IN FLAMES Clayman Re-recorded 2020

[ciko_gfb]

I'd say Black Dahlia is pretty much full MDM at this point. Here's one of my favorites by them.

Hmm, first time I'm listening band, nice music I like it. Would love some more suggestion from them.

 

[ciko_gfb]

BTW Abnegation's demo version is awful. That chorus?? Omfg I cant even listen it. Album version is way better.

 

[DE4life]

BTW Abnegation's demo version is awful. That chorus?? Omfg I cant even listen it. Album version is way better.

Verse vocals in the demo are way better. Anders doesn't even scream properly on the album version and the chorus on the album version is significantly worse. Not saying the singing on the demo version is good but it flows far better than the album version which sounds disjointed and weird. Album version sounds massively overprocessed in general to me. The demo version isn't perfect but I prefer the raw sound.

Abnegation demo = Come Clarity vocals with less production values
Abengation = shit overprocessed ASOP vocals, ruining the song as they did for practically every song on ASOP

Just to take one example, the bit towards the end when Anders sings "we believe, but we don't see" - you seriously think that sounds better in the album version with those weird vocal effects over the top of it? Literally the only thing I prefer about the album version of Abnegation is the drums which are better produced, and the solo sounds better harmonised. That's about it though.

 

[DE4life]

I just listened to The Mirror's Truth for the first time in a while, and I have such mixed emotions about this song.



The beginning introduces us to ASOP's shit guitar tone which is a downer. First verse, passable vocals, awful sounding riff, drums also sound like shit with that weird clicking noise. Some really fantastic guitar melodies for about ten seconds before we're back to the verse which now has progressively worse vocals until we get to the first (half) chorus. Chorus in general has some good melodies but the vocals are pretty annoying in all honesty. Next verse, vocals still shit, uninspired riffing and now some random elecronics thrown in for good measure. Whatever. Solo is pretty basic but OK for what it is. Anders finally finds a decent scream with the final "disappear" but it's a bit late by then.

It's weird because live this song is awesome. On album it's really not.

 

[eochaid]

BTW Abnegation's demo version is awful. That chorus?? Omfg I cant even listen it. Album version is way better.

You're half deaf. The chorus of the demos is ten thousand times better. The album version is painful just to listen to it.

 

[drawntoblack]

The problem with final vocals on ASOP is that there is a shitton, and I mean shitton of autotune on it. And once you hear it you can't unhear it and all those little tiny edited bits gnaw at your brain every time. And the vocals are also an overly compressed, overly layered mess that sounds very lifeless.
Demo of Abnegation is a great example versus the final version. Demo has a single vocal melody and final album version has 15 different layers that sound too polished while lacking definition.

I just listened to The Chosen Pessimist for probably the first time in the last ten years. Still absolute dog shit of a track, I can't believe those bonus tracks didn't make it onto the album and this did.

 

[DE4life]

The problem with final vocals on ASOP is that there is a shitton, and I mean shitton of autotune on it. And once you hear it you can't unhear it and all those little tiny edited bits gnaw at your brain every time. And the vocals are also an overly compressed, overly layered mess that sounds very lifeless.
Demo of Abnegation is a great example versus the final version. Demo has a single vocal melody and final album version has 15 different layers that sound too polished while lacking definition.

I just listened to The Chosen Pessimist for probably the first time in the last ten years. Still absolute dog shit of a track, I can't believe those bonus tracks didn't make it onto the album and this did.

I can't believe some people unironically like TCP. I don't get it. It's so, so boring. The only reason the ending sounds half-decent is because the preceeding 6 minutes are so utterly lifeless and devoid of any musical value. Also, Anders' vocals on TCP.... just lol. Awful.

What bothers me about Anders vocals on ASOP, besides the excessive autotuning and layering, is how half-arsed they sound. Like, he can't be bothered to scream for most of the verses so he just does a shit sounding yell and then screams a couple of words here and there. It's what you expect him to do live, not on a studio album. There are a few tracks where he doesn't phone it in, but most of them have this problem.

 

[drawntoblack]

I can't believe some people unironically like TCP. I don't get it. It's so, so boring. The only reason the ending sounds half-decent is because the preceeding 6 minutes are so utterly lifeless and devoid of any musical value.

