DT+SX shows setlist

[Jay V.]

I was there in Helsinki, it's a discrace that a band as great as this has to play to an audience like that. As much as I like DT, some of the fans can be real assholes. Some waste-of-oxygen in the middle near the front row actually threw stuff on stage at least twice. I wonder if that's why they didn't stay to play an encore? Can't blame them, audience wasn't into it, there were problems with equipment (Russell's mic occasionally got muted), and the sound guy was pumping out ridiculous amounts of bass.

I hope they come back someday (headlining, please) but I don't think it will be very soon.

 

[henkdee]

Dream Theater

CHAOS IN MOTION TOUR
+ SPECIAL GUEST: SYMPHONY X

(Antwerp, Belgium)

I thought SX would play a longer set, "special guest" my butt.
especialy when a 3rd band was removed from the list.
I'm not going, no way, I LOVED DT years ago when they were heavy proggers, they're awesome musicians but there's just too much 70's prog in their latest releases.
I want METAL!

thank you so much SX for adding the headline gigs! see you in France!
H/Belgium

 

[Progbass]

Don't get me wrong; I like a lot of DT's stuff. But sometimes the overly drawn-out instrumental sections (see The Dark Eternal Night, The Ministry of Lost Souls) drag the song way downhill for me. Symphony X may throw a solo in just because Romeo or Pinnella wants to solo, but everything seems to flow a lot better, and it fits the song. Half the time with DT I get the distinct impression that the solo is there for no other purpose than to show off; key changes are thrown in for the sole purpose of solos in different keys. In the Presence of Enemies pt. 2 is a perfect example - once the instrumental section starts, you've got like 5-7 minutes of wank to navigate through before reaching the melodic ending reprise. Same with The Ministry of Lost Souls... talk about dragging a song downhill!

Yea, I wasn't really being that serious about my last comment. And you are right there, for example if you compare instrumental sections from ACOS to the new material, it's like different band...

 

[proulxski]

DT is awesome and don't find any of their wankery borring.... I mean I prefer symphony x more but I think you guys bash on them way to hard. And to those saying DT has to show symphony x straight because they pwn dt, so they give them a small set... thats the largest bs ever man, so many of you, past, present forum members have dreamed about a Dream Theater + Symphony X tour... It finnally happens and everyone bitches about. Wheter they play 20 minutes or 3 hours, they will be playing with the extremely talented and popular dream theater, and they will get their music across to more people, meaning more fans! Which is the point of this tour in the first place, promoting their new album, and sympony x did their headlining tours already, now its time for them to take a break and promote the fuck out of the album!

Besides if anything this tour will put Dream Theater vs Symphony X threads to death, aned probable some of the Dt fans will immagrate over here... ANd I don 't mean the forum persay, just become fans

 

[rockyracoon]

It would be cool if all the guys did a song or two together, at least on a few dates.

 

[marko kutberg]

Does anyone have some SymX pictures from the Helsinki gig. It was so cool (and a short set, yes), that I forgot to take any.

btw, I got into Symphony X this summer, because of this tour.

 

[progmetaldan]

Don't get me wrong; I like a lot of DT's stuff. But sometimes the overly drawn-out instrumental sections (see The Dark Eternal Night, The Ministry of Lost Souls) drag the song way downhill for me. Symphony X may throw a solo in just because Romeo or Pinnella wants to solo, but everything seems to flow a lot better, and it fits the song. Half the time with DT I get the distinct impression that the solo is there for no other purpose than to show off; key changes are thrown in for the sole purpose of solos in different keys. In the Presence of Enemies pt. 2 is a perfect example - once the instrumental section starts, you've got like 5-7 minutes of wank to navigate through before reaching the melodic ending reprise. Same with The Ministry of Lost Souls... talk about dragging a song downhill!

Of course, you may consider the above opinion completely absurd when I tell you that Train of Thought is my favorite DT album. Who would've thought?!

I think the instrumental section in ITPOE pt 2 actually is quite necessary, as it is portraying the actual battle in the story, and then the melodic end happens after he's slain everyone, that's what prog is about, telling a story with music...

 

[Detective Clarence Beauregard]

that's what prog is about, telling a story with music...

I understand what you're saying, and I agree. However, to me it feels like DT's long instrumental sections are there for the sole purpose of showing off, and not to enhance whatever story they're telling with the song. Look at The Ministry of Lost Souls. While that 4+ minute instrumental part may sound great in another song, it has no place in THAT song. It completely rips the emotion out of the song, in my opinion.

