flaming eachother's taste
- Thread starter JoeVice
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all_sins_undone
New Metal Member
- Oct 5, 2005
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Sadguru
In my dream...
all_sins_undone
New Metal Member
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OpethNZ
Member
Sadguru
In my dream...
all_sins_undone
New Metal Member
- Oct 5, 2005
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Dude, stop being a fucking idiot. You have to realize that their are tangents to a conversation, and that these tangents can also be discussed within the same fucking thread. Most threads go off topic, so don't fucking cry when they do. I know your english is bad, but fuck, you're annoying.
Forest-of-October
Here comes the apple, zed
blimey said:
although i see were sadguru is saying you went off track here... but i also agree with your statement. this statement could be used as a formula for the mode of thought that i was referring to as a problem when i started this thread.
We shouldn't have [Opeth (N)] vs. [other genres (Z)] here.
now, substitute the following for "opeth" and "other genres"
1. N = a genre Z = another genre
2. N = a band Z = another band
3. N = one's favorite song Z = another's favorite song
.
.
.
.
.boils down to N = one's subjective opinion Z = another's subjective opinion
like someone said earlier, people are so competitive and egotystical about their opinions...like they are trying to prove themselves...when its just music. no one is wrong about what music they like...its relative to that person.
think of it in terms of religion....a lot of psychotic christian missionaries go to poor, and starving heathen countries....they tell those people...we will feed you if you convert to christianity and let us baptize you...those missionaries believe so strongly in what they are doing, that they will blackmail people into converting...as if, their religious belief is the reason that these people are eating.
that is fucking sick!!!! you are doing the same thing when you try to convince someone that your opinion is right. "if you agree with me, that my song is better....then i will approve of you, and you can feel good about that...and i can feel good that i changed you for the better...and you can feel even better about that. because i was able to convert you to realize the truth...that still life IS better than ghost reveries...and that is the absolute truth...i believe so strongly! it must be!
MasterOLightning
Optimator
But doesn't everyone realize that some opinions are better than others? Some people make a point more eloquently or efficiently than others. When you are seeking recommendations for bands, who are you most likely to listen to? Probably someone who has somewhat similar tastes to you.
When you want to see a movie, do you listen to your friends or critics? Obviously you pick whichever has more similar taste to you. The same applies to music. People who have similar taste in music to me make more worthwhile statements to me. Since relatively few people here think like me (at least vs. the GMD), I don't value that many people's opinions here, hence not all opinons are equal to me.
When you want to see a movie, do you listen to your friends or critics? Obviously you pick whichever has more similar taste to you. The same applies to music. People who have similar taste in music to me make more worthwhile statements to me. Since relatively few people here think like me (at least vs. the GMD), I don't value that many people's opinions here, hence not all opinons are equal to me.
dishcloth
Boozehound & metalhead...
JoeVice said:
Okkkaayyy...back to reality lol. As much as I hate missionaries, this is only a forum man. This thread is kinda pointless. What are we on? A forum! Of course people are going to get flamed for their opinions!
Yes some people feel too strongly about "Still Life is better etc." or whatever and they go over the top, but at least it makes it interesting. What is the point of having an opinion if your afraid to express it because someone else may get offended. Sure there are times when maybe it's better to say nothing and not say your opinion, but it's only music we are talking about on here so say what you think.
I seriously question the conversion theory. No one is going to promise anyone anything if they like "Still Life". No gifts or anything. I doubt that the abusive "Still Life" fan is going to talk nicer to anyone anyway if they convert to "Still Life". I'm sure your strong enough not to be converted anyway...
I'm still confused as to why this thread was made, this forum is pretty civil, especially compared to a lot of other metal forums. Abuse here is pretty minimal, the only abuse is pretty childish and if it really offends anyone, then maybe they should see someone about it.
Remember people, if we have nothing better to talk about than "flaming each other's opinions" or arguing about arguing, then why the hell are we here? The forum is designed for hobby, a bit of fun and discussion. Don't take it too seriously.
BTW: Have an awesome New Year's Eve everyone!!!
Sadguru
In my dream...
Let's not confuse erudition with objectiveness. To answer your question, no...there's no "better" opinion simply because you can't assimilate a subjective experience to an objective fact. Some write more elequently than others, but that doesn't make their opinion more "true", so to speak.MasterOLightning said:
And I agree with you about picking whichever has a more similar taste to you.
My personal opinion on this sensative issue is the same as Joe's. Flaming is the stupidest thing I've ever seen, especially over personal opinions.
Instead of saying "you're such a fucking dumbass, shut the fuck up and realize that still life is the best opeth album ever and if you don't agree, you can fucking die in a fire", why not say something like "I personally think Still Life is the best Opeth album...why do you believe Ghost Reveries is? I dislike GR because of reasons x, y, and z. I love Still Life because of reasons a, b, and c.""
It's all about egos on the internet though, and that's why the internet is most possibly the worst place to have intelligent discussions about music, or really anything, on. It turns into one big egofest with insults flying back and forth. Really, what are you trying to prove? That your vast knowledge of whatever subject you're insulting the other person on is larger than their's? Get the fuck over your ego and learn how to "discuss" something calmy.
