Another Theory Question: This time SOLO's

I cant beleive nobody posted a link to my theory lesson ...lol

Here it is again:

Theory is really simple actually. This is going to be a very long post, so give me an hour or so to get it all together for you

IF YOU DONT UNDERSTAND THE Root - 3rd 5th thing just keep reading. It will become clear

Applying music theory to song writing.

This is a very indepth subject but I am going to break it down to its core elements as it comes to song writing and the guitar in general. Music Theory is probably the monst important thing you can learn as a musician. The ability to use expanded chords and voiceings in your songwriting can add depth and dimension to even the simplest of riffs.

Part 1: The Theory Of Music:

All western music is based off of the 12 Note Chromatic Scale:
C-C#/Db-D-D#/Eb-E-F-F#/Gb-G-G#/Ab-A-A#/Bb-B

The foundation for most western music is based off of the C Major Scale. The C Major scale is the only Major Scale which contains no flats or sharps. Everyone knows the C Major scale, if you sing Do, Re, Mi .... Thats the C Major scale.

The notes of the C Major Scale are C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C

We are going to use the C major Scale as the base of this lesson.

Part 2: Building Chords:

To put it in its most simple form Major chords are made up of the Root 3rd and 5th of any major scale. So if we use the C Major Scale as the base of this we end up with the notes C - E - G. If we play the 3 of these notes together as a chord you get a C Major Triad.
Minor Chords are built using Root flat3rd and 5th of the Major Scale. So if we use C Major as a reference we get C - Eb - G. If we play the 3 of these notes together as a chord you get a C minor Triad

Chord building and knowing how chords work is invaluable for a guitarist / songwriter. It allows you to build and create chord progressions, arpeggios, and give you the tools to create different moods and tensions when soloing over a chord progression by using Modes (more on modes later)

To put this into practice and songwriting in a metal context, one thing you can do is have the Guitar player just playing standard power chords (root and 5th) and you can have a clean guitar playing the Triads or the "tension" below it. The tension is what gives a chord its "color" wether its Major minor or diminished, tension notes are your 3rd, 4th, 6th, 7th, 9th, 11th and 13th.

So guitar one would play C5 (C and G) and the clean guitar would play a C Major Triad over it. This would give you a very happy sounding riff. Alternately you can do the same with Minor chords. You can have one guitar play C5 and you can have the other guitar playing a C Minor Triad.
So to put it simple have the main guitar play a Power Chord and have another guitar play the tension on top of it to give the riff its color or mood.

Example:
Guitar one plays C5 (C and G) and guitar 2 plays Eb, and G, the Eb of guitar 2 gives the chord its minor characteristic. Guitar 2 could even play Eb and C and you would still get the minor tonality. Experiment with different chords and see what sounds best to you.

a.) Using octaves to your advantage:

An octave is 2 notes that are separated by 12 semi tones (half steps). For example, playe a C on your A string (3th Fret) then play an A on your G String (5th Fret) these notes are exactly 1 octave apart.

You can use these octaves to your advantage to make a riff more interesting. So lets take that same C5 chord we played earlier and have the 2nd guitar play a slowly arpegiated chord using C E G one octave higher. This can add some depth to a simple riff.

b.) Chord Harmony

Using chord harmony is another way to make a riff cool. Say we have 2 guitars, Guitar one plays a C Major Chord in the 3rd position (your basic C major chord). The 2nd guitar can play an A Minor chord over that and harmonize the part using music theory!
How is this possible?
Well this gets into the deepest part of music theory. Scales and Modes

Part 3: Scales and Modes

The easiest explination I can give you of modes is they are scales that are built from different parts of the Major (or minor sometimes) scale. This can get very confusing so I am going to build you a small chart so you can see how it works.

The modes follow a specific order: This order NEVER changes

Ionian (Major)
Dorian (Minor)
Phrygian (Minor)
Lydian (Major)
Mixolydian (Major)
Aeolian (Minor)
Locrian (Diminshed)

If we apply each note of the major scale to each of the modes based in C we get.

C Ionian (Major scale)
D Dorian (Minor)
E Phrygian (Minor)
F Lydian (Major)
G Mixolydian (Major)
A Aeolian (Minor Scale)
B Locrian (Diminished)

Each note also get asigned a "degree" in the scale. This is very useful for chord progressions. ir would look similar to this.

