Bin Laden is dead.
- Thread starter Magius
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freakchylde
PPUSA Driver o' Doom!!!!!
Try telling that to a Danish Rebel Civil War re-enactor, while sitting in a bar in Copenhagen....along with the concepts behind the Constitution. Thankfully, he was drunk, and Claus was working on getting me drunk - and succeeding.
Yippee38
Living the dream!
I would add that if you believe everything your government tells you, you're frikken crazy.
OrbWeaver
BECAUSE FALCONER
AngraRULES
Member
Palabra de Dios
Heavy Metal Weatherman
While it is certainly well within a person's right and likely responsibility to willfully question information every day, to take it to a degree where you truly believe that every bit of news you receive is somehow soaked in a lipid-layer of translucent bullshit is irresponsible. As a journalist, it is my job to report facts and attribute those facts to trustworthy sources. If no one trusts the source, then no one trusts the facts. If there was a major cover-up of anything significant, THAT would be the news. We would find it out.
I truly believe that it is reasonable to say that you feel certain aspects of Bin Laden's death could be fishy...but remember that it is part of a painfully thought-out and time-consuming war tactic that we are not supposed to know that much about. Question it. Do. But don't take it to a level where you believe that each maneuver we make in the war effort has some type of political agenda or hidden motive behind it.
I'm glad that Metal Madman stated he was sarcastic with the "Osama's been dead for years" comment, but c'mon dude...there are people who do believe that and even you must admit that it's unreasonable to have that view of the world which is based not on fact but actually non-factual and illogical reasoning. I say illogical reasoning because it makes absolutely no sense to me to say "I don't believe this is true. Therefore, the opposite must be true." That doesn't add up.
I think any intelligent, informed citizen would know by now that they're not supposed to know everything that goes on behind closed doors in the government and military. We get what they need us to hear. And that is okay. And it is also very much okay to think that it sucks that we can't know more.
But where I get annoyed is when people take this "question everything" ideal which is great and turn it into "President Obama is one of the Reptilian Elite members of the New World Order Illuminati who basically govern the world and have for millennia. The evidence is in the chemical contrails sprayed by our government airplanes."
So yeah, question everything. But keep your theories reasonable.
I truly believe that it is reasonable to say that you feel certain aspects of Bin Laden's death could be fishy...but remember that it is part of a painfully thought-out and time-consuming war tactic that we are not supposed to know that much about. Question it. Do. But don't take it to a level where you believe that each maneuver we make in the war effort has some type of political agenda or hidden motive behind it.
I'm glad that Metal Madman stated he was sarcastic with the "Osama's been dead for years" comment, but c'mon dude...there are people who do believe that and even you must admit that it's unreasonable to have that view of the world which is based not on fact but actually non-factual and illogical reasoning. I say illogical reasoning because it makes absolutely no sense to me to say "I don't believe this is true. Therefore, the opposite must be true." That doesn't add up.
I think any intelligent, informed citizen would know by now that they're not supposed to know everything that goes on behind closed doors in the government and military. We get what they need us to hear. And that is okay. And it is also very much okay to think that it sucks that we can't know more.
But where I get annoyed is when people take this "question everything" ideal which is great and turn it into "President Obama is one of the Reptilian Elite members of the New World Order Illuminati who basically govern the world and have for millennia. The evidence is in the chemical contrails sprayed by our government airplanes."
So yeah, question everything. But keep your theories reasonable.
DuchessOfDork
Member
- Feb 9, 2009
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No Username
Member
I don't understand why people are so happy about this. The REAL leaders of the terrorist world are the financiers--people strap bombs on their backs in part because of payoffs to their next of kin. Once we cut off the money supply to terrorists, terror will no longer be a problem on our planet.
Until then, as long as some maniac has 5 million dollars to buy a nuke, NONE of us are safe. Osama is dead. Long live the Saudi Royals!
Until then, as long as some maniac has 5 million dollars to buy a nuke, NONE of us are safe. Osama is dead. Long live the Saudi Royals!
AeonicSlumber
srs
- Aug 14, 2008
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You do realize that most of the money for 9/11 came from Bin Laden via his extremely wealthy family right?
And of all the things said in this thread, the notion of terror no longer being a problem on this planet is probably the most silly dude. C'mon...
And of all the things said in this thread, the notion of terror no longer being a problem on this planet is probably the most silly dude. C'mon...
AngraRULES
Member
I think this achievement has a lot of significance, but more so in a symbolical way. Bin Laden was Al Qaeda's "spiritual leader" if you would. Will his death necessarily make us safer? I don't think so. That being said, you can't take credit away from this administration - it's been a long time coming, and I believe this shows that President Obama has more balls than most people thought he did.
I think justice has been done for sure. If anything, it gives closure to some people who were directly affected by 9/11.
And one last thought, I think there's a lot more to focus on right now than whether this was a stupid conspiracy theory or not. The same case was with the whole Obama's birth certificate thing. Get real people. Regardless of your political affiliation or preference, focus on what really matters now. We already get plenty of drama outside of our politics - adding more to it won't make anything easier on anyone.
