Fahrenheit 9/11

[JayKeeley]

I just saw Faranheit 9/11 tonight for the first time, and I went into the film thinking this Moore guy likes to glamourize and spin, etc, but I wonder who's accusing him of that, because all I saw was a massive collection of news articles and interviews? This isn't Moore telling you what's going on from his mouth whatsoever, he's not reading you a story, this is excerpts of real news footage.

Honestly, after seeing this film, I'm not sure how Bush & Cheney are even allowed to run for office again. Their background ties to the Saudis and the oil/construction companies such as Haliburton is all just daylight robbery, white collar crime at its finest. I'm glad John Edwards got into the Haliburton debate with Cheney, leaving him speechless, but you know, watching this film just shocks me that Bush even has a fighting chance in the next election. On principle alone, he should be standing trial right now, and yet there are still people out there, with access to all this information in this free society, chanting "four more years".

 

[Demonspell]

As far as I know, Nader is the only prominent political figure who has suggested that Bush should be impeached, unless you count Moore himself. This does surprise me on a level of principle, but not practice as any congressman who said such a thing would be promptly lynched. I can't believe some pundits called the debate for Cheney when he completely avoided inquiries about his corrupt deals with Halliburton and his ultra-conservative voting record.

PS F911 sold two million copies in its first day of home release. Combined with rentals, that could equal a lot of converted undecideds...

 

[JayKeeley]

I'm just at a loss for what we're dealing with here in this country. For my sanity's sake, I need to hear from a pro-Bush supporter as to why Bush should be given a second term, and I don't want to hear it from a middle aged housewife who's scared of their kids dying in school or from some hick farmer in Alabama who's dumb enough to think there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11, while his kids go off to war. I need to hear the reasoning from someone else in the 49% of poll results who are STILL vouching for Bush as the man because this is all so ludicrous, I feel like I'm the only one not getting the joke.

 

[Black Winter Day]

Amen, brutha.

Never question the universality of American idocy.

 

[NAD]

Yeah, idocy runs rampart in America.

I still haven't seen this movie, but I want to before the election so I'll have reason to riot if Bush wins.

 

[lurch70]

and I don't want to hear it from a middle aged housewife who's scared of their kids dying in school or from some hick farmer in Alabama who's dumb enough to think there's a connection between Iraq and 9/11, while his kids go off to war.

I don't think there is anyone else.

Just look at current pics in this weeks TIME magazine of Bush and Kerry on the campaign stops ... I mean Bush is constantly surrounded by chubby, hick women ... totally clueless.
I even read some lady in fucking boontown fucking Montana (probably lives next to Nate The Great ) saying that she is afraid of terrorists and Bush is right on his quest .... what the fuck, don't worry lady, terrorists will never attack anything else but the large cities and oddly enough people living there are not afraid and most likely are Kerry supporters.

:Smug:

 

[NAD]

:Smug:

TESTIFY!

I honestly don't know any Bush supporters, not anymore. The only ones I do see are on Internet forums, but even all the people I know that voted for him 4 years ago now hate him.

 

[Tranquillian]

Keep on giving me hope for a new president. I'm trying to argue with a rabid Bushsupporter on another forum, but it's like hitting a brick wall. Bushsupporters remind me of religious fanatics (many of them probably are).

Here is a poll from Swedens biggest newspaper.
Who would you like to see as the next president.
John Kerry (82.6 %)
George W Bush (13.9 %)
Undecided (3.5 %)

115000 votes (about 1.5% of our total population).

 

[Demonspell]

The only person I know who is planning to vote for Bush is my grandfather, and that includes people who have voted Republican in the past. I'm still stunned that Bush can get such high poll numbers when his support is driven by fanaticism and misinformation, but most of the polls are weighted toward Republicans and exclude newly registered voters anyway.

 

[NAD]

Finally saw this damn movie. Damn it was good. Wasn't quite what I expected but in a good way. I was expecting some partial quotes taken out of context or rabid assumptions making Bush out to be an absolute devil. Nope. My BS meter didn't even raise a fraction the entire time. Anyone who dismisses it as propaganda is a fool.

Piss shit cornbread I really hope this fuck doesn't get re-elected.

 

[Dark One]

Anyone who dismisses it as propaganda is a fool.

 

[NAD]

Oh, be nice!

Seriously though, obviously yes there was an agenda to the film, but it was more laid out in a here's some facts, draw your own conclusions style. Unless of course all his sources are false.

 

[Dark One]

Oh, be nice!

Seriously though, obviously yes there was an agenda to the film, but it was more laid out in a here's some facts, draw your own conclusions style. Unless of course all his sources are false.

This site may interest you:

http://www.newsfly.org/news/moore_f911_fixed.htm
http://javascript<b></b>:OpenWin('h...sfly%2eorg%2fnews%2fmoore_f911_fixed%2ehtm');

 

[J.]

THat little 14-minute blurb didn't do much. It did not address Bush's reaction (or his non-reaction) when he found out about the attacks, nor his strong ties to the Bin-Laden family and the Saudis, which are the two most disturbing things.

