James Labrie

[Ascension]

Its his style and the natural sound of his voice that turns people off.

With DT obviously ruling the prog metal genre (with JLB being part of the reason they are there)...the "turned off people" you speak of are obviously in the extreme minority.

 

[General Zod]

Khan--Are you kidding me? Have you heard this guy on the last two Kamelot tours? He can't even handle a three-month tour performing 90-minute sets! His voice wouldn't exist after performing 2-3-hour shows on the road for a year straight!

Lance King--I personally like Lance as a singer. However, I don't exactly think of power when I listen to him. Zod, it kills me that you absolutely love Lance yet abhor James. They certainly have their differences, but I think they have a similar approach to the high end. Anyway, Lance isn't quite as diverse as James. He has a specific sound to which he likes to stick, which suits me just fine as a listener. He'd sound great on stuff like "Under A Glass Moon," but do you think he would sound just as convincing on "I Walk Beside You?" I doubt it.

Russell Allen--One of my favorite vocalists. He would come close to pulling off the different sides of Dream Theater's music. He would give the heavier songs even more balls, and he can match the emotion of LaBrie on the lightest stuff. However, I cringe at the thought of him behind the mike on pop-influenced songs like "Prophets Of War." Besides, I don't think he'd hold up so well on such a lengthy touring schedule.

Mikael Akerfeldt--Now I know you're kidding. Anybody who wants to claim that LaBrie sounds too breathy when he's singing ballads couldn't possbily, in a perfect world, be a Mikael Akerfeldt fan. I've never heard a weaker singer for lighter music in my life! Mind you, I've seen Opeth three times, one of those times being for the "Damnation" tour with Porcupine Tree. Akerfeldt has no range outside of the half-octave represented on the sung portions of Opeth's songs. Other than that, he can growl. How would growling work with Dream Theater? I have two words for you: it wouldn't.

Michael Eriksen--I think he would be the best fit for Dream Theater out of all of the singers mentioned. His range is excellent, his tone is very pleasing, and his delivery is full of emotion. It's really just a matter of how well he could handle the constant touring.

Met-Al... first off, excellent post.

Khan is a great studio vocalist. His strengths lie in his subtleties. However, as you correctly stated, he can't reproduce what he does in studio live, and he can't even make it through a 90 minute set, without his voice falling off a cliff.

Russell's strengths are stronger than James' strengths, but James is more balanced.

Akerfeldt has improved by leaps and bounds as a vocalist. And I think people tend to overrate his vocals, based on the fact that he is the defacto gold standard for singers who do both harsh and clean vocals (personally, I prefer Paul Kuhr). However, if you rate him based on clean vocals alone, he's a very average singer.

As for Lance, I can see why someone who likes James might be baffled that someone could like Lance, but not James. However, I enjoy Lance's vocals for the most basic and simplistic of reasons... I like his voice. His sound simply resonates with me. Could he go out there every night and sing all the songs in DT's set? Hard to say until he's actually done it. If I was a betting man, I'd bet heavy on "yes".

Michael Eriksen... the kid has a crazy set of pipes. There are very few Prog bands on the planet who wouldn't be improved if they brought Mike in as their singer, and that includes Dream Theater.

Zod

 

[Wandrail]

With DT obviously ruling the prog metal genre (with JLB being part of the reason they are there)...the "turned off people" you speak of are obviously in the extreme minority.

LaBrie is the most divisive element of the group, and the most frequently mentioned reason why people don't like the band, even if they like other aspects of it. Not that controversial a thing to say, its a subject that's been rehashed a bazillion times in every internet forum that has ever mentioned DT at some point and a conversation I imagine many of us have had with people more than once. Like I said, I like DT and I like LaBrie...but with caveats.

 

[Berek2000]

He is a very unique singer - I cannot think of anyone that sounds like he does.

this is not always a good thing...

 

[General Zod]

With DT obviously ruling the prog metal genre...

As per Wikipedia....

"Dream Theater has sold over two million albums in the U.S.,and over 8 million records worldwide."

