Damnation

[dorian gray]

I'm sure this has been rehashed a million times but I can't help it. I got into and argument on the Symphony X board about Damnation. I declared that it should've been a side project for Mike and not sold as an Opeth album at all. I got a lot of negative responses for that. The folks over there, as nice as they are, think they really like Opeth because they really like Damnation. I tried to point out that Mike himself said "this is what we REALLY sound like" (you all know where I'm referencing this from).
I tried to get the person who argued with me the most to start a thread here but she refused. I'd like to know the thoughts of Opeth fans on this topic.

I'll start it with this argument:
Damnation is an Opeth album by name only and should, in retrospect, have been an entirely different side-project for Mike.

Flame away!

 

[RavenousDaemon]

Side project for Mike? Or for the band as a whole. You realize that it's the BAND'S album, don't you?

 

[dorian gray]

godammit! no, its not. mike wrote all the music. it was mikes experiment. he's said as much in every interview ive ever read and i think it says so on opeth.com but i cant be sure.
i couldnt care less if he used the same band members. it should have not been called an opeth album. we all know it only led to people like my wife listening to opeth. cant stand orchid, but play some damnation, "ooohh, i like opeth!"

 

[RavenousDaemon]

Yes I have experienced some people who only listened to Damnation saying the band blows, too. Anyone who says they like (or don't like) Opeth because of Damnation just doesn't understand and I dont force it upon them to listen to the rest. Ah and why bother thinking up another band name and going through all of the signing bullshit if it's going to have the same band members?
Before I had all of the albums, I thought Damnation was just too different. But once I had them all and heard TBYF I realized it was all practically like that one song. So it still wouldn't really make sense to form a new band for one album.

 

[Sanzen]

My position on Opeth is that it's Mike's band (one of the Martins says this on the DVD), so of course, any album he releases with Opeth is really Mike...a side project ("Damnation, an album by Mikael Akerfeldt") would be someone pointless and redundent(sp?).

Damnation, though it sounds different, still sounds like Opeth. Granted, that's an objective observation, but one that I think a lot of people on this board would agree with. So if it sounds like Opeth, why release it under a different name?

Plus, if Mike had released it as a side project, whether under his name or another, he might not have had the resources/money necessary - if you ran a record label, wouldn't you rather finance an album by an established & relatively popular band that already has a fanbase that will immediately snap up any new releases?

<---devil's advocate

 

[dorian gray]

("Damnation, an album by Mikael Akerfeldt")

hahaha! i like it. thanks for posting. i think this thread will get locked pretty soon. because it sucks so bad.

 

[RavenousDaemon]

You suck so bad OHHHHHHHH!!!!

 

[dorian gray]

oohhh! snap!

 

[Mirrored Ghost]

i couldnt care less if he used the same band members. it should have not been called an opeth album. we all know it only led to people like my wife listening to opeth. cant stand orchid, but play some damnation, "ooohh, i like opeth!"

Ok, let me get this straight...

You think changing the name of the band for 1 album would have made any difference?? And what difference are you looking for in the first place??

 

[dorian gray]

so people wouldnt pick up ONE opeth album and think they know ALL about opeth and feel they can comment, seriously, on their older heavier stuff. thats all. im not trying to be a fanboy. i just think thats what has happened with damnation. people heard it, bought it, and consider themselves opeth fans. i guess they ARE, technically speaking, but damnation, is NOT opeth. the man said so himself. thats all im getting at i guess.
if mike writes some rap and sells it under the opeth name, is it really opeth? my argument is a resounding "no".

ps: i saw something the other day that reminded me of you. ill have to PM you....

 

[RavenousDaemon]

They have written rap. Ever hear SPD?

 

[dorian gray]

like the pedals i had on my bike before it got stolen?

 

[dorian gray]

oh! serenity painted death? i dont have still life yet.

 

[RavenousDaemon]

Yea most people don't have it.... go to amazon.com and order it now!

 

[dorian gray]

haha! you believe me!

