Iconoclast spoiler thread

Iconoclast's instrumental section is the best part on the album, choirs, symphony, hard-hitting groovy odd metric riffs. That's what I expected from the album.

I'm kind of a first impression type. I tend to believe that finding a regular song good after 10 listens is the kind of thing that would get many people to be sexually estimulated in other areas they don't assume they like at all.

When there's a lot going on, you need a few listens to know what's going on, but go out saying "that sounds okay now cause I listened 50 times" is like raping your ears, you're forcing yourself to like it, just cause it's a band you like and you're frustraded or you really enjoy forcing yourself.

Bastards of the machine isn't listenable at all. Choruses in general suck, and tend to ruin a song that until the chorus sounds pretty well (lord of chaos came to mind now but there's others) but it fuckin sticks to my head like a pop song (or a maiden song, wich is pretty close)

In the video, Romeo goes on about 16:15 how they're weren't known outside Japan, and the band had like their only thing going on and they weren't comfortable being known only in Japan and few places on Latin America and Europe. I think it's bad because compromises the sound a bit, but after 6 awesome albums straight (DG to PL) they fucking deserve it, apart from the right to do whatever the fuck they want. I hope at least they get what they are wanting, get bored again, and come back to progness...
 
I just don't like the fact that most of the lyrics I've written in the past AND HAVE THROWN IN THE TRASH because I thought they were bad are better than 99% of the lyrics in this album...
 
I just don't like the fact that most of the lyrics I've written in the past AND HAVE THROWN IN THE TRASH because I thought they were bad are better than 99% of the lyrics in this album...

Please submit 12 songs of yours with lyrics that you have written. I want to see your example of good lyrics.

Thanks,
 
There's actually quite a few songs in the past records that I wasn't able to stand because of the lyrics. Now I hardly even pay attention to them since I've learned to listen to vocal melodies rather. I'm not much of a poet afterall, I guess.

Are you seriously this buttfrustrated or do you just feel like arguing with me? :err:

Either way, welcome to my ignore list. :wave:
Ummm, I was just teasing you. I'm seriously not trying to piss anyone off, most of my stuff is just some kind of sarcasm or irony. I guess I made an error determining that you understand that sort of humor.
 
Please submit 12 songs of yours with lyrics that you have written. I want to see your example of good lyrics.

Thanks,

Anyone can write something better than (Can't you see what they're doing to you and me) (Don't look away, oh hear what I say) (STRIKE WITH POWER) I can go on and on and on..... No need to write any lyrics here.. In fact the sentence I just wrote before this one would work better as lyrics than some of whats in this album...<< that one too.... Don't get me wrong I really enjoy most of this album... but some of the things he says in these songs just make a little piece of me inside die every time I hear it...




*edit* also I never claimed to be a GOOD writer... I've just written horrible horrible lyrics better some of those mentioned above...
 
I can still enjoy Bastards Of The Machine even though I would have preferred an Accolade. Refusing to listen to it for what it is seems pointless And the latter two have pretty much always been present in Symphony X - can anyone really listen to The Accolade and say that cheesy lyrics completely ruin a song? Hell, if DWOT had been released today I'd probably be reading about how the album was full of heavy, rubbish tunes except for The Accolade, which was ruined by it's lyrics?

I don't think that's the case at all. Sure, you could say that singing about knights is cheesy. Many do. But feelings on the subject aside, The Accolade succeeds in telling its story competently. The words Russell wrote to that song actually evoked imagery of knights and that whole period of the middle ages.

A lot of others have already posted some of the most painful lines. Aside from those, so much of the stuff here is just consists of various "tough", "dark" or "evil" sounding phrases that could easily be shoved into any other song on the album. Yes, there is supposed to be an overall theme to the album. But I don't even get that feeling from most of it. Church of the Machine was another song with some cool lines and powerful imagery. Based on that, I originally had high hopes for this lyrical theme. Unfortunately, Church of the Machine has far better lyrics than anything on Iconoclast.