Instead of saying "you're such a fucking dumbass, shut the fuck up and realize that still life is the best opeth album ever and if you don't agree, you can fucking die in a fire", why not say something like "I personally think Still Life is the best Opeth album...why do you believe Ghost Reveries is? I dislike GR because of reasons x, y, and z. I love Still Life because of reasons a, b, and c.""
It's all about egos on the internet though, and that's why the internet is most possibly the worst place to have intelligent discussions about music, or really anything, on. It turns into one big egofest with insults flying back and forth. Really, what are you trying to prove? That your vast knowledge of whatever subject you're insulting the other person on is larger than their's? Get the fuck over your ego and learn how to "discuss" something calmy.
MasterOLightning said:
i can relate to some people's opinions better than others...but as far as those that i don't relate with...i don't necessarily disagree or think that mine is better.
when you hear one's opinion on an issue, like a favorite song...the first thing you do is recognize what their opinion is...you then put that up against what your opinion is. now, either you can respect their opinion, and voice yours...or you can voice yours, assuming that your own is right...and be appalled that someone doesn't agree with you...then flame them.
now, there is a difference between arguing opinions on the war in iraq and disputing over a favorite song. if someone says, "kill 'em all, and let god sort 'em out," i would say an attack on that person's morals is fair play. now, if someone says, "i like still life better than ghost reveries," who is that statement effecting? there is no right or wrong to it....attacking that opinion is pointless.
Sadguru
In my dream...
MasterOLightning
Optimator
Well, we all can say that a well explained point makes for better conversation. I mostly do this when I disagree with the majority. When I say that SL is the worst Opeth album, I have 10-12 reasons to support this.
Polls and such often don't foster great conversation, as they just ask you to post your list or top choice, etc. People who actually state a well-formulated opinion to begin with generally receive a better thread, whether people agree or not.
Polls and such often don't foster great conversation, as they just ask you to post your list or top choice, etc. People who actually state a well-formulated opinion to begin with generally receive a better thread, whether people agree or not.
dishcloth
Boozehound & metalhead...
NicholasDWolfwood said:
Yeah I agree totally. The sad thing is you are always going to get people who are abusive etc. We are pretty lucky here though, there isn't really all that much abuse on this forum. Opinions are necessary, but you're right, it is sad when people feel so strongly about their own opinions that they try to jam it down your throat and then flame you for not accepting it.
I guess thats just life though. Look as far as religion...been happening for centuries. :Spin:
dishcloth said:Okkkaayyy...back to reality lol. As much as I hate missionaries, this is only a forum man. This thread is kinda pointless. What are we on? A forum! Of course people are going to get flamed for their opinions!
Yes some people feel too strongly about "Still Life is better etc." or whatever and they go over the top, but at least it makes it interesting. What is the point of having an opinion if your afraid to express it because someone else may get offended. Sure there are times when maybe it's better to say nothing and not say your opinion, but it's only music we are talking about on here so say what you think.
I seriously question the conversion theory. No one is going to promise anyone anything if they like "Still Life". No gifts or anything. I doubt that the abusive "Still Life" fan is going to talk nicer to anyone anyway if they convert to "Still Life". I'm sure your strong enough not to be converted anyway...
I'm still confused as to why this thread was made, this forum is pretty civil, especially compared to a lot of other metal forums. Abuse here is pretty minimal, the only abuse is pretty childish and if it really offends anyone, then maybe they should see someone about it.
Remember people, if we have nothing better to talk about than "flaming each other's opinions" or arguing about arguing, then why the hell are we here? The forum is designed for hobby, a bit of fun and discussion. Don't take it too seriously.
BTW: Have an awesome New Year's Eve everyone!!!
yah, i kinda laughed when i read that whole conversion theory...it is a very vague connection. but, if you compare the mind of the missionary and the stubborn egopethian, (not putting a negative connotation on "opethian"...just liked the way those words combined) there is a similarity. when you look at what drives that person's motive to change some one else's mind...they just want that person to be saved. if you convert, one has given you salvation...the other has given you a
and an "I told ya so."and as far as this board not being bad...i only read one other message board, and that is the harmony central board...there is probably 1/50th the flaming that there is one here....most threads are very productive...people respect eachother's opinions. also, i have been on this board for a long time...and it is terrible compared to what it used to be.
Sadguru
In my dream...
Of course...MasterOLightning said:
Still, none of those would be valid because we all experience the "objective reality" in a subjective way.
dishcloth
Boozehound & metalhead...
JoeVice said:yah, i kinda laughed when i read that whole conversion theory...it is a very vague connection. but, if you compare the mind of the missionary and the stubborn egopethian, (not putting a negative connotation on "opethian"...just liked the way those words combined) there is a similarity. when you look at what drives that person's motive to change some one else's mind...they just want that person to be saved. if you convert, one has given you salvation...the other has given you a
and as far as this board not being bad...i only read one other message board, and that is the harmony central board...there is probably 1/50th the flaming that there is one here....most threads are very productive...people respect eachother's opinions. also, i have been on this board for a long time...and it is terrible compared to what it used to be.
Yeah I see what you mean man, probably is a similiar line of thinking shown there. Just don't get me started on missionaries LOL!
It is a pitty about abuse, but still I've been on a fair few other metal forums, most not on UM, but yeah it can be a lot worse than it is here. It's probably only because Opeth are becoming more popular.
BTW: This is how you discuss man! People take note! No need to abuse.