I also agree with Progbass. Almost everything they've done post-FII seems like it is there for no other reason than to show off. "Yes, Mr. Petrucci, we know you can play fast, but shredding doesn't really fit into this song very well. Yes, Mr. Rudess, we know you love circus and carnival themes, but this song is too heavy for that kind of vibe. Yes, Mr. Portnoy, we know you have three bass drums, 27 rack toms, 14 octobans, 34 cymbals, and 88 vibra-blocks (just to compete with the keyboard), but you don't need to hit all of them in this four-minute ballad. Yes, Mr. Myung, we know you can play bass really well, so how about you turn yourself up so we can hear that sweet low end." If only someone could tell the band this before they write a new album, perhaps it will come out fully enjoyable.

I am starting to think that they really did lose their songwriting element when Kevin Moore left; or, rather, when Jordan Rudess joined.

 

[marko kutberg]

I understand what you're saying, and I agree. However, to me it feels like DT's long instrumental sections are there for the sole purpose of showing off, and not to enhance whatever story they're telling with the song. Look at The Ministry of Lost Souls. While that 4+ minute instrumental part may sound great in another song, it has no place in THAT song. It completely rips the emotion out of the song, in my opinion.

I also agree with Progbass. Almost everything they've done post-FII seems like it is there for no other reason than to show off. "Yes, Mr. Petrucci, we know you can play fast, but shredding doesn't really fit into this song very well. Yes, Mr. Rudess, we know you love circus and carnival themes, but this song is too heavy for that kind of vibe. Yes, Mr. Portnoy, we know you have three bass drums, 27 rack toms, 14 octobans, 34 cymbals, and 88 vibra-blocks (just to compete with the keyboard), but you don't need to hit all of them in this four-minute ballad. Yes, Mr. Myung, we know you can play bass really well, so how about you turn yourself up so we can hear that sweet low end." If only someone could tell the band this before they write a new album, perhaps it will come out fully enjoyable.

I am starting to think that they really did lose their songwriting element when Kevin Moore left; or, rather, when Jordan Rudess joined.

lol, showing off? What did you think all those instrumental sections are there for then? Of course they are there to show off. And thats what DT fans want. Its like going to the monster trucks where everything is bigger and faster and longer (bad example, I know). I would be extremely pissed, if the next album would feature no solos or Nirvana-type three note solos which last for 12 seconds. If I want straight ahead songs with some well thought out lyrics and basic chord progressions I`ll go and listen to The Beatles or Portishead or Oasis or whatever, which I do every day anyway.

DT have always done crazy instrumental sections. Ever heard The Killing Hand? Metropolis? The original version of A Change of Seasons? Wasnt Kevin playing on them? Arent the crazy instrumental parts between the melodic ending and beginning? The Ministry of Lost Souls? I see a pattern here. You?

The post above was meant to be friendly, but I`m in a huge sarcasm mode lately, sorry.

 

[1by4by9]

DT should make a cover of Show Off Must Go on (the Queen song, you know.)

 

[razoredge]

I understand what you're saying, and I agree. However, to me it feels like DT's long instrumental sections are there for the sole purpose of showing off, and not to enhance whatever story they're telling with the song. Look at The Ministry of Lost Souls. While that 4+ minute instrumental part may sound great in another song, it has no place in THAT song. It completely rips the emotion out of the song, in my opinion.

I a big Dream Theater fan and I will agree with this. They do and have been way carried away for years. On Images and Awake it all seemed to flow right into the whole picture but after a few more albums it started to appear to be done "cause it must be", or climbed the mountain "cause we can". Their solos have always been "showing off" but seemed more in context. I can't speak for keyboards because I rarely pay attention, its like a foreign language, but speaking for Petrucci he does seem to come up with a few new ideas to throw in the mix of what we've already heard. I feel he does use some slow expression more nowadays in some solos. Back in the day Ytse Jam was the ultimate live show off song that worked like a sledge hammer to the scences. I guess they cant play that for 20 years though... or do they still ?

I have yet to hear a band thats been around for years that does not have an obvious identifiable rutt. Musical masterbation is Dream Theaters forte. But then every one crys when they write a heart felt mellow song. Or the people that like the mellow stuff cry when they get too heavy. Double damned ! Such is the way of progressive music.