LittleTortillaBoy said:
They should hire good-old Thomas Miller to write the lyrics :)
Haha, yeah. I always thought he contributed some of the best stuff.
 
Iconoclast is starting to grow on me more. In comparing it with Paradise Lost I think that Iconoclast tends to have more variance. I believe Iconoclast has higher highs than Paradise Lost but also has lower lows (lyrical content). Overall I still think Iconoclast trumps Paradise Lost, which was a solid metal album nonetheless.

I am just waiting for the next next album to be released (#10!!!). Album #9 will probably be pure death metal to make up for Morbid Angel's pathetic showing this year. However, number 10 will probably be their greatest work yet.

Aptly titled... X: The Lies of Truth
 
I agree with mostly all of what RuRoRul said. Besides... are lyrics really THAT important to you guys? I honestly never gave a shit about lyrics. I listen to lots of different kinds of metal and some bands have the most rediculous lyrics but as long as the music is good I honestly dont even care. Symphony X lyrics were never that amazing to begin with and I never really cared about them. "A heart of gold, pumps within his metal skin" isnt cheesy? Cmon.
How about "Carry on, into the horizon, wielding courage, staff in hand"
or "Pharaoh's curse upon you
Who dares to invade his sacred ground
Gods of the Nile arise to strike you down"

You mean to tell me these examples arnt cheesy? Of course they are, but who cares?

There are only a few complaints I have read on this thread that I feel are somewhat well founded. Yes, on some songs, Russ's vocals are a little bit too agressive. Most noticable on the verses of Promethius, and on most of Dehumanized and Heretic. Otherwise the vocals are fine.

The other complaint that I can sorta relate to is, yes... most of the songs are pretty heavy and the album probably could use a tad more variety, but for what they are, I think they are all well written songs musically. I dont think there are really any filler songs on this album. I can enjoy all of them.

Iconoclast - Best song on the album and one of the best they have ever written. Lots of classic Symphony X elements like the choirs and the keys really remind me of V. Really diverse song.

End of Innocense - Classic Symphony X. Really like the keyboard and overall a fun, rockin song.

Dehumanized - Nice groovy riffs. Vocals are a little too aggressive. Really like the bridge before the solo section.

Bastards - OK, the chorus is kinda bland but I really love the verses and the solo section is among their best. Overall a good song to just rock out to.

Heretic - Extremely heavy. Probably my least favorite on the album but if im in the mood for just a raw heavy metal song its still good.

Children - Unique song. Nice chorus with good vocal harmonies. At times, reminds me a little too much of serpents kiss though

When All is Lost - Truley epic and a masterpiece. I dont really feel I need to say much about it. Everyone seems to agree that this is an amazing song. I would have liked more songs similar to this on the album, but as I said, for what the other songs are they are still well done. Only complaint about this song is I dont really like the way it ends. Feels like they should have sorta built up to it more. It kinda catches you off guard.

Electirc - Another solid song, I really like the chorus. Also love how the solo starts out with that wailing note.

Prometheus - Vocals are too aggressive in the verse which sorta ruins it for me, but the chorus is really unique and catchy.

Light up the night - Classic Symphony X. Could have been on old albums easily. no complaints, great song.

Lords of Chaos - has become one of my personal favorites. AWSOME groovy tune. I love every part of this song. The overally kinda laid back yet intense feeling it brings. I really love the riffs and the vocals and pretty much just everything. I real sleeper hit.

Madness - Great album closer. The keyboard is awsome in this song. Really brings something different to the table. The slow section in the middle with the piano really does bring a feeling of madness and insanity. A worthy closer to the album. Wish it didnt end so abruptly but otherwise its great.

Anyway, as people said, haters gonna hate. I think its a really great album and look forward to listening to it more and more. It just seems like people are honsetly TRYING to find things not to like about this album. Anyway, ill continue to enjoy it while the rest of you can just be bitter and whine some more.
 
^ I approve of this.

I seriously think the album is worth buying just for "Iconoclast" and "When All is Lost". The rest is a bonus.
 
