Does Symphorce always Plagiarize their lyrics?

Chrisf

Chrisf

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I posted this on Perpetual Motion. Thought it might be worth posting here...

I recently got their new cd, "Phorceful Ahead". While listening to it, I noticed some _very_ familiar sounding lyrics...
----------------------------------------------------
Song 3, "Slowdown":
"some wear their bruises on their skin
others hide their scars deep within"
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Pain of Salvation, TPEp1, "In the Flesh":
"Some wear their bruises on their skin
Others have their scars deep within"

Coincidence? I think not... check this out:
-------------------------------------------
Sympharce, song 4, "longing home":
"how could I be so blind?
it was always there...inside"

"hiding wounds won't ease the pain
sleep won't make you whole again
let the rain wash that pain away..."

"i have only million years to give
but at last... i live"

"i always took it for granted
i never valued the drops I shed
i failed to see the relation
between my self and starvation"
- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Guess we're onto Concrete Lake now:

"Inside Out":
"how could I be so blind?
it was always there...inside"

"New Years Eve":
"hiding wounds won't ease the pain
sleep won't make you whole again"

"Water"
I always took it for granted
I never valued the drops I shed
I failed to see the relation
Between my self and world starvation"



Bastards! This isn't even subtle. Further, the Symphorce lyrics don't even make sense in some cases. So are we done with album? Not quite:
---------------------------------------------------------
Song 10, "Nothing Left":
"Every time you froze me out
every punch, every shout
this is what we can share -
this is all we can share"

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
The Perfect Element, "Idioglossia"
"For every time you froze me out
For every punch every shout"

and earlier on, in "Morning on Earth:
"This is what we can share -
this is all we can lose"


Can you believe this??? They even kept the fucking hyphen!

Bastards.

Pain of Salvation should sue them on principle.

The only good side of this is that it made me listen to some extra Pain of Salvation, which is always a good thing.

Bastards! I will never buy another Symphorce disc. I can write my own program to randomly rearrange lyrics from a good band.

Anyone else put out a trite, power-metal Pain of Salvation tribute album?

Chrisf
 
That's awesome! Nice work, chrisf. That's one band I'll never drop a nickel on. Hopefully others will catch onto this. So many good bands that never go anywhere, it sucks to see someone putting out records that only rip off others' work.
 
Daaaaaaaaaaaaaayum!!! That's very, very sad ....

I'm not familiar with Symphorce but no one messes with PoS and gets away with it!!! ;)
 
Symphorce is very generic anyway...I would expect nothing less. While they're not "bad", they're certainly nothing to write home about...

Actually, I think the whole thing is quite funny.....

Pagan's Mind pays homage to Dream Theater by eluding to a line or two of Learning to Live on Celestial Entrance's last track.....

Symphorce decides that the Perfect Element was indeed their disk to begin with, and they're now recycling lyrics as much as Savatage...

:lol:
 
Aye Curumba!!!
This thread is begining to appear everywhere! :D

I'll admit I'm not a big PoS fan, but am familiar with some of their material AND have heard the new Symphorce, and until now had to check things out for myself.

One thing I can say is, if it was a line or two out of the whole album... I would definatly consider it a coincidence, put it seems this coincidence spreads through out the album. One thing I have noticed (if at any consolation) the melody lines are diffrent, or carry diffrently, if the vocal melodies were the same... then it would be blantanly obvious to anyone with two ears attached to their head.;)

It's a good thing there are still people out there who care for Lyrics as much as the music, or no one would really have noticed!

From a lyricist's stand point, it can be a bit difficult to write material when you have a dozen things running through your head that you've heard recently by listing to music. I personally have to isolate myself from almost everything to scribe a few lines. But... Any analitical lyric writer will scrutinize his/her writing to the point that it would not be comparable (or at least they would hope) to someone elses work.

I certainly can't speak for Andy, but I hope for his sake it IS coincidence! although, I have no idea how he will be able to prove otherwise after reading through everything.

\m/
Dustin
 
Holy shit...that really sucks. Pain of Salvation should sue, thats pretty damn pathetic. Talk about completely unoriginal and sneaky. Makes me wonder how they could put out an album like that and people dont notice that sooner. I think the part I would have noticed the fastest was "some wear their bruises on their skin" becuase I listen to "In the Flesh" quite frequently as one of my favorite songs.
 
Funny how quickly he went from "must just be a coincidence" to admitting his mistake...


Today I received many e-mails from fans about the "stealing lyrics" thing. I´ve always been honest and so I want to be honest to you: Of course I do listen to a lot o music. I´m sure, that I also have listened to POS CDs. Not many times, but sometimes I think "wow, this got a very, very cool message" So, as a german, I must have a look in the booklet and write down the parts. In the case of POS I have to say, that it must have been the thing, that I´ve listened to their albums, and especially their lyrics were very impressing to me. So it was absolutely my fault, not to use their lyrics as just an inspiration,...no in theses parts, I´ve chosen their lyrics to impress my lyrics better. That was abolutely my fault and I really feel ashame! But I´m not too proud to say: SORRY to all fans!
BUT, NOT to rip them off,...no ....this is to honour other musicians in the metal-music scene.
In the case of other bands like Nevermore aso. this is abolutely meant as an honour! For ex. I know Warrel and Jeff well, and the band (also earlier Sanctuary) was and will always be a big influence.
The same with some other bands. Lyrics like the ones from Daniel Gildenlöw are unique, and I never wanted to touch their outstanding meaning. I never wanted to write about swords and/or dragons, so it´s more than helpful to read different lyrics like the ones you talked about. Don´t see me as your enemy or a "rip off" writer.
I know my roots, and it´s sometimes my way to honour someone. I know, it´s very easy to find out in the lyrics...strange that nobody´s talking about similar guitar, drums or bass lines from other bands in the music scene.
So please understand and believe me, I NEVER wanted to rip anyone off, I NEVER wanted to steal any lyrics and if I used similar parts, it´s just because of a fantastic meaning someone else wrote, but I couldn´t say better.
It was just also my way to say "Thank you" to some great singers in the music scene.
All I can do is to say: SORRY! THere weren´t any bad meanings behind....!
best regards
Andy B. Franck
 
Originally posted by rgbeach
Funny how quickly he went from "must just be a coincidence" to admitting his mistake...