C - 1 (Root)
D - 2 (2nd)
E - 3 (3rd)
F - 4 (4th)
G - 5 (5th)
A - 6 (6th)
B - 7 (7th)

So lets put it all together:
Ionian (Major) - C - 1
Dorian (Minor) - D - 2
Phrygian (Minor) - E - 3
Lydian (Major) - F - 4
Mixolydian (Major) - G - 5
Aeolian (Minor) - A - 6
Locrian (Diminished) - B - 7

So based on this we can build chord progressions based within the key.

Lets use a ii-V-I (2 - 5 - 1) progression for this example.

So if we take the 2 chord (D minor) the 5 Chord (G major) and the 1 Chord (the C Major) and play them in succession we get a ii - V - I chord progression. If we expand on this into soloing over this progression, you can play D Dorian over the D minor chord, G Mixolydian, over the G Major Chord, and C Ionian, over the C major chord

There are a million other options but for now to keep this "SIMPLE" we will just name those.

But how do you know what a D Dorian or a F Lydian Scale is?

That my friends is the most SIMPLE part of Music Theory. If you know the notes of the Major Scale you know ALL of your modes. The easiest explination is a Mode is a Scale staring on a Degree in a Major scale and continuing that scale through its octave. CONFUSING I KNOW, but onece you SEE it you will understand. Look at the example below:

C - D - E - F - G - A - B - C ( C - Ionian Mode )
D - E - F - G - A - B - C - D (D - Dorian Mode )
E - F - G - A - B - C - D - E (E - Phrygian Mode )
F - G - A - B - C - D - E - F ( F - Lydian Mode )
G - A - B - C - D - E - F - G ( G - Mixolydian Mode)
A - B - C - D - E - F - G - A (A - Aeolian Mode)
B - C - D - E - F - G - A - B ( B - Locrian Mode)

See the Pattern? Make Sense?

If you play all the notes of a C Major Scale starting from D and playing through D you get the D - Dorian Mode, If you play all the notes of a C Major Scale from A to A (octave) you get the A - Aeolian Mode.

See how easy that is

Part 4: Expansion into other keys

You can use the above examples starting from any Major scale. Lets use F major for our next example. The note of the F Major Scale are F - G - A - Bb - C - D - E

So that gives us:
Ionian (Major) - F - 1
Dorian (Minor) - G - 2
Phrygian (Minor) - A - 3
Lydian (Major) - Bb - 4
Mixolydian (Major) - C - 5
Aeolian (Minor) - D - 6
Locrian (Diminished) - E- 7

So if we have a progression that is A minor, D minor and F Major what modes should we play over each chord?

(scroll down for answer)











If you said A Phrygian over the A, D Aeolian over the D and F Ionian over the F major then you got it right! THATS MUSIC THEORY!!!

Ok guys I have to get back to work but thats the basics of how music theory works

I will explans on 9th's 11th's and 13ths later .... I just have to get back to work

Quickly, if you keep counting into the next octave the 2nd becomes the 9th and so on ....

----------------------------------------------------------------

Now all of that being said .....

It all depends on the chords you are playing as to what will work and not work. Locrian is a very dark scale but you cant use it over the V chord in any key cause it has the flat 5th. If you play the VII chord then you cant use Harmonic Minor as it has an augmented 7th. If you have a flat 5 then its tough to use the "minor" over it cause it creates tension with the natural 5th.

But in general when you want a "dark" sound go for:

Minor
Locrian
Super Locrian
Harmonic Minor
Phrygian Dominant (5th mode of Harmonic Minor)
Hugrian Minor
Neopolitan
Dorian Flat 5
 
I have since come up with my own method for learning modes which is a combination of fretboard knowledge and using theory in real time, a little bit of work but the result is the ability to play almost any mode at the drop of a hat without having to memorize a million different patterns in 3000 different keys lol.

The lazy ass mofo in me would be really interested in this, since the memorizing game is not my cup of tea.
 
I vote for Lydian!

yeah ... Lydian

honestly though, I couldn't tell you a fucking thing about what key any of my own shit is in, so I'm probably of no use to you in this.

I suck anyway ... maybe I'll try to learn a little of this theory shit too so I can the whole thing
 
I cant beleive nobody posted a link to my theory lesson ...lol


I did read and remember your post. Yours is specific to music theory which is great and all should learn but what I wanted to show was how to put said info onto the fretboard in real time, what I call guitar theory as apposed to music theory.

