If Mort Divine ruled the world

[CiG]

*Doesn't mean anything to you.

Academics dribble bullshit all the time, it's essentially their job and they're often very short-sighted or just outright wrong.
I'm not saying the summarisations of academics is without value, but I don't need to measure my opinions up to academia in order to have an opinion which is admittedly (from the get-go) not provable, on a Metal forum.

Anyway, I'm not quite sure what race-based nationalities have to do with a religion, to be Chinese you have to come from a family of Chinese people. White people can't convert to Chinese. Even Judaism would be a stretch with it's dual race/religion identity.

I'm talking about a combination of population shift, conversion rates and decline in balancing factors like other religions, secularism, and declining birth rates among non-Muslims of almost every stripe.

How do dominating countries even factor in here? It's a bad comparison. Islam is not a country.

 

[rms]

I don't even know where to go anymore. You can totally be Chinese, if you become a citizen. If you are saying you cannot become a Han or Manchu or one of the other 60 ethnic minority groups, then there's a difference. Anyone can convert to Islam, I guess, but you can't be Sunni or Shiite or whatever other ethnic groups there are. If you're suggesting that all Muslims are working together to infiltrate white society, you're wrong nor have you linked any information to argue this.

There is no evidence to suggest that the muslim population will outnumber any EU country. Only a few affluent nations have a negative birth rate, like Italy, Japan and I think one or two more EU countries. The conversion rate is at best minimal as fuck or disproven courtesy of the article posted by Matthias. Muslims, like everyone else, stop making babies when they are wealthy. I posted the article and you do not address it. While on normal people this may make you re-think your theory, you just ignore it.

 

[Dak]

Sunni and Shiite are differences in interpretation, not ethnicities.

Why do you keep asserting Muslim populations will become richer? Much of the Islamic world is dependent on oilbased welfare.

I don't think that those trends we are talking about will continue, but it's not going to be thanks to any SJW backed/led changes in policy or fertility. The rise of Trump, Le Pen, et al is part of a backlash that, while misguided in many facets, is an apparently necessary countertrend, since more calm and rational assessments never get anyone motivated.

 

[rms]

Dude, you've argued that Muslim populations in western countries are going to take over the white majority. That's how they get wealthy, they immigrate to the west. If they stay in the middle east, they are nothing. Which is why I brought up India. Are you forgetting your argument!? The hell.

 

[Matt]

Given this piece of information I think much of the projected 60 million will convert to Islam.

You didn't read the other Pew article which implicity states that Islam will experience no net gain or loss due to conversion or switching.

Also, I don't think it's common for Christians to convert to Islam. Generally, they either switch to something similar to Christianity or completely leave religion.

Going into work so I can't go in depth, but these two points keep popping up.

So you are asserting that at some point the demographic trends will end because Muslims will get richer? Or non-Muslims will get poor and boost their fertility?

Both are possible scenarios. If they get richer, they'll have less children, and their population will stop getting larger. If they remain poor, the population will increase in already heavily Muslim areas, though that trend will slow as their population ages.

 

[Dak]

Dude, you've argued that Muslim populations in western countries are going to take over the white majority. That's how they get wealthy, they immigrate to the west. If they stay in the middle east, they are nothing. Which is why I brought up India. Are you forgetting your argument!? The hell.

I haven't forgotten my argument. My argument is about very long term demographic/political changes absent changes in trajectories. I'm trying to merely get agreement on the current trends and trajectories before address how those trends and trajectories get changed.

Also, I don't think it's common for Christians to convert to Islam. Generally, they either switch to something similar to Christianity or completely leave religion.

A generation to leave religion and a second to go back to religion and all bets are off as to which.

Both are possible scenarios. If they get richer, they'll have less children, and their population will stop getting larger. If they remain poor, the population will increase in already heavily Muslim areas, though that trend will slow as their population ages.

Ok, so a mechanism has been suggested, I can work with that.

Unemployment levels and corruption in most Islamic communities suggest to me that Muslim populations would stay poor relative to the country they are in. Many gulf states are not "poor", but the money comes either from oil or massive money flows (mostly related to oil), and the money is sequestered at the top (and the money is dependent on a finite resource supply/global demand of it). If we just assumed an economic stasis, Muslims could not be assumed to grow richer, unless you meant relative to Iraqi goatherders. However, as western economies falter (and this trend looks to be quite longterm, especially as countries grapple with encroachments by robotics and automation into unskilled and soon more skilled labor) and the "social safety net" begins to come apart under the strain, I believe Muslims will be among the most notable losers/scapegoats (partially because of their significant dependence and partially because of the obvious lack of assimilation), and this will bring things to a head much quicker than they would otherwise (it's already happening in fact).