I get what they wanted to do with that song. I do, they wanted this slow building epic except this track is too damn long and doesn't have any release. It starts to build up, then stops, then builds up again, then stops. Then a different type of buildup. Etc. It sounds like they tried to write Evil in a closet 2.0 like five different times and mashed those mismatching parts and just called it a day. Singing is annoying as hell and even the lyrics, while I appreciate the meaning behind them, are just whiny and pathetic.
Regarding auto-tune, don't get me wrong, all bands use it here and there. I'm not against the principle. But when you have that on every track on particular syllables, and once you notice it, it keeps popping into your attention every time you hear it even when you are not paying attention to the music. This is not really the singer's fault as much as the mixing engineer's one because he either did a piss poor job or went too far and tried to do something that doesn't sound natural.
That being said, Anders's performance is pretty garbage on that album through and through. He sounds like he is screaming with 20% of power on low battery. And they also tracked his vocals through a guitar amp to match that shitty low-gain sound of the guitars for effect so that didn't help either.

Swear to god, play any track from ASOP and then play any track from Come Clarity after. It will sound like you took out earplugs and your ears just successfully depressurized. Come Clarity production is madly underrated.

 

[DE4life]

Swear to god, play any track from ASOP and then play any track from Come Clarity after. It will sound like you took out earplugs and your ears just successfully depressurized. Come Clarity production is madly underrated.

Yeah, the production between CC and ASOP is night and day. CC's production does have a couple of minor issues but it sounds fucking pristine compared to the over-compressed disaster that is ASOP.

As far as TCP is concerned I agree. Shit vocals, buildup goes on for way too long and never has a proper release, lyrics are more amusing than deep, and overall it just doesn't hit the mark. It was OK when I saw it live last year, but that's because Anders growled all of it and they shaved about 3 minutes off the track so yeah, that's one way to fix TCP.

 

[DE4life]

http://www.mtv.com/news/1457316/slipknot-tour-cancellation-helps-in-flames-craft-reroute-to-remain/

Random old article from MTV of all places about In Flames, from 2002. Some notes.

As it turned out, Slipknot were well versed in the group's style, one built around contemporary aggressive guitar riffing juxtaposed with the catchy, melodic leanings of more traditionally minded heavy metal. It's a style that has developed consistently since In Flames released their appropriately titled Subterranean EP in the early '90s.

Uh, Lunar Strain?

2000's landmark Clayman combined the most effective moments of previous records like Colony and Whoracle, placing In Flames firmly atop the heap of the so-called "New Wave of Swedish Death Metal,"

Hard disagree. Clayman took elements of Colony and made it poppier, but there ain't much if anything taken from Whoracle in there. Also I don't think IF were labelled "Swedish Death Metal", but since it's MTV I guess I'll let it slide.

"I came from a really self-destructive relationship," he said. "That was almost two years ago, [but] I'm still dealing with some of those topics. It takes a while to get it out. I think even the next album will still deal with some of these topics.

And the next album, and the next album, and the next album... 'it takes a while to get it out' indeed.

Reroute to Remain still draws liberally from the gallop of Iron Maiden and the crushing staccato of Florida death metal with equal reverence

Wait, wut? Florida Death Metal on Reroute? Not really.

"I'm afraid that [older fans] will judge this album upon if it's a 'Gothenburg death metal album' and already make up their minds," Friden said. "It's a new metal album."

There you go folks, from the horse's mouth/arse itself - Reroute is not MDM, as per Anders himself it's "New Metal".

 

[DE4life]

I also just found this in the Blabbermouth archives from January 2002...

IN FLAMES SPEAK OUT AGAINST FANS NARROW-MINDEDNESS

This gon' be good

We have just completed a kick-ass pre-production of our forthcoming album.