With it coming up to xmas and with a young family, time is a little tight but I will try to get something down soon.

Don't mean to step on your toes Guitar Guru I really don't. We could even join the info together to make a super thread if you like?
 
Just 2 quotes from Star Wars, very useful for music writting.
Yoda: "Reach out. Sense the Force around you."
Obi-Wan: "Trust your feelings, Luke."


Close your eyes, young Padawan, don't think about theory and build your solo with your senses, not mathematically.

Here it is a tutorial:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uIMXsacUlDA&feature=related[/ame]
 
Hirajoshi may not work in this context as it is based on the Lydian scale. Depending on his progression and "where" he starts the scale from its plausible but unlikely it will work.

Hirajoshi has a MAJOR sound to it due to it being a 5 note (pentatonic) scale based on the Lydian mode. Lydian is a "major" but the notes of the Hirajoshi avoid the minor 3rd and then there is the the flat 6th which may or may not work.

The notes in this case would be: C# - E - F# - G# - B the C# and E combination will give you a Major tonality :)

Edit .. fucking brain farts said "augmented" 6th instead of flat ...lol
Edit 2.. Lydian is MAJOR not Minor ...lol
 
Well the solo should be a composition within a composition. Thus is the solo over a single note/chord or is there a progression? Do you want to play the solo over the progression? If so the notes of the progression would make up your scale. Do you want to play the changes of the progression? If so then the notes of the chord in question dictate the scale to be played over that chord.

When you say "a dark" scale do you mean simply minor tonality or do you mean dissonant?
 
Hirajoshi may not work in this context as it is based on the Lydian scale. Depending on his progression and "where" he starts the scale from its plausible but unlikely it will work.

Hirajoshi has a MAJOR sound to it due to it being a 5 note (pentatonic) scale based on the Lydian mode. Lydian is a "minor" but the notes of the Hirajoshi avoid the minor 3rd and then there is the the flat 6th which may or may not work.

The notes in this case would be: C# - E - F# - G# - B the C# and E combination will give you a Major tonality :)

Edit .. fucking brain farts said "augmented" 6th instead of flat ...lol


But.. Lydian is a major scale... and the Hirajoshi scale is a minor scale.
 
The hirajoshi is neither major nor minor, its a pentatonic scale which is neither. Its a-tonal

That's like saying a minor pentetonic scale isn't minor..


the Hirajoshi scale has both a minor third and minor sixth, making it a minor scale.

When trying to distinguish whether a scale is minor or major, you always look to the third and sixth of a scale..

Hirajoshi Scale= root, major 2nd, minor 3rd, perfect 5th, minor 6th, and an octave
 
Pentatonics come in both flavors, major and minor. Major pentatonic is great for country/jazz, minor pentatonic is good for blues, rock, metal.

anyway, here is a link to the thread I said I may make a few posts ago.
This is lesson one of a series of maybe up to 10 lessons about how best to use modes and scales without learning to read music or memorize a million patterns.

http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/...ing-down-guitar-scales-modes.html#post9564380

I hope all that requested it get something useful out of it.

Cheers.
 
NS you said you went to MIT or GIT?

Then you should know that Pentatonics are neither minor or major and are interchangeable within a key.

Lets take the key of E Maj (C# Minor)

Play me 3 chords in the key of C# minor and play the Hirojoshi scale over it and you will see it has a "Major" tonality and not minor due to the E being the 3rd. It's because E is the relative Major in the key of C#. its very difficult to explain, you just have to hear it and it gets into things like cyclical octaves, and how notes ring together. If you play a C# minor triad, with an E major triad over it your ear naturally pulls you to the "major" sound instead of the minor.

Try it, the results are quite shocking.
 
NS you said you went to MIT or GIT?

Then you should know that Pentatonics are neither minor or major and are interchangeable within a key.

Well I have been playing Pentatonic majors and minors for years as far as I knew.
Em Pentatonic scale starting on the 12th fret of the low E string...
e|-|-O-|---|---|-o-|---|
B|-|-o-|---|---|-o-|---|
G|-|-o-|---|-o-|---|---|
D|-|-o-|---|-O-|---|---|
A|-|-o-|---|-o-|---|---|
E|-|-O-|---|---|-o-|---|
The first two notes are 12th fret 'E' and 15th fret 'G'.
This is a minor 3rd.