Capitalism vs Communism

[Dak]

if you can't agree with post 278 you're an idiot

So in other words you have no idea.

 

[monoxide_child]

Why? All work is not equal, and who determined 40 is the magic number and why?

i'm not implying all work is equal
actually just the opposite
i'm saying that in many cases the higher-paying jobs actually require less work
where certain CEOs are getting paid billions a year for doing absolutely nothing
and min wage workers are doing grueling work just to put food on the fucking table

"who determined that 40 is the magic number?" laughing out loud at the idea that you think the answer to this question is actually relevant to this convo

working at your job more than 40 hours a work-week is (in america) considered "cruel and unusual punishment"
that's where "the number 40" came from
instead of making someone work more than 40, i as an employer would just give my workers enough per hour that they don't need to work more than 40, so that they've got enough time to spend time with family/sleep/date/do what ever else employed people want to do when they're not at work

 

[Dak]

i'm not implying all work is equal
actually just the opposite
i'm saying that in many cases the higher-paying jobs actually require less work
where certain CEOs are getting paid billions a year for doing absolutely nothing
and min wage workers are doing grueling work just to put food on the fucking table

"who determined that 40 is the magic number?" laughing out loud at the idea that you think the answer to this question is actually relevant to this convo

working at your job more than 40 hours a work-week is (in america) considered "cruel and unusual punishment"
that's where "the number 40" came from
instead of making someone work more than 40, i as an employer would just give my workers enough per hour that they don't need to work more than 40, so that they've got enough time to spend time with family/sleep/date/do what ever else employed people want to do when they're not at work

Sounds like you have economics and business figured out. You should start a business and show the world the right way to do things. I'm sure you will be a spectacular success.

 

[monoxide_child]

Sounds like you have economics and business figured out. You should start a business and show the world the right way to do things. I'm sure you will be a spectacular success.

now say it without the sarcasm

 

[Werckmeister Harmonies]

I wish I was an internet libertarian, a stalinist or a moralist zealot. Everything is so simple when you have some shitty ideological dogma that relieves you of the burden of having to think or observe the world around you like it is, not how your dogma says it should be. sigh.

 

[Dak]

I wish I was an internet libertarian, a stalinist or a moralist zealot. Everything is so simple when you have some shitty ideological dogma that relieves you of the burden of having to think or observe the world around you like it is, not how your dogma says it should be. sigh.

So in other words, people who do not agree with you do not think?

 

[monoxide_child]

So in other words, people who do not agree with you do not think?

not neccassarilly ALL of the people
but yeah that was the general idea
lots of people in USA "don't think" in ways that seem to be unique to USA
like, for example, NRA Conspiracy nuts, homophobics, white supremisists, and those the people that will vote for a republican president just merely because they're too unobservant to notice the patern of
Democrat president >>>>>> Republican president
honestly is scares me that anyone is really stupid enough to vote for a republican candidate

 

[monoxide_child]

now say it without the sarcasm

.

 

[Givememetalorgivemedeath]

Most people who are poor in America are poor for the most part because they have made bad choices in life. There are a lot of people who don't put themselves in a position to succeed. Everyone gets a free education in America, so unless you have some physical limitations, there is no excuse.

I'm not sure why people think that those of us who have by and large made better choices should have to pay for people who make chronic bad choices.

 

[monoxide_child]

Most people who are poor in America are poor for the most part because they have made bad choices in life

this sentence^^^ is bullshit
which BTW was actually my whole freaking point

 

[Dak]

not neccassarilly ALL of the people
but yeah that was the general idea
lots of people in USA "don't think" in ways that seem to be unique to USA
like, for example, NRA Conspiracy nuts, homophobics, white supremisists, and those the people that will vote for a republican president just merely because they're too unobservant to notice the patern of
Democrat president >>>>>> Republican president
honestly is scares me that anyone is really stupid enough to vote for a republican candidate

Kind of like ad-hom slingin welfare mooching thieving homeless people, ad hom slinging corporate welfare moochin thieving "Mad Men", workophobics, black supremacists, and those people that will vote for a democratic politician just merely because their too unobservant to notice the pattern of Democratic president = Republican President.

Honestly it scares me that anyone is really stupid enough to vote for any candidates at all.

 

[noise in my mind]

two different ways to enslave people

 

[AllShallFall]

There needs to be a fucking perfect blend of the two!

 

[gozutennou]

Quote:
Lysander Spooner, John Locke, Friedrich Hayek, Murray Rothbard,

LOVE these guys.

