Anyone here NOT believe in the death penalty? If so, do

[Demilich]

sounds like a very fine line away from saying "just knock off the elderly, disabled, homeless, addicts, mentally handicapped... what do they contribute to society?"

 

[skeptik]

even if the guy "rots in jail", he's still living off of my tax dollars and yours. just get rid of him. what is he adding to society?

You're forgetting that going through the legal process of execution costs more than keeping a prisoner behind bars for life, but okay. And nevermind all of the innocent people that have been executed and the thousands more that almost were but were proven innocent.

 

[Reign in Acai]

Then kill me first, as I support it more than just about any one. Senseless violence? No, that would be raping a 79 year old lady after she's blundgeoned with a hammer. Senseless violence? That would be kidnapping a child, tying the boy to a radiator, and feeding him dog food inbetween molestations. Senseless violence? That is what I call the stray bullet that is lodged in to the temporal lobe of a 9 yr old girl as she rides her bicycle down Crenshaw Blvd. The only thing that I consider SENSELESS, is the crowd of liberals standing outside a state penitentiary with a sign that says "Save Tookie". These people do not deserve an extra minute of oxygen, nor do they deserve valuable economic resources that can be diverted to a worthier cause. The gift of life should be a privilege, not a right. Especially considering the fact that we are nearing our carrying capacity with every minute of the clock. For every starving child in the Sudan, a parasite sits in a cell with food in his belly and an entertaining read in his hands. While a vulture circles a withering child from Nepal, a misguided deviant exercises on a prisonyard, getting stronger for his next kill for when the system eventually crumbles before his feet. As Greg pointed out, capital punishment needs to be extended to encompass rape and molestation, not only for the extreme cases, but for every case that it was tried and convicted. One strike you're out, there is no repentance. Have you liberals found God in the past 24 hours?!? What purpose do these scum serve? Other than target practice for U.S Marines during Rifle Qual? Fuck this shit!

 

[skeptik]

Just because raping a 79 year old lady after she's bludgeoned with a hammer is senseless violence doesn't mean hanging the person who did it isn't also senseless violence. Why does it make such a tremendous difference to you whether somebody is dead or whether they're simply in jail? Either way they can't commit any crimes outside of the prison walls, and with them still alive at least it's humane.

And life IS a right, not a privilege, regardless of what you want it to be, so you can't base decisions on it that way. Who are you to judge people's value as a human being? An angry, embittered bigot who doesn't give a shit about anyone but his own friends and family, apparently. And stop using "liberal" as a pejorative, it's terribly immature.

 

[J.]

You're forgetting that going through the legal process of execution costs more than keeping a prisoner behind bars for life, but okay. And nevermind all of the innocent people that have been executed and the thousands more that almost were but were proven innocent.

The legal process is something that needs to be overhauled, obviously. Forget these countless appeals and bullshit.

It also helps with the overcrowding problem, which is prevalent in the US.

As far as the innocent, fortunately things have improved to help remedy that problem. Nothing's perfect.

 

[J.]

Why does it make such a tremendous difference to you whether somebody is dead or whether they're simply in jail? Either way they can't commit any crimes outside of the prison walls, and with them still alive at least it's humane.

WHy is it so important for the state to be humane, when the convicted (assuming he did it) obviously was not? Of course, it sounds like revenge, but until you or I are in the victim's families' shoes, we really cannot know how it feels and what the guilty's sentence should be.

In fact, is it so far-fetched to try the criminal and if he is found guilty, to let the victim's family decide his fate? SOunds fair.

And life IS a right, not a privilege

Something the criminal long since forgot (as far as murderers go, anyhow).

 

[skeptik]

The victim's family deciding the criminal's fate? Fuck no. The victim's family should be the LAST people to decide the fate of the criminal, because their response would be completely irrational and instinctual based on hatred and the desire for revenge. The victim's family has rights, but NOT in so far as it infringes upon the rights of others, including the criminal. Why would you want the most irrational people making decisions?

 

[J.]

The victim's family deciding the criminal's fate? Fuck no. The victim's family should be the LAST people to decide the fate of the criminal, because their response would be completely irrational and instinctual based on hatred and the desire for revenge. The victim's family has rights, but NOT in so far as it infringes upon the rights of others, including the criminal. Why would you want the most irrational people making decisions?

The criminal did not infringe upon the victim's right to live (as you put it), or live peacefully? He was being rational, then?

Once convicted, the criminal* ceases rights. Or should be so.



*I'm talking utmost offenders. Not white collar crimes.

 

[Reign in Acai]

The fact that you believe a murderer is entitled to rights blows my mind. Go out and see the world, you know instead of staying locked in doors on a Friday night memorizing every bands discography on metal-archives ye hermitical helot of self imposed handjobbing. When you see a cockroach scamper across your kitchen floor, do you immediately shoe it in to a matchbox? God forbid you play the role of Deity and take his right to exist away with a swift spurt of RAID. See to me, these vile inhabitants who take innocent life, are on the same level of that of cockroaches. Much like you need to take a rabid hunting dog, and put a bullet behind his ear to preserve the cows, pigs, horses, and hens on a farm, would you need do the same to a murderous fiend to preserve the lives of innocents who could one day be his meal of manslaughter. There are countless number of cases where the convicted is sentenced to 10-15 years, or less. Is this an adequate punishment in your pussified pupils?!? Probably so, because you're a little sheltered sissy, who couldn't comprehend the sorrow inflicted on families a thousand-fold every year. God, how comforting would it be to know that your children could walk the streets at 8pm without being skewered by a revolving door felon. One strike you're out! How hard is it to not commit crime?!? Not very hard at all.