“We are very proud of it and we hope that everyone out there is going to appreciate it as much as we do. It might be safe to say that anyone who is ignorant enough to expect a conservative and undeveloped sound shouldn't bother to come out of their shell. We feel really connected to our fans that can relate to us and our music, and we think it's awesome that you guys still get it and are able to move forward with us. It's really sad that some people have so much time on their hands and have such disillusioned ideas about reality that they can sit and complain to those that are successful in doing what they love. It's even more alarming that some people, probably a very small minority of you, think that following and appreciating a band involves forming that band [i.e. dictating what a band does in musical terms]. HELLO? If we don't like what another band does, we don't buy the album. What we would not do is lose our heads and sit in an old T-shirt that mom washes and be naïve enough to think we were superior and that we could reach anybody by whining.

“Another news flash for the clueless! If you claim to be so loyal and all-knowing then you would know that we have toured a million times with bands like CHILDREN OF BODOM, DARK TRANQUILLITY, ARCH ENEMY and so on. Where were you then? And who the hell said we will never tour with bands like that again? If there was anything you could ask of us it is to not stagnate, which is what we would do if we didn't mingle with other bands, be opened-minded and filter new impressions. Please observe that this does NOT mean that we will sound like another band. It's a bit ridiculous that when we released Clayman, no one ever mentioned nu-metal and suddenly we are perceived as just that. We haven't changed a thing since then so all this new labeling sh.t is really uncalled for. We haven't even toured with SLIPKNOT yet and some of you guys are sh.tting your pants because this is somehow very threatening to you. An advice to those few of you who feel that way is to try to be comfortable with your own identity instead of trying to cling onto symbols that supposedly will grant you some credibility in isolated groups. Wear whatever the hell you want but keep your fashion rules to yourselves unless you want to be a designer. We never got into this business for the sake of distancing us from something else. We do what we do because we love it. It's contradicting to disassociate yourself from something that you see as 'normal' or mainstream and then be part of a click where everyone has to follow the same made-up rules and conventions anyway!! This is called hypocrisy. We are self-confident enough to explore our own style and not be tied to anyone's rules or fall victims of any peer pressure. We were hoping that would make you proud. It makes us sad that some haven't understood that originality is daring to choose your own paths and not belong to a barricaded category.

“Some of you need to realize that you are acting exactly like the people you are trying to rebel against. Like your old folks saying to you: 'Turn that noise off sonny, it's repulsive!' Or like the people in the street snaring at your black, torn outfit with a really scary monster on it: 'Poor boy, he doesn't know he looks like an idiot'. You are being just as lame when you diss others' preferences. It's so ironic! Have some insight and try not to be exactly like the ones you despise. Seems like you don't know what you are going to do if you were associated with something that didn't make your grandma turn over in her grave. Grow up!

“The aim of the forum is for fans to meet, share experiences and come with creative ideas. It's not like we're afraid of criticism, we visit our site every day to see what's up, but there is a difference between bitchin' and being constructive. Reflect on relevancy before you make a statement because we can do without elitist minded people. No one has exclusive ownership of any band so abandon that idea.

“We deserve every chance we can get because we have struggled to get this far so why would you even want us to stop now? Man, it's not like you guys still play in the sandbox although you did that when you were five. Or do you….? If you do, that's your prerogative. Good luck in the future!

“For those of you who have your own lives: We love you guys and we look forward to seeing you soon! We have a great year to look forward to!

“IN FLAMES — Anders, Björn, Daniel, Jesper & Peter”

JHC, they got triggered hard and this is BEFORE Reroute was released, so I assume they are talking about people who were unhappy with Clayman? If only they knew what was to come.

"We haven't even toured with SLIPKNOT yet and some of you guys are sh.tting your pants because this is somehow very threatening to you. "

who do we think wrote this? Anders or Jesper I'd guess.

 

[eochaid]

"We haven't even toured with SLIPKNOT yet and some of you guys are sh.tting your pants because this is somehow very threatening to you. "

who do we think wrote this? Anders or Jesper I'd guess.

Because nobody wanted IF sound to be like that of some annoying American band. And here we are, 18 after that press release, with IF sound being like any annoying American band.

A band without a soul or a purpose. That's what they've been since R2R was released, no matter how much I might like or dislike the albums. They don't have a sound of their own. They don't have a soul of their own and will be remembered as being the pioneers of melodeath despite what they want

 

[DE4life]

An interview with Bjorn and Peter from 2002, for some American metal show, I guess. Bjorn's earrings yarrrr.