I think justice has been done for sure. If anything, it gives closure to some people who were directly affected by 9/11.
And one last thought, I think there's a lot more to focus on right now than whether this was a stupid conspiracy theory or not. The same case was with the whole Obama's birth certificate thing. Get real people. Regardless of your political affiliation or preference, focus on what really matters now. We already get plenty of drama outside of our politics - adding more to it won't make anything easier on anyone.
AeonicSlumber
srs
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Palabra de Dios
Heavy Metal Weatherman
And it gives closure to those who have returned from war as new veterans in the recent wars.
It is not "Mission Accomplished"...but it is "Something Finally Accomplished."
DuchessOfDork
Member
- Feb 9, 2009
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See, this is why I felt uncomfortable celebrating too much.
When 9-11 happened, I had to watch my friend try and call her mother over and over again, just to find out she died in the Pentagon attack. I feel it's not my place to "celebrate", so much as to feel a sense of relief that this douchebag won't be around to inspire more attacks.
What really irked me about this guy, though, was what he did during the last moments of his life; use a woman as a human shield. She died in front of him, the final act of the ultimate coward.
EDIT: Thought it was his wife; turned out to be the wife of a friend.
All that matters is we got the sonofabitch. He was such a coward that he had to hide behind his wife! Sad part is that someone will take his place. So, it will be business as usual.
Mosquito
oh noes!!
While I would have preferred that they had captured him rather than killing him, the story is obviously that there was a shoot out which isn't really that surprising of course. Capturing him would avoid martyrdom and if Al-Qaeda views their leader as captured, then nobody would rise within Al-Qaeda as a new "leader" (in whatever capacity that Bin Laden was leading in the last few years, which is something we don't (the general USA populace) know).
Aside from that, as much as he deserved it, death is always terrible.
But the people out there celebrating? Ok, I get that to a degree. A little celebration for the accomplishment and some closure to those who have lost loved ones either in 9/11 directly, the rescuers dying now from cancer or other ailments, or those in the armed forces.
But at the same time people should look at themselves and what's going on around them and not get too caught up in the moment. Why? First of all, how does this make us any better than the people roaming the streets on 9/11 in foreign countries that don't exactly have a friendly relationship with us? Singing and chanting in the streets, signs with 'death to osama' (or in their case 'death to the usa'), flags everywhere, etc. is exactly the behaviour they exhibited, and now we're doing the same thing. Second, remember the months following 9/11 with all the fervor and "patriotism" that the USA experienced. Now look at various laws passed in order to protect various freedoms. Do not put it past a government to use the fervor that we may experience with Bin Laden's demise and try to pass new laws, good or bad.
I'm glad that on some level that justice was served, but at the same time we don't need to be barbaric about it and we need to keep our eyes open for those that would use this success to harm us as a country.
Aside from that, as much as he deserved it, death is always terrible.
But the people out there celebrating? Ok, I get that to a degree. A little celebration for the accomplishment and some closure to those who have lost loved ones either in 9/11 directly, the rescuers dying now from cancer or other ailments, or those in the armed forces.
But at the same time people should look at themselves and what's going on around them and not get too caught up in the moment. Why? First of all, how does this make us any better than the people roaming the streets on 9/11 in foreign countries that don't exactly have a friendly relationship with us? Singing and chanting in the streets, signs with 'death to osama' (or in their case 'death to the usa'), flags everywhere, etc. is exactly the behaviour they exhibited, and now we're doing the same thing. Second, remember the months following 9/11 with all the fervor and "patriotism" that the USA experienced. Now look at various laws passed in order to protect various freedoms. Do not put it past a government to use the fervor that we may experience with Bin Laden's demise and try to pass new laws, good or bad.
I'm glad that on some level that justice was served, but at the same time we don't need to be barbaric about it and we need to keep our eyes open for those that would use this success to harm us as a country.
Justin G
Member
Hey, that's entirely too rational. We don't do that here!
Seriously though, you make some very good points. I get feeling a sense of relief and justice, as well as pride in the people who made this happen (and that absolutely includes the President). It's a righteous feeling. It shouldn't be the theme of a keg party though.
Pellaz
Tigron of Immanion
LOL, srsly?!
Absolutely. I'll admit I was pretty excited at the Amon Amarth show when a friend called me and told me about Osama's demise, and I started spreading the word amongst friends. It's certainly an achievement to feel pride in and provides closure not just to the 9/11 victims' families, but also to the US forces who have labored over the years to help bring this about.
Kudos to the President for making the right call in sending in SEAL Team 6 instead of dropping a few JDAMs on the compound. Apparently he was considering the latter, but decided against it because he was told it would leave the compound a pile of rubble. (Gosh, really?)
I was a bit dismayed at the narcissism in Obama's speech, but I give him credit for calling George W. Bush as soon as they knew "Geronimo" was dead -- if anyone deserved closure, it was GWB. Remember, it was his much-criticized policy of CIA interrogations that made this attack possible. (We discovered the identity of Osama's courier via CIA interrogation during Bush's term, and the courier -- plus signal intelligence -- was the only way we found the compound.)