Note- That I was planning on remaining civil, but hey it seemed like you wish to get personal, so fuck ye mate!

 

[General Zod]

Why does it make such a tremendous difference to you whether somebody is dead or whether they're simply in jail?

Because we, as taxpayers, have to pay to keep that person in jail. I believe a 20 year sentence costs taxpayers $500,000.

Either way they can't commit any crimes outside of the prison walls, and with them still alive at least it's humane.

Is locking someone in a 6 x 9 cell, for 167 out of 168 hour week, humane? And for those not in lockdown, is having them live in constant fear for their life, of being raped and/or beaten by other inmates, in a 6 x 9 cell, humane? If I had my choice between lethal injection and a life in prison, I'd opt for the needle.

And life IS a right, not a privilege, regardless of what you want it to be, so you can't base decisions on it that way.

It is society that determines what is and what isn't a right, as well as which rights may be taken away. So, the fact that you consider life to be a right, doesn't support your arguement.

Who are you to judge people's value as a human being?

I am Zod.

Zod

 

[JayKeeley]

Do you think this person recognizes his own mental sickness?

I'm just wondering if a lot of these completely sick human beings would actually prefer to be killed and put out of their own misery, than go to jail. Obviously they're too cowardly to throw themselves off a bridge, so perhaps the death pentaly can be seen as a form of euthanasia.

 

[Hell Mike]

Is locking someone in a 6 x 9 cell, for 167 out of 168 hour week, humane? And for those not in lockdown, is having them live in constant fear for their life, of being raped and/or beaten by other inmates, in a 6 x 9 cell, humane? If I had my choice between lethal injection and a life in prison, I'd opt for the needle.

This is the argument pro-PUNISH-people should read.

 

[Krigloch the Furious]

Then kill me first, as I support it more than just about any one. Senseless violence? No, that would be raping a 79 year old lady after she's blundgeoned with a hammer. Senseless violence? That would be kidnapping a child, tying the boy to a radiator, and feeding him dog food inbetween molestations. Senseless violence? That is what I call the stray bullet that is lodged in to the temporal lobe of a 9 yr old girl as she rides her bicycle down Crenshaw Blvd. The only thing that I consider SENSELESS, is the crowd of liberals standing outside a state penitentiary with a sign that says "Save Tookie". These people do not deserve an extra minute of oxygen, nor do they deserve valuable economic resources that can be diverted to a worthier cause. The gift of life should be a privilege, not a right. Especially considering the fact that we are nearing our carrying capacity with every minute of the clock. For every starving child in the Sudan, a parasite sits in a cell with food in his belly and an entertaining read in his hands. While a vulture circles a withering child from Nepal, a misguided deviant exercises on a prisonyard, getting stronger for his next kill for when the system eventually crumbles before his feet. As Greg pointed out, capital punishment needs to be extended to encompass rape and molestation, not only for the extreme cases, but for every case that it was tried and convicted. One strike you're out, there is no repentance. Have you liberals found God in the past 24 hours?!? What purpose do these scum serve? Other than target practice for U.S Marines during Rifle Qual? Fuck this shit!

thank you!

dont bother arguing with dodens on this subject.

 

[skeptik]

Christ, I go to cut my grandmother's lawn and this happens. I'll take this one by one.

The criminal did not infringe upon the victim's right to live (as you put it), or live peacefully? He was being rational, then?

Once convicted, the criminal* ceases rights. Or should be so.



*I'm talking utmost offenders. Not white collar crimes.

Yes, the criminal clearly violated the rights of another person. That is why he goes to jail. He has proven that (at the moment) he is unable to function in a normal capacity among others in society, therefore he is locked away. He doesn't revoke his right to live, the very basest of rights. Your right to live has nothing to do with any government, it's nature. You have a "right" to live. If somebody takes that away from you, they've violated that right. But taking away that person's right to life doesn't solve a damn thing, and is hypocritical.

The fact that you believe a murderer is entitled to rights blows my mind.

I've noticed.

Go out and see the world, you know instead of staying locked in doors on a Friday night memorizing every bands discography on metal-archives ye hermitical helot of self imposed handjobbing.

Cute. My very own mini-RiA rant.

When you see a cockroach scamper across your kitchen floor, do you immediately shoe it in to a matchbox? God forbid you play the role of Deity and take his right to exist away with a swift spurt of RAID.

Amazingly enough, human beings are not cockroaches, and generally, no I wouldn't kill an insect if I didn't have to.

See to me, these vile inhabitants who take innocent life, are on the same level of that of cockroaches. Much like you need to take a rabid hunting dog, and put a bullet behind his ear to preserve the cows, pigs, horses, and hens on a farm, would you need do the same to a murderous fiend to preserve the lives of innocents who could one day be his meal of manslaughter.