 

[DE4life]

Also clarification on the Anders/Jon Schaffer (Iced Earth) beef...





Sounds like Anders was being a dick in this situation tbh.

 

[eochaid]

He's fucking far from being a rock star ,

Though I found fucking laughable all of that "We're americans" thing. I guess he just did that to piss Anders.

 

[drawntoblack]

Also clarification on the Anders/Jon Schaffer (Iced Earth) beef...

View attachment 25372

View attachment 25373

Sounds like Anders was being a dick in this situation tbh.

Anders taking issues with pro-America statements only to have 3 americans in the band a decade later?
Also fun fact - Chris Broderick, the ex-Megadeth guitar player who is now playing with In Flames was playing with Jag Panzer back then.

I also just found this in the Blabbermouth archives from January 2002...

IN FLAMES SPEAK OUT AGAINST FANS NARROW-MINDEDNESS

This gon' be good



JHC, they got triggered hard and this is BEFORE Reroute was released, so I assume they are talking about people who were unhappy with Clayman? If only they knew what was to come.

"We haven't even toured with SLIPKNOT yet and some of you guys are sh.tting your pants because this is somehow very threatening to you. "

who do we think wrote this? Anders or Jesper I'd guess.

Now that's some cringe, pretty sure that had to be Anders writing that shit.

 

[DE4life]

My guess is Anders, but some of the phrasing reminds me of Jesper's drunken rants, so who knows. The English seems a bit too good to be either of them at that point in time, really, so I wonder if they got somebody to write it for them. I believe that tantrum was posted on these very forums, when they were still the official IF forums. This statement obviously just made things worse as soon the band disowned the UM IF forum entirely and deleted everything from them, which is why the oldest topics on this current version of the forum are from mid-2003.

 

[The Grayfox]

I just listened to The Chosen Pessimist for probably the first time in the last ten years. Still absolute dog shit of a track, I can't believe those bonus tracks didn't make it onto the album and this did.

I can't believe they've OPENED with that stupid shit. It's gotta be in my top 5 most disliked In Flames songs.

 

[Sierota]

Hmm, first time I'm listening band, nice music I like it. Would love some more suggestion from them.

Sure. This one's good. Check out the scream at the beginning.

 

[DE4life]

Anders interview from 2004:

http://www.maximummetal.com/interviews/intresults.asp?ID=andersfriden_if&idBand=9

Are there any plans for a DVD to be released for the band in the near future?

A: We are actually working on collecting footage and compiling it for an upcoming DVD. We have been filming shows from all over in Europe and the States and are compiling those and shows from the past ten years to put together something really special for our fans because without them we wouldn't be able to do what we are doing now. It will probably be a two disc set with some video clips on there as well. And we are also planning on taking our video director with us when we go to Japan and Australia to get some shows taped while we are there to put on the DVD. But like I said it will be something special for the DVD.

A shame this never happened. The U&A DVD was cool, but a DVD with that much old footage would have been awesome.

What are your thoughts about downloading? Have you all considered putting an album on your website for fans to download before it is released?

A: Downloading I think is cool. I don't think it hurts us as an extreme metal band because most of the fans want to buy the album instead of downloading the album. It seems to me that the more popular music is hurt by downloading rather than metal bands. I myself download stuff but only to preview it to see whether or not I want to buy it. I have a pretty good CD collection and I would say that 3 or 4 of them are burns but those are albums that I cannot find anywhere. And that is my thought about the older stuff, if you can't find it I don't see why you shouldn't download it. We haven't put an album on the website due to it being directed by the label so that would be something we would have to clear through them to do, but it would be cool to do.

Anders is a pirate himself and is cool with downloading, so we can all stop feeling guilty about downloading those leaks now

Well thanks for taking time out of your day off to do this interview. I usually let whoever I'm talking to close the interview out with whatever they feel like saying so fire away and best of luck to you guys in the future.

A: Thanks man. Everyone Vote Kerry. John Kerry for President.

Anders also appears to be a democrat. Sorry Slave/Krofius.