In short, the crux of the argument that Muslims won't take over the world "because people won't let them" is most likely correct. So who are the people that "won't let them?"

 

[CiG]

I don't even know where to go anymore. You can totally be Chinese, if you become a citizen. If you are saying you cannot become a Han or Manchu or one of the other 60 ethnic minority groups, then there's a difference. Anyone can convert to Islam, I guess, but you can't be Sunni or Shiite or whatever other ethnic groups there are. If you're suggesting that all Muslims are working together to infiltrate white society, you're wrong nor have you linked any information to argue this.

There is no evidence to suggest that the muslim population will outnumber any EU country. Only a few affluent nations have a negative birth rate, like Italy, Japan and I think one or two more EU countries. The conversion rate is at best minimal as fuck or disproven courtesy of the article posted by Matthias. Muslims, like everyone else, stop making babies when they are wealthy. I posted the article and you do not address it. While on normal people this may make you re-think your theory, you just ignore it.

So you're saying you'd have to leave your own country, become a citizen of China and then return home? That's just stupid, why even bother trying to make that point? It's obviously not the same.

Sunni and Shiite aren't ethnicities in the way you think they are, yes these interpretations are handed down through family and culture and so there's a certain racial aspect to it, it's still just a variety of interpretation of the same texts.

I have not once suggested Muslims are working together to infiltrate white society, that's just an attempt to find malice in my opinions. In fact I haven't even once implied that Muslim is synonymous with non-white. Of course it's a faith filled mostly with non-white bodies but it's by no means a coloured religion, in fact some of the biggest booms in Islam conversion that I can see here in Australia is whites.

 

[arg]

we need to get rid of all the dumbass lefty leaders to get the muslim problem under control

 

[viewerfromnihil]

we need to get rid of all the dumbass lefty leaders to get the muslim problem under control

Eh, go back to your polskie on the BB forums for that.

 

[arg]

it applies to america too

 

[CiG]

Stop having opinion Arg, it's problematic.

 

[CiG]

Had to share this for it's sheer retardation. I used to be friends with this guy, possibly the most paradoxical person I have ever met. Is vehemently anti-communism and used to post about it everyday, writes anti-communist poetry, volunteers for philanthropist companies that help North Korean defectors but is the most hysterical feminist I know, has a huge female symbol/raised fist tattoo on his arm and basically believes all the same stuff that communism generally preaches.

https://www.facebook.com/spencer.phillips.12/posts/10153552242593411?pnref=story

 

[viewerfromnihil]

Barf. Not all men who like sex want to have sex with as many women as possible. I actively avoid sexual encounters with women that I have no interest in being in a relationship--not because I lack the primordial urge, but because I value my time. I also refuse to fuck virgins. And, as usual, after generalizing all men, there's the "well..." just make extra sure nobody is offended. God I hate third-wave feminism in its plebeian form.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

It's not like his stereotype isn't true to an extent. A lot of men do brag about fucking as many bitches as possible. Men are competitive, so bragging about fucking a slut is like bragging about beating video game X on the easiest difficulty. What he describes is a very male behavior.

EDIT: That being said, women that slut it up but then complain about men like these are retards and deserve all the shaming they can get. See:

Cady Scarborough Thank you! Due to myself being an unapologetically sexual person, I've had such a hard time dating. Once men found out how many partners I've had, they run away. Fortunately, I finally found someone who likes me for me and doesn't give a shit about how many people I've been with sexually.

I really wish men wold get out of that stupid mindset of wanting a prude or not as sexual female JUST so they could feel as if they conquered something. It's a really sad thing when men can have sex with as many women as he wants and not be ridiculed, but a woman can't without being slandered and dragged through the mud.

 

[CiG]

I'm not disputing that at all, it's the fact that he's underpinning all his drivel with "it's patriarchy" rather than what it really is, nature. Biology. Evolution. The natural world in general.

I can't fucking stand social constructivists.

 

[viewerfromnihil]

It's not like his stereotype isn't true to an extent. A lot of men do brag about fucking as many bitches as possible. Men are competitive, so bragging about fucking a slut is like bragging about beating video game X on the easiest difficulty. What he describes is a very male behavior.

I guess. However, I think this applies more to uneducated men than to educated ones.

 

[CiG]

Avoiding people that have had a lot of sexual partners is an evolutionary mechanism for avoiding diseases, sexually promiscuous people are a risk factor.

 

[viewerfromnihil]

That's not evolutionary. It's cultural and sub-cultural.

 

[HamburgerBoy]

That's not evolutionary. It's cultural and sub-cultural.

This. Evolution doesn't give a shit about syphilis or HIV as long as you fill enough women with baby-making fluids.

 

[viewerfromnihil]

Or mens' buttholes, if Foucault's experience was any indication.