 

[Mirrored Ghost]

so people wouldnt pick up ONE opeth album and think they know ALL about opeth and feel they can comment, seriously, on their older heavier stuff. thats all. im not trying to be a fanboy. i just think thats what has happened with damnation. people heard it, bought it, and consider themselves opeth fans. i guess they ARE, technically speaking, but damnation, is NOT opeth. the man said so himself. thats all im getting at i guess.
if mike writes some rap and sells it under the opeth name, is it really opeth? my argument is a resounding "no".

ps: i saw something the other day that reminded me of you. ill have to PM you....

Yeah dorian, I see what you're saying but for arguments sake, let's say Opeth never released that album at all, ok?, and new fans start getting into them via Deliverance and/or Blackwater Park. You are still going to get the same result that you are not liking here (fans acting like they know all). I understand that these albums are definitely nothing like Damnation, but they are also nothing like their previous works as well.

Anyway, even if they did release that album under another name, those fans would ultimately find out who they really are and check out their older albums and start the trend that you dislike. Therefore, no difference. And who cares anyway what people think or say??

Personally speaking, I got into Opeth through Damnation but you won't see me commenting on the older material (although I do love it and listened to all of it) because it hasn't "completely" sunk in yet.

And yes, PM away please.

 

[Sanzen]

hahaha! i like it. thanks for posting. i think this thread will get locked pretty soon. because it sucks so bad.

I don't know, I think the only reason it'll get locked iz cuZ UR a FaGoTZ faNbOI w00t w00t!!!!!11oneone


just kidding. i think it's a good thread, should be interesting if no one gets all stupid about it.

 

[cthulufhtagn]

i don't think there's anything wrong with damnation having been released as an opeth album. i'll admit i got into opeth through it--i went to amoeba records and said "hmm i've heard opeth is good, i think i'll get this one"...i loved it then went back and got everything else and loved it even more. to me there's nothing wrong with an artist branching out and trying new things; look at the beatles' progression from "meet the beatles" to "let it be"...they were a totally different band by the end but the quality of the music steadily improved throughout their career.

to sum it all up, fuck bush.

 

[the_3_toed_sloth]

I'll start it with this argument:
Damnation is an Opeth album by name only and should, in retrospect, have been an entirely different side-project for Mike.

Ahhh, god bless the internet and pointless arguments...I gotta ask, why do you care if people get into Opeth through Damnation? If they have the balls to call themselves 'Opeth Fans' then they will want to listen to more of Opeth...at which point they'll either run crying back to their Coldplay or Chilli Peppers cds, or realise that Opeth is much more than any one style of music.
What i love about Damnation is that it gives people who dont otherwise know Opeth a taste of what they are really like, breaking them in slowly.
Besides, whether you think its just "Mikael's cd" or not, its one of their favourites and is a side of their music that deserves to carry the name Opeth. If they'd released it as a side project then you would expect them to follow it up. Under Opeth you dont know what they will do. I like that, mysterious, like some kind of...mysterious thing...that...does...mysterious stuff...uhh....Opeth rules?

 

[dorian gray]

thanks for posting in my thread.

of what they are really like

i will have to disagree with this though as mike said, on the dvd,
"this is what we REALLY sound like". he said this, for everyone who doesnt remember, when the damnation set was over and the deliverance set started. i dont see how one can argue against this statement. apparantly, mike himself, does not think damnation is what opeth sound like.
thus, damnation should not have been an opeth release. which leads me to beleive that it was either a way to cheaply expand opeths fanbase (which ive read somewhere) which is lame in its own right, or mike just didnt have the energy to start up a new band. the former reason has been argued to death here and the latter doesnt make sense because mike has been in several side projects.
the arguments against mine are starting to make me think mike just had some ideas for some prog rock and wanted to make them onto an album. he didnt seem to have the energy to make it a side-project and the album looked good enough to him to give opeth a much larger (probably doubled) fanbase.
my argument is holding up well so far i think.....