I could care less if Moore spins the truth about the President getting out of his car to walk to the White House.

I love how Bush and his cronies (Illuminati) brag about this tax cut. Yeah, thanks Georgie for that $300 that went to pay for the high gas prices you are doing nothing about. And tell Cheney not to spend my $300 all in one place.

Bush is still an ass.

 

[Dark One]

THat little 14-minute blurb didn't do much. It did not address Bush's reaction (or his non-reaction) when he found out about the attacks, nor his strong ties to the Bin-Laden family and the Saudis, which are the two most disturbing things.

I could care less if Moore spins the truth about the President getting out of his car to walk to the White House.

I love how Bush and his cronies (Illuminati) brag about this tax cut. Yeah, thanks Georgie for that $300 that went to pay for the high gas prices you are doing nothing about. And tell Cheney not to spend my $300 all in one place.

Bush is still an ass.

See how confrontational you are being?? Anyway, think whatever you want. I thought it was pretty well done. I can call Kerry an ass for entirely different reasons, but really don't see it as constructive. I plan on standing behind my president, whether I voted for him or not. I know Kerry is capable of good things and so is Bush and if you don't see that, then that's exactly the type of thinking I wish would change.

My purpose was to show that if you're clever, you can take propaganda and make it look like factual reporting. Moore isn't even close to being the only one on either side that does it, but he indeed does it, and does it masterfully. (I hate having to use terms like "on either side").

Everything about politics in this country anymore is so bitterly divided. It's all blame games and fingerpointing. It's like the left represents one team and the right represents the other. There's nothing wrong with different ways of looking at things, or common ground to take ideas and work with them instead of continually playing partisanism, delaying the implementation of important programs and wasting everyone's time. If an independent was in office that could actually handle the job (unlike H. Ross Perot), I know it could help heal some wounds. Not all, but it would certainly be a huge step in the right direction. Unfortunately, our culture is still so centered on the two party system, that any deviation from it is considered "throwing your vote away".

 

[J.]

It's like the left represents one team and the right represents the other. There's nothing wrong with different ways of looking at things, or common ground to take ideas and work with them instead of continually playing partisanism

I totally agree, which is why I would vote for John McCain in a heartbeat if he ran for Prez. The man is a Republican, but he sees opportunity on both sides and brings them together.

It's hard to tell if he's playing politics or if he's genuine, but from what I've seen of him in interviews and at rallies, the man is a strong leader who served in Vietnam, and isn't afraid to ruffle some feathers.

Again, it could be a facade.

 

[Dark One]

I totally agree, which is why I would vote for John McCain in a heartbeat if he ran for Prez. The man is a Republican, but he sees opportunity on both sides and brings them together.

It's hard to tell if he's playing politics or if he's genuine, but from what I've seen of him in interviews and at rallies, the man is a strong leader who served in Vietnam, and isn't afraid to ruffle some feathers.

Again, it could be a facade.

Amen J., that's the type of discussion I wish I'd see more of. Not just around here, but everywhere (journalism, political forums, break rooms at work, you name it). It's so hard to be constructive when the bashing is so consistently destructive. And Bush and Kerry certainly don't lead by example on that one. I mean, the game of "he said, he said" is rampant and out of control.

McCain is a great example of a Republican who is willing to at least hear the other side out on a regular basis and work together. I'll throw a Democrat out there as well - Joe Lieberman. The man would have made a great vice president.

 

[NAD]

There's nothing wrong with different ways of looking at things

Absolutely not, it's just a shame that the two-party system is so determined to remain vehemently opposed that room for people like McCain and even Schwartzisbigger is completely marginalized. I'm sure there are more than 5 politicians willing to see both sides of the aisle, but are either scared or bullied into remaining true to the party.

I didn't watch the video yet, it was taking too long to load at work.

 

[J.]

I just hope McCain runs in 2008. His name is recognized enough, and he's popular enough to give it a helluva shot.

His critiques and praises for both Kerry and Bush have won me over. And when he critiques, he's not being overly-critical ala Bush/Kerry, but being a gentleman about it and saying "You really need to think about this" instead of saying "You Suck!"

It's far too early to tell, but I'm seeing these two possibilities for 2008:

McCain vs H. Clinton - Probably won't happen, but the Dems would love Hillary to run. She has a strong female following and she carries the Clinton name, which brings peoples' minds back to the glory days of the 90's. But the military hates her and so do Repubs.

McCain vs Kerry - I think McCain wins this one. People are forgetting that Kerry wanted McCain as his running mate, which would have won the election for Kerry.

I'm probably way off base, as no one expected Kerry to make it this far, but it's fun to look ahead and play the guessing game for 2008, because I'm dead tired of 2004.

 

[NAD]

I predicted Kerry to be our next president in July of 2002, mostly because of his hair.

I would love to see Hillary run, but if she won the Democratic nomination she'd get removed, JFK style. Way too many people truly hate her.