If Mort Divine ruled the world

:lol:

None of this makes any sense. Someone is a little bit butthurt I suspect. It's okay, you'll get over it and then maybe you'll type something worth seriously responding to.

As great an argument as I'd expect from a person whose ethnic background puts his IQ approximately two standard deviations below the mean.
 
I can't speak for HBB's rant, but it reminds me of the following graphics.

The world before colonialism:



The world at the height of colonialism (orange is UK controlled, yellows are France/Spain/Portugal controlled):

 
Last edited:
HBB's argument seems to be that Castro wasn't as bad as Mao, therefore he shouldn't be treated with the level of opprobrium that he receives. First of all, why does this even matter? Secondly, who knows what Castro would have done had he the resources that Mao had at his disposal. Mao killed millions because he had millions to spare. The Great Leap Forward killed 2-4x the total population of Cuba in the 60s in a handful of years and China is still full of Chinese.
 
HBB's argument seems to be that Castro wasn't as bad as Mao, therefore he shouldn't be treated with the level of opprobrium that he receives. First of all, why does this even matter? Secondly, who knows what Castro would have done had he the resources that Mao had at his disposal. Mao killed millions because he had millions to spare. The Great Leap Forward killed 2-4x the total population of Cuba in the 60s in a handful of years and China is still full of Chinese.

He wasn't as bad as dozens of political leaders that don't receive the same criticism as him. I never mentioned Mao, I mentioned Pinochet, Tito, and Franco, none of whom enjoy Castro's infamy in American culture.

Are you saying that, as a percentage of their respective populations, Castro killed as many as Mao? Mao killed roughly 10% of his population, a quick calculation for Castro would range somewhere between maybe 0.5% and 2%. Further, Castro primarily killed in two ways: first were a number of executions of political opponents, counter-insurgents, etc (basically a normal part of any violent coup), second were those fleeing by raft and drowning somewhere in the gulf. Mao, in contrast, killed primarily through sheer incompetency and even turned down help from the Soviets just to satisfy his ego, but still managed to intentionally murder millions decades after the coup. Mao is understandably considered one of the all-time worst because he was. He was a dumb rural fuck and overthrew a superior, and relatively independent government, and you can just look at Taiwan to appreciate the headstart the alternative enjoyed. Further, if it wasn't for American diplomacy and trade, they might have continued starving through the 70s for all we know. Castro didn't have that advantage nor the geographical wealth of China, and even he managed to keep things somewhat stable.
 
He wasn't as bad as dozens of political leaders that don't receive the same criticism as him. I never mentioned Mao, I mentioned Pinochet, Tito, and Franco, none of whom enjoy Castro's infamy in American culture.

Proximity to the US and friendliness to Communism/Soviet Russia vs antipathy to the US explain most of it. And I'm not sure why Tito is on your list of "worse".

Castro didn't have that advantage nor the geographical wealth of China, and even he managed to keep things somewhat stable.

Probably significantly because he didn't turn down Soviet help.
 
Proximity to the US and friendliness to Communism/Soviet Russia vs antipathy to the US explain most of it. And I'm not sure why Tito is on your list of "worse".

Probably significantly because he didn't turn down Soviet help.

Well yeah that's basically my point. Obsession over Castro is a very American phenomenon, and we shouldn't act offended when the occasional left-wing British politician admits that Castro had valid scruples with Batista or that Castro wasn't a total blood-thirsty tyrant.

Sure, and that made him smarter than many other commies.
 
The Florida angle doesn't explain international criticism of Castro though.

My problem with Corbyn's statement isn't that he refuses to outright and unequivocally condemn Fidel Castro, who was only brought up because he had died of course, but rather my problem is the points he raised in favour of Fidel Castro are pretty standard leftist apologetics when it comes to Fidel Castro.
 
Sure, Castro is worthy of serious criticism, but I don't think the international world cares much. Plus, when other nations do say anything positive about him, America tends to get butthurt.

It should be expected that a leftist is going to praise someone for doing leftist things. It's not really any different from right-wingers saying "Well hey, at least Pinochet strengthened the economy" (something I do say btw; I consider fascism to have a slightly better track-record than communism on the whole).
 
  • Like
Reactions: CiG and Dak
Fascism and Communism share both real and theoretical problems. The problem for leftists is they don't recognize the theoretical problems causing the real problems of Communism and therefore ignore the real problems as "not really applying the theoretical".
 
  • Like
Reactions: CiG
I suppose I just think it's bullshit that Jeremy Corbyn can be the leader of the Labour Party and say these things, but if Theresa May did the right-wing equivalent I have a gut feeling it would be a national scandal.

It'd be great if politics were less politically correct when it comes to the public arena as I think an open and honest discourse which involves communism and fascism as non-taboo subjects would be really healthy.

Something like that.
 
Mukherjee's position on genetics is highly contested. There's an article in Nature about a piece he wrote for The New Yorker some time ago. Stirred up a lot of controversy.

http://www.nature.com/news/researcher-under-fire-for-new-yorker-epigenetics-article-1.19874

Steve Henikoff, a geneticist and molecular biologist at the Fred Hutchinson Cancer Research Center in Seattle, Washington, was quoted on Coyne’s blog: “Mukherjee seemed not to realize that transcription factors occupy the top of the hierarchy of epigenetic information,” he wrote. “Histone modifications at most act as cogs in the machinery.”

Coyne’s two blog posts about The New Yorker article each gathered more than 100 comments, many of them from scientists. Richard Mann, a molecular biologist and biophysicist at Columbia University Medical Center in New York City, noted that the article mentioned histones 26 times without a single mention of the word transcription. “Only a talmudic-like reading can reveal a hint that something other than histone modifications are at play.”

In a response published on the website of the Scripps Translational Science Institute in La Jolla, California, Mukherjee thanked his critics for their “immensely detailed comments”. Speaking to Nature, Mukherjee says that, after re-reading the story, he felt that he put too much emphasis on the “speculative” roles of histone modification and DNA methylation. “This was an error,” he says, adding that a mention of transcription factors could have helped to avoid “an unnecessarily polarizing reading of the piece”. He says that The New Yorker is “very likely” to run a response.

Not to discredit Mukherjee, who's an intelligent person. But many of his ideas generate disagreement (as ideas should--just wanted to share). Haven't listened to the podcast yet, have to check it out.
 
i haven't noticed any of those words in the podcast, but admitting you made a mistake in your argument is pretty awesome so that's a plus
 
Listening to that pod-cast now, pretty good. I appreciate that Harris interviewed Murray in an evenhanded manner and is now dismissive of the unsubstantiated, unprofessional hysteria and vitriol surrounding the man.
 
i haven't noticed any of those words in the podcast, but admitting you made a mistake in your argument is pretty awesome so that's a plus

Okay then.

I think it's interesting that Eternal Metal and I were both trying to explain the same thing to you, and yet somehow you see yourself as being in agreement with him and not me.
 
havent read his original piece nor anything but the excerpt but none of that seems to counter or address either of our points. in fact, I think EternalMetal and I agreed more than you and I did, as I do not agree with your framing of evolutionary history. Maybe this is all wrong, havent thought about that conversation since the last reply and had finals week after it