Dakryn's Batshit Theory of the Week
- Thread starter Ender Rises
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Cythraul
Active Member
- Dec 10, 2003
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I never made any claim about the personhood of fetuses.
OH MY FUCKING GOD WHERE DID YOU LEARN THIS AMAZING FACT THAT I NEVER KNEW ABOUT BEFORE!???
Matt
Active Member
If you don't favor abortion rights you can shut the fuck up and don't get one. The government should have no right to control what a woman (or anyone) does with her body. I laugh at conservatives' cry for limited government as they simultaneously wish to infringe upon basic human rights. Absurdly hypocritical.
skeptik
Member
- Feb 7, 2003
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Einherjar86
Active Member
Mathiäs;8462740 said:
That's fine. Can we also opt to not pay for them as well? I completely support someone's right to get an abortion; it's an individual liberty that should be granted to any female. However, it's also my own individual liberty to not be forced to pay for her unwanted love child.
Cythraul
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cookiecutter
Proceed to Ultraslamming
I don't know if you're being serious but this argument seems really mean spirited to me. It's basically denying someone a way to remedy a mistake just to teach them a lesson. This is like not letting someone who got into a car accident get their car fixed in order to make them take personal responsibility for driving recklessly. Except instead of a totaled car they are left with an unwanted child, which is not fair to either the parent or the potential child.
I wasn't trying to make an argument I was just trolling Krig. And I'm not going to debate with you about taxation because your views are too extreme.
Imo this is the best argument for abortion. The right to control one's own body seems very basic and very wrong to infringe upon. Even if you think the fetus is a person, it's hard to argue that the mother is not more of person and deserving of the right to control their own body.Mathiäs;8462740 said:
I think a good compromise would be for the government to only pay for health (mental and physical) related abortions. I really have no idea what will and won't be covered under the reform so I don't feel comfortable arguing about this.
V.V.V.V.V.
Houses Ov Mercury
mutantllama
Active Member
Einherjar86
Active Member
The only problem I foresee would be determining the status of certain patients. Obviously if a twelve year old girl is raped and gets pregnant, I believe she should receive an abortion (for physical health issues). However, as far as mental issues are concerned, does that constitute whether or not the parties involved are fit to be parents? If that's one of the issues, I can't help but think that all a girl has to do is claim she doesn't want to be a parent and won't be a good one, therefore she should receive an abortion.
To me, it seems like providing abortions in these situations will only encourage reckless reproduction, because people know that all they have to do is claim their own ineptitude at raising a child
genocide roach
DOOOOOOOOOOM
- Aug 18, 2002
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Ben_t
Member
Do you really believe that just because the abortion option would be available that everybody will just start being careless and forget about pills and condoms? Abortion is clearly not the easiest way to go about this...so I highly doubt that just because it's available it will become the first choice for restricting reproductions.
cookiecutter
Proceed to Ultraslamming
I agree with Ben_t. Can you seriously imagine anyone saying "no I won't use a condom, my girlfriend can always have an invasive and stigmatized surgery"? People always want to have sex and limiting abortion won't make them act any differently.
V.V.V.V.V.
Houses Ov Mercury
genocide roach
DOOOOOOOOOOM
- Aug 18, 2002
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man, you dont hang out with enough christian conservatives. of course thats what these girls are going to do! girls are even too lazy to use the morning after pill!
~gR~
AchrisK
Weakling
a) anyone who thinks that much, is more than likely going to plan well enough to avoid the problem, so no, I do not imagine that people will be thinking things like that, for the most part.
b) I am not talking about what will happen. I am talking about what already happens. You people act like this society is already not using abortion to fix their mistakes and eliminate inconveniences. Wake up.
genocide roach
DOOOOOOOOOOM
- Aug 18, 2002
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they arent! someone needs to find the numbers of abortions and compare them to the number of women on the pill. i would imagine that ratio alone would be staggering. then when you add condoms, morning after, etc...
and your first assumption is invalid as well. shit happens. the best laid plans dont always work. and no form of birth control is 100%
~gR~
and your first assumption is invalid as well. shit happens. the best laid plans dont always work. and no form of birth control is 100%
~gR~
AchrisK
Weakling
You misunderstand me if you think that I think it's all about punishing people, or ensuring that they learn a lesson.
I am being serious, because in my view, you don't murder to fix your mistakes. Now don't balk at what I am saying. You already know that there are a lot of people who hold the view that "life" and "humanness" start way before a fetus exits the womb. That debate will not be solved here, so just assume that we agree to disagree on that, and take into account that that is the actual belief of some people. Not a "party line" or some slogan. We believe it is the truth. With this in mind, I am sure you can see that your car accident analogy is insufficient.
There are so many statements made by abortion proponents about the unwanted child, but how many of us were surprises? I was. How many of us caused fear and dread in our parents when they found out? I am pretty sure I did. My mom was 18 and my dad was 19. They were not married. They took responsibility and made it through. I am glad they did (though some of you may not be...
). I think a lot of the people who should probably not have children probably just keep having children. The people who would most likely be able to handle it and bring up an at least somewhat well-adjusted kid are having abortions. I don't know percentages, but you know these statements are true. I don't accept the "unwanted child" argument as a justification for something I feel is the taking of an innocent human life.With what I said above in mind, about the views of life, this gets more complicated. Yes, maybe we can start doing life-value calculation when we are talking about both lives being at stake, but in most cases, it is possible to not get pregnant in the first place. People seem to forget this (by choice or otherwise). Pregnancy happens in only one way (sperm/egg). There are many ways to avoid that.
Therefore (this refers to everything I said), I don't want to pay for abortions.
AchrisK
Weakling
Here are some statistics. I am not sure of their validity. Maybe someone with time can find out if the source is reliable.
Abortion statistics and other data:
http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/abortion/index.html
Reasons given for having abortions in the United States:
http://www.johnstonsarchive.net/policy/abortion/abreasons.html
genocide roach
DOOOOOOOOOOM
- Aug 18, 2002
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i'll check those links later (swamped with work amazingly)
but i want to tacvk on to cookie's point. every person has the right to decide for themselves what is moral and what isnt. just because you dont agree with them doesnt mean youre allowed to control them.
~gR~
but i want to tacvk on to cookie's point. every person has the right to decide for themselves what is moral and what isnt. just because you dont agree with them doesnt mean youre allowed to control them.
~gR~