Hmm...I don't mind heavy music at all. My complaint is that it's just bland and generic. Does anybody here really think these vocal melodies aren't lazy compared to the earlier stuff? Like I said, the phrasing is forced and feels obligatory rather than exciting. Ditto with the phrasing in the soloing. Where's all the call-and-response and groove?
 
I honestly dont see where you are coming from with the vocal melodies being lazy. I think for the most part they fit very well with the riffs. There are some parts where I suppose Russ could have been a little more dynamic. The chorus of Bastards would be improved if Russ sang it differently for example. However, the vast majority of the vocal melodies are fine IMO. What are some specific examples where you feel the vocal melodies are so lacking and how would you improve them if it was up to you? Im curious.
 
Just saw this facebook post by Jax:

Wow! Check out Iconoclast on Amazon:
Amazon Bestsellers Rank:
#95 in Music (See Top 100 in Music)
#1 in Music > Hard Rock & Metal
#46 in Music > Rock
And that's before the cd is even out; you fans fucking rock! Can't wait to see where the cd lands on Billboard!

It's going to do even better than PL. I'm happy for them.
 
Hmm...I don't mind heavy music at all. My complaint is that it's just bland and generic. Does anybody here really think these vocal melodies aren't lazy compared to the earlier stuff? Like I said, the phrasing is forced and feels obligatory rather than exciting. Ditto with the phrasing in the soloing. Where's all the call-and-response and groove?

I agree completely. It sounds uninspired. like it was written on the spot.
In an interview with Russ he said they don't do multiple takes/recordings (or he doesn't). He just sings it once and then he's happy with it because they otherwise get too critical.

I think that has become their entire song writing process since PL. Just write it, and sell it.
 
Maybe he goes with one take but im sure he actually writes the vocal melodies before hand. I doubt he just goes in there and free styles it completely

Also, glad the album is selling well.
 
I honestly dont see where you are coming from with the vocal melodies being lazy. I think for the most part they fit very well with the riffs. There are some parts where I suppose Russ could have been a little more dynamic. The chorus of Bastards would be improved if Russ sang it differently for example. However, the vast majority of the vocal melodies are fine IMO. What are some specific examples where you feel the vocal melodies are so lacking and how would you improve them if it was up to you? Im curious.

I think Dehumanized actually fits pretty well, minus the really awkward bridge. A lot of it just sounds like anthemic Iron Maiden nonsense, though.
 
I can't listen to the new songs anymore because it seems NB finally got around to ordering them removed (I refuse to DL music as I always seem to manage getting a virus when I do..). So now I have to just wait for my NB order to arrive in a week.

Anyway, from what I heard I believe I will enjoy it enough due to having more keys overall than PL and because it seems to not be produced quite as loud as it either (its still pretty close, but PL was just so over compressed).

On the subject of lyrics I don't think they are THAT bad. Cheesy, yes, a bit; however, cheesy is not necessarily bad unless you are one to totally abhor those types of lyrics. The only SyX album that throughout the lyrics were really thought provoking was V. Other than that every SyX is mostly full of cheesy lyrics save for a few or so on each.

I think I am going to enjoy Iconoclast and appreciate the things they brought back into this album that PL was lacking (a bit better production in the compression department, and atmospheric keys and solos). Even so, I do hope that what the post earlier said is true about them saying they know what "not" to do on the next album. To me it sounds like they may not make the next one so straightforward as the last two. I'm really hoping to get that progressiveness and variety back again, and I hope they oblige me.
 
Also, I forgot to mention that these cheesy lyrics are really seen heavily in a lot of metal, especially power metal. You can't get much cheesier than Rhapsody, and even though the Ayreon albums have pretty deep subject matter, the presentation of the material comes out as cheesy due to the way the lyrics are presented. I can really get in the mood for these cheesy lyrics sometimes and it is kind of cool how the subject can be kind of deep but be presented in sort of a cheesy/bombastic sort of way at the same time (Iconoclast).

As someone said already, its like how you can watch grindhouse/b movie style of movie and enjoy them for their cheese.