Good and evil... do they exist?

[Seditious]

I still find it weird that you say someone whose only goal is pleasure would not discriminate among means to pleasure based on long-term concerns. You make it sound like this person's life is complete as soon as they have achieved pleasure just once.

I say that to explicate how weird the notion of 'pleasure as a goal' is.

Someone who doesn't realize pleasure is but a means may act as if pleaure is the goal, but the proof is in his actions that it in fact isn't, because he will deny his goal... supposedly so as to get his goal later lol. such a process only takes place if you appeal to a means-ends framework from which such decisions are made.

What if the person seeks to achieve the maximum possible pleasure over their entire lifetime? Surely they wouldn't squander the potential for long-term pleasure on a risky short-term means.

doesn't that suggest he doesn't just want pleasure because it is pleasure? that pleasure is merely a means he will continue to seek for what it amounts to beyond what it is? If I had food, and I thought I wanted to eat, but I didn't eat that food, my action would be proof that eating isn't all I want, but that I see eating as potentially a means to something else, which the current food isn't satisfactory for.

If pleasure is really your end, wouldn't you want to ensure that your lifetime pleasure is maximised?

if pleasure is your end how much pleasure you have doesn't matter. The true hedonist wants the highest pleasure to pain ratio. he would be wise to fuck, snort some cocaine, then blow his brains out on the comedown. If pleasure isn't "important"---it's not a means, it's just something you enjoy for its own sake and other than it's enjoyment it has no value---and nothing else is important---pleasure is your 'end' your 'goal in life'---then you have no reason to care about pleasure so much as to suffer and deny potential pleasures, because to have pleasure is all that matters, it wouldn't even matter if you had to die and no longer exist to feel pleasure anymore, because existence isn't important.

Explain to me why this idea of discriminating among pleasures is so antithetical to having pleasure as your primary goal.

if I think I want a drink but someone offers me water and I refuse, clearly I want more than thirst quenching. To deny what would give me what I claim I want is merely to prove that I have mistaken what I truely seek as an end.

 

[volrath666]

Good and evil only exsist on paper

 

[infoterror]

Good and evil are adjectives. What matters is end result: design and function.

"Bah" to training wheels like "good" and "evil" -- more pretense.