Today I received many e-mails from fans about the "stealing lyrics" thing. I´ve always been honest and so I want to be honest to you: Of course I do listen to a lot o music. I´m sure, that I also have listened to POS CDs. Not many times, but sometimes I think "wow, this got a very, very cool message" So, as a german, I must have a look in the booklet and write down the parts. In the case of POS I have to say, that it must have been the thing, that I´ve listened to their albums, and especially their lyrics were very impressing to me. So it was absolutely my fault, not to use their lyrics as just an inspiration,...no in theses parts, I´ve chosen their lyrics to impress my lyrics better. That was abolutely my fault and I really feel ashame! But I´m not too proud to say: SORRY to all fans!
BUT, NOT to rip them off,...no ....this is to honour other musicians in the metal-music scene.
In the case of other bands like Nevermore aso. this is abolutely meant as an honour! For ex. I know Warrel and Jeff well, and the band (also earlier Sanctuary) was and will always be a big influence.
The same with some other bands. Lyrics like the ones from Daniel Gildenlöw are unique, and I never wanted to touch their outstanding meaning. I never wanted to write about swords and/or dragons, so it´s more than helpful to read different lyrics like the ones you talked about. Don´t see me as your enemy or a "rip off" writer.
I know my roots, and it´s sometimes my way to honour someone. I know, it´s very easy to find out in the lyrics...strange that nobody´s talking about similar guitar, drums or bass lines from other bands in the music scene.
So please understand and believe me, I NEVER wanted to rip anyone off, I NEVER wanted to steal any lyrics and if I used similar parts, it´s just because of a fantastic meaning someone else wrote, but I couldn´t say better.
It was just also my way to say "Thank you" to some great singers in the music scene.
All I can do is to say: SORRY! THere weren´t any bad meanings behind....!
best regards
Andy B. Franck
Click to expand...

Give me a break! :rolleyes:
 
Hey, I understand everyone's anger, but give the guy a break. He has publicly apologized to his fans and it is apparent that his purpose in using those lyrics was not malicious. I respect him for at least confessing up to the fact that he listened to PoS and was inspired by their lyrics. And, in my opinion, lyrics aside, the new Symphorce album was very well done.

That aside, I take it that Symphorce will not be considered for PP IV! LOL
 
Here's what Andy said before he claimed he was "honoring" Pain of Salvation by stealin their lyrics...

After checking the lyrics on the net, I must say,...yes,...it looks like there are really some similar parts!
Strange, but to be honest,...I really do NOT own any PoS CD!
But, of course, I do listen to a lot o´music during the day. So somtimes, I hear lines, words or whatever, and ´sooner or later, I think: wow, that was cool ... but don´t remember where I´ve heard it first. It´s sad to say, but nobody´s perfect and so am I! But still I think -...also with these similarities- my lyrics are different to many other. But, as I said, ...you´re right,...it looks strange,...and in the case of "lyrics" you can easily find out,...on guitars or drums....it´s way more different. Anyway,..thanx for listening so much to the new album!
Enjoy! It´s just music! Let´s stay in touch, and it´s alwways good to know, someone´s reading the lyrics, !
Thanx anyway for your support,...for the next album I have one very cool sentence : "ups, I did it
again"....hmmm, have to check out if someone did before, .... Cheers and thanx for your support!
Andy B. Franck
 
Sounds like someone is in a hurry to cover his ass as best as possible, what with all these "explanations" and such. You'd think he'd just credit PoS in the liner notes for the lyrics (after getting permission to use them, of course) and be done with it. Sheesh...

Has anyone seen any sort of reaction from PoS about this, or did I just miss reading it somewhere?

--Mike
 
Originally posted by nightwish58
He has publicly apologized to his fans and it is apparent that his purpose in using those lyrics was not malicious.
Click to expand...

It doesn't matter if his intent was not malicious, he still plagiarized other's works, which is just wrong - and illegal. If he really was inspired by PoS lyrics, why did he not give them writing credit on the CD?
 
Originally posted by rgbeach
It doesn't matter if his intent was not malicious, he still plagiarized other's works, which is just wrong - and illegal. If he really was inspired by PoS lyrics, why did he not give them writing credit on the CD?
Click to expand...

I agree, as an aspiring writer I find plagiarism to be a replusive practice, and as a fan of Pain Of Salvation I am greatly offended that someone would steal from their work without credit.
 
Originally posted by rgbeach
It doesn't matter if his intent was not malicious, he still plagiarized other's works, which is just wrong - and illegal. If he really was inspired by PoS lyrics, why did he not give them writing credit on the CD?
Click to expand...

You are 100% right; it is illegal, but also very difficult to prove; unless the person admits it. I have to re-read what Andy said about this as I am not sure he actually admits to reading and stealing the exact words from PoS.

Did you hear the last song on the Pagans Mind? They blatantly use the same words and melody from DT's Learning to Live. I didn't look at the liner notes, but were they given permission by DT to do this? I would hope so because it is so obvious, and extremely easy to recognize unlike what Symphorce did. I had no idea about the whole Symphorce thing until it was brought to my attention, but the Pagans Mind thing is a no brainer!
 
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