{just wanted to say now, and this is not an attack and could be taken as a compliment. Beauregard : you are the only regular here that I cant figure out, most came easy. This is why. If Im not mistaken you were one of the people that said A Pleasent Shade of Gray is great, yet Queensryche bores you, yet DT is wanky for getting carried away....... you got me comin' and goin'.... congradulations Im with you on Circus Maximus at least but there can be no question as to the two sources they draw their music from... }

Listening to Octavarium now and enjoying me self

 

[progmetaldan]

DT should make a cover of Show Off Must Go on (the Queen song, you know.)

Narnia did...

 

[E. Mannerheim]

Narnia did...

Show OFF Must Go On?

 

[progmetaldan]

CJ Grimmark uses Caparison guitars... That makes him awesome.

 

[Wander]

I was there in Helsinki, it's a discrace that a band as great as this has to play to an audience like that. As much as I like DT, some of the fans can be real assholes. Some waste-of-oxygen in the middle near the front row actually threw stuff on stage at least twice. I wonder if that's why they didn't stay to play an encore? Can't blame them, audience wasn't into it, there were problems with equipment (Russell's mic occasionally got muted), and the sound guy was pumping out ridiculous amounts of bass.

I hope they come back someday (headlining, please) but I don't think it will be very soon.

Yeah, I heard there was some shit like that going on although I didn't see it. Someone threw cookies at Lepond and Romeo. What an asshole. People like that should be shot in the guts and hanged as far as I'm concerned.

 

[noble savage]

Yeah, I heard there was some shit like that going on although I didn't see it. Someone threw cookies at Lepond and Romeo. What an asshole. People like that should be shot in the guts and hanged as far as I'm concerned.

Really!? As much as I like DT, I am at times ashamed to admit I am even a fan. Some of their fans a complete fucking assholes. I know a few!

 

[Detective Clarence Beauregard]

{just wanted to say now, and this is not an attack and could be taken as a compliment. Beauregard : you are the only regular here that I cant figure out, most came easy. This is why. If Im not mistaken you were one of the people that said A Pleasent Shade of Gray is great, yet Queensryche bores you, yet DT is wanky for getting carried away....... you got me comin' and goin'.... congradulations Im with you on Circus Maximus at least but there can be no question as to the two sources they draw their music from... }

I guess I'm an enigma like that! Truthfully, Fates Warning used to bore me. I listened to APSOG several times before I could appreciate it for what it was - a mood album. Just like Opeth's Damnation, DT's Awake, or (dare I say) Metallica's Load. However, being a mood album, it's obviously not something I could listen to all the time. I like FWX a lot, though... Left Here is such a great song.

I view Queensryche as simply average. Perhaps that may offend many, but nothing they've done has really grabbed me (aside from Mindcrime, which is a pretty solid album). It's just my taste... they're a bit too "rock" for me.

I like DT's music, but I truthfully believe that they have gradually gone downhill since Jordan has joined the band. Scenes was great, but it's another mood album that I don't listen to often. Six Degrees had some great stuff (Glass Prison, Blind Faith, even Great Debate) but felt a bit too drawn out at times. Train of Thought was great, probably my favorite "nu-Dream Theater" album. Octavarium bored me to death (minus a few good tunes), and Systematic Chaos has some good stuff, but it just feels like more of the same. I prefered Kevin Moore's more organic keyboard sound, compared to Jordan's overly-wanky space orgasm patches. Rudess also tends to double the bass and guitar a lot, and he picks patches where you can't even hear him! I guess that's what I like about keyboardists like Pinnella and the guy from Nightwish... they use "earthy" and "classical" patches that are easy to hear! And although songwriting is purely subjective, I think most can agree that after Moore left, DT's songwriting went tumbling downhill.

 

[progmetaldan]

Really!? As much as I like DT, I am at times ashamed to admit I am even a fan. Some of their fans a complete fucking assholes. I know a few!

I often feel that way with Opeth... I love the band, but some of their fans... You only have to venture onto their forum to see, even Mikael Akerfeldt had a go at them once...

So yeah, it kinda sucks that it's like that, cos I don't want to be stereotyped, and the band deserves a whole lot more...

 

[Noble Viking]

can any discussion about DT not turn into an argument? The person asked for a setlist from DT and there's nothing but 4 pages of nerdy arguments

 

[Wander]

can any discussion about DT not turn into an argument? The person asked for a setlist from DT and there's nothing but 4 pages of nerdy arguments

Dream Theater = arugment. Actually they should change their name to "Cause Of Arguments" or something like that.