I always love that libertarians and 'Anarcho'-Capitalists love Lysander Spooner and hate the other socialist anarchists and regular socialists, but forgot that Mister Spooner was a socialist himself. He also was a member of the first socialist internationale !. And a individualist anarchist, Individualist anarchists are also socialists.

I know what you are going to say and reuse the same argument that: 'In his time, socialism was a much more broad term'. When people say that I think. Is socialism now much narrower now than in that time ?

And why aren't you a fan of Benjamin tucker. Also a famous anarchist. but no, the only reason that libertarians and ancaps love him is because Rothbard had a hard one for him.

 

[monoxide_child]

this sentence^^^ is bullshit
which BTW was actually my whole freaking point

seriously
you can't just lump all "ppor people" under one umbrella
there are lots of different reasons for people being "poor"

 

[Dak]

I always love that libertarians and 'Anarcho'-Capitalists love Lysander Spooner and hate the other socialist anarchists and regular socialists, but forgot that Mister Spooner was a socialist himself. He also was a member of the first socialist internationale !. And a individualist anarchist, Individualist anarchists are also socialists.

I know what you are going to say and reuse the same argument that: 'In his time, socialism was a much more broad term'. When people say that I think. Is socialism now much narrower now than in that time ?

And why aren't you a fan of Benjamin tucker. Also a famous anarchist. but no, the only reason that libertarians and ancaps love him is because Rothbard had a hard one for him.

One can agree with a lot of what a person had to say without agreeing with all of it. Duh.

 

[Summerian]

Most people who are poor in America are poor for the most part because they have made bad choices in life. There are a lot of people who don't put themselves in a position to succeed. Everyone gets a free education in America, so unless you have some physical limitations, there is no excuse.

I'm not sure why people think that those of us who have by and large made better choices should have to pay for people who make chronic bad choices.

Yep...
Should have picked better parents, those poor people.
It's not like money has anything to do with poverty.
Maybe those who think those of us who have by and large made better choices should have to pay for people who make chronic bad choices think that if political capital can't (or shouldn't) go from father to son, monetary capital shouldn't either - in the interest of a just society?
Stop watching FOX.

 

[matt schrauben]

Yep...
Should have picked better parents, those poor people.
It's not like money has anything to do with poverty.
Maybe those who think those of us who have by and large made better choices should have to pay for people who make chronic bad choices think that if political capital can't (or shouldn't) go from father to son, monetary capital shouldn't either - in the interest of a just society?
Stop watching FOX.

There are plenty of people who have grown up in ‘less than ideal’ situations and have achieved success through their determination and hard work. However, there are plenty that haven’t.

I largely agree with what you are saying. Where and how people are brought up obviously affects just about every aspect of their life. Some people weren’t brought up to make ‘better choices’ so to speak, they never had a role model, so to blame them for their current state is both unfair and extremely judgmental of a large group of people the original poster doesn’t know.

The same can go for people who are doing just fine. Heck, I grew up in a good neighborhood, had good parents, and grew up comfortably middle class. I have mostly coasted through life and have done just fine. It seems kind of funny to me that most of these people that say things like “People are poor by their own choices” are usually the people who are doing fine in life, but really haven’t been challenged or have pretty much coasted to where they are at, given they already came from a ‘ideal’ or ‘more than ideal’ situation. And honestly, there is nothing wrong with that. Why wouldn’t their parents want to give them the best if the can? But that doesn’t give you a free ride to shit on those less fortunate. It should do the opposite, and you should be reaching out to them.

Have some empathy people.

 

[Scott Martin]

There are plenty of people who have grown up in ‘less than ideal’ situations and have achieved success through their determination and hard work. However, there are plenty that haven’t.

I largely agree with what you are saying. Where and how people are brought up obviously affects just about every aspect of their life. Some people weren’t brought up to make ‘better choices’ so to speak, they never had a role model, so to blame them for their current state is both unfair and extremely judgmental of a large group of people the original poster doesn’t know.

The same can go for people who are doing just fine. Heck, I grew up in a good neighborhood, had good parents, and grew up comfortably middle class. I have mostly coasted through life and have done just fine. It seems kind of funny to me that most of these people that say things like “People are poor by their own choices” are usually the people who are doing fine in life, but really haven’t been challenged or have pretty much coasted to where they are at, given they already came from a ‘ideal’ or ‘more than ideal’ situation. And honestly, there is nothing wrong with that. Why wouldn’t their parents want to give them the best if the can? But that doesn’t give you a free ride to shit on those less fortunate. It should do the opposite, and you should be reaching out to them.

Have some empathy people.

Listen to this bassist.

 

[monoxide_child]

i still believe everything that i posted on this thread