case all the time, because a lot of people dig the American sound but think the Euro sound is too happy. So why would they buy those bands?

Of course it is not the case all the time, but majority of the case, just simply because there are more power metal bands from europe. There will be power fans whose catalog has more American power bands, just few though.

Also the number of people only into "surface level" prog like DT and Queensryche far exceeds the number of people who now about bands like Circus Maximus.

there are very few surface prog bands. so people that are only into these very few bands would have only few albums to listen to. If they have a large total album catalog , then that means they are into other genres a lot more. This would not be the sample group that I am talking about: a prog fan that has music catalog mostly prog. (or power version or both)

 

[nomisofsiman]

That's not necessarily true though. There are two widely accepted different types of power metal sounds -- American and European. American tends to be a bit thrashier. Stuff like Iced Earth, Nevermore, Jag Panzer, etc. European is the stuff that is sometimes referred to as "flower metal" haha. So even then it depends on person to person.

I agree that most US power metal is vastly different than European. One thing I've never understood though is how Nevermore is lumped into power metal, I even have issue when they're lumped into prog, though they do have longer songs. Nevermore pretty much is gothic thrash and have nothing to do with power metal what so ever. Also considering their previous band, Sanctuary I really don't know how they got lumped into this category. Can someone explain this to me?

 

[SharkBlack]

Gothic Thrash! Nice....

 

[lady_space]

Eventually, we'll have narrowed down everything into such small categories that it will be called "Nevermore metal" or "Circus Maximus metal" because only one band will be allowed per category. :b

 

[urinalcakemix]

I agree that most US power metal is vastly different than European. One thing I've never understood though is how Nevermore is lumped into power metal, I even have issue when they're lumped into prog, though they do have longer songs. Nevermore pretty much is gothic thrash and have nothing to do with power metal what so ever. Also considering their previous band, Sanctuary I really don't know how they got lumped into this category. Can someone explain this to me?

Who gives a fuck what you call it. They're fucking sick. Thats what category they fit into. Plain and simple.