Why do you have to kill the dog to stop him from killing? Is keeping him indoors whenever you're not with him so overwhelmingly difficult?

There are countless number of cases where the convicted is sentenced to 10-15 years, or less. Is this an adequate punishment in your pussified pupils?!?

No. The judicial system is far from perfect. And we're only talking about the distinction between life imprisonment and the death penalty, so why you bring up a lesser sentence, I have no idea, because it has no bearing on this conversation. I've been very critical of the judicial system for a while now and have laid out my thoughts about this a number of times in various places, so don't think I'm any happier with it than you are.

Probably so, because you're a little sheltered sissy, who couldn't comprehend the sorrow inflicted on families a thousand-fold every year.

Of course not. My life is rosy. I've never had any problems in my life. I know nobody who's been murdered. I sit here in my bubble all day and pretend that I know shit about music.

God, how comforting would it be to know that your children could walk the streets at 8pm without being skewered by a revolving door felon. One strike you're out! How hard is it to not commit crime?!? Not very hard at all.

A criminal in prison for his entire life has the same opportunity to rape your mother as a dead one.

Note- That I was planning on remaining civil, but hey it seemed like you wish to get personal, so fuck ye mate!

I don't remember getting "personal," but if I did, whatever. It's the internet, not a big deal, and I'll try to be more wary of doing that in the future.

Because we, as taxpayers, have to pay to keep that person in jail. I believe a 20 year sentence costs taxpayers $500,000.

Are you forgetting that it costs more to kill an inmate than keep him alive? The information is readily available to all on this matter, it's not a secret. But matters of life and death shouldn't be reduced to how much more pocket change you have to dish out anyway, at least not the way I see it.

Is locking someone in a 6 x 9 cell, for 167 out of 168 hour week, humane? And for those not in lockdown, is having them live in constant fear for their life, of being raped and/or beaten by other inmates, in a 6 x 9 cell, humane? If I had my choice between lethal injection and a life in prison, I'd opt for the needle.

Firstly, that's you. Millions of others wouldn't make that decision. And if they do, then kill them. I have no problem stopping a man that wants to die, so long as it doesn't infringe upon the rights of others. Secondly, those issues are a matter of penitentiary standards, which I'm not happy with either. I would like to see a massive overhaul of the prison system, to be perfectly honest.

It is society that determines what is and what isn't a right, as well as which rights may be taken away. So, the fact that you consider life to be a right, doesn't support your arguement.

Your right to live and to continue living is a matter of nature. If you're alive, you have the "right" to live. No government should have the right to tell you that you can no longer live. It should also be noted that the US is one of very few first world countries that retain the death penalty.

I am Zod.

Hi.

Do you think this person recognizes his own mental sickness?

I'm just wondering if a lot of these completely sick human beings would actually prefer to be killed and put out of their own misery, than go to jail. Obviously they're too cowardly to throw themselves off a bridge, so perhaps the death pentaly can be seen as a form of euthanasia.

Well I would like to leave that decision up to them whether or not they'd care to continue living, but like I said earlier, I have no problem with voluntary euthansia. I've known a handful of people who've wanted to die, some of whom managed to succeed, and I have no problem with that. One case that we all would be familiar with would be John Nodtveidt. He wanted to die (or felt that he'd accomplished his purpose or whatever), and blew his brains out. Good for him, he got what he wanted.

 

[EricT]

hermitical helot of self imposed handjobbing.

Mind if I steal that? I like that...

 

[Dazed and Brutal]

Your right to live and to continue living is a matter of nature. If you're alive, you have the "right" to live. No government should have the right to tell you that you can no longer live. It should also be noted that the US is one of very few first world countries that retain the death penalty.

Best point made so far, very convincing. Though if I saw this guy anywhere I would end his "right" to live. As far as I'm concerned the government is only ridding of people that don't DESERVE to live. They need to keep these people out of jail for the safety of the inmates as well, but i'm sure you don't give a fuck if they put some crazed maniac in a prison where he has an oppurtunity to cause more trouble. If judical systems decides to sentence someone to death, they're apparently a danger anywhere you decide to put them.

 

[skeptik]

Why would I stop rights at the level of inmates? Obviously inmates should not be infringing upon one another's rights either, and if one of them continues to do so, they should be kept in solitary confinement if they can't possibly not harm other people. But killing that person would be unnecessary.

 

[Dazed and Brutal]

It is unnecessary , but it's only fair.

 

[IOfTheStorm]

For every starving child in the Sudan, a parasite sits in a cell with food in his belly and an entertaining read in his hands. While a vulture circles a withering child from Nepal, a misguided deviant exercises on a prisonyard, getting stronger for his next kill for when the system eventually crumbles before his feet.

HahAHhahAHahahAHAHHAHAHahhaHahahaahHA

 

[skeptik]

It is unnecessary , but it's only fair.

Nah. It's never fair to take away another person's life when it's unnecessary, even if the person whose life you plan to take away has done the same. All that does is make two incidences of unjustified violation of basic human rights instead of one.