"Queensrÿche has been relatively successful in the progressive scene, having sold over 20 million albums worldwide including over 11 million albums and videos in the United States."

...(with JLB being part of the reason they are there)...the "turned off people" you speak of are obviously in the extreme minority.

Are they an "extreme minority" because they're small and vocal, because they're such a small percentage, or both?

Zod

 

[Wyvern]

I like James LaBrie vocals a lot in and out of Dream Theater. I think he did great jobs in "The Human Equation" (Ayreon) and in "Leonardo - The Absolute Man" (all star cast project). I like his first two Mullmuzler solo albums but I dislike the third because of the music (same like DT's "Train Of Thought" was too modern for my taste).

 

[King Lek]

Overall I like Labrie's sound....though there are times where I certainly understand where others are coming from.

Best way to look at this, for me anyways....Van Halen is not Van Halen without David Lee Roth.
DLR, compared to just about anyone, is lacking as a pure vocalist....and Sammy is a much more competent vocalist to say the least ..but....it's just not the same.

DT without Labrie would result in the same thing.

 

[biggs0072000]

And if we're nominating vocalists to replace James, to allow Dream Theater to reach their full potential, I nominate Lance.

Zod

After the fantastic job Lance did on "Pull Me Under" live, I completely support that statement. That being said, I obviously don't mind James that much with "Awake" being one of my favorite albums of all time.

 

[Ascension]

As per Wikipedia....

"Dream Theater has sold over two million albums in the U.S.,and over 8 million records worldwide."

"Queensrÿche has been relatively successful in the progressive scene, having sold over 20 million albums worldwide including over 11 million albums and videos in the United States."

First...to answer, l'll utilize a statement you made once about Wikipedia being a poor resource of information.

Second... people always throw out album sales as "the" measuring stick. I think we all know it's not an accurate measurement device. Otherwise, Britney Spears would own us all.

Third...QR hasn't been "progressive" since Promised Land. They gave up being anything in the progressive rock or metal genre many years ago.

Are they an "extreme minority" because they're small and vocal, because they're such a small percentage, or both?

Zod

Take your pick.

 

[General Zod]

First...to answer, l'll utilize a statement you made once about Wikipedia being a poor resource of information.

I don't ever recall making that statement. However, if I did, my opinion on it has changed drastically. I use it all the time for school, as it's widely accepted in the academic world. A recent study showed it to be as reliable as the Encyclopaedia Britannica.

Second... people always throw out album sales as "the" measuring stick. I think we all know it's not an accurate measurement device. Otherwise, Britney Spears would own us all.

If people use sales as some sort of measure of talent or quality, then I agree, sales are a worthless measuring stick. However, to say a band has dominated a genre, when the numbers and my own personal opinion paint a contrary opinion, clearly makes you wrong.

Third...QR hasn't been "progressive" since Promised Land. They gave up being anything in the progressive rock or metal genre many years ago.

So if we're talking current day, by what standard does DT dominate? Record sales?

Zod

 

[Wherewolf]

Zod,
I would not say QR are a progressive metal band. I will have to say in my opinion, DT put prog metal on the map. After "Images and Words" was released the prog community (fans and bands) went completely off the wall, how can you really argue that? They are thee biggest reference point in prog metal..period. My personal feelings aside...DT have become the KISS of prog metal!

 

[General Zod]

I would not say QR are a progressive metal band. I will have to say in my opinion, DT put prog metal on the map. After "Images and Words" was released the prog community (fans and bands) went completely off the wall, how can you really argue that? They are thee biggest reference point in prog metal..period. My personal feelings aside...DT have become the KISS of prog metal!

You're certainly welcome to that opinion. I wouldn't argue that DT have always been more progressive than QR. However, I always considered QR Prog Metal. And so long as they can be put in that genre, DT can't be said to dominate the genre, when in both band's prime, QR sold more records, sold more tickets, and wrote better music.

Zod

 

[Cheiron]

In my view, the only progmetal album they ever made was Operation: Mindcrime. But did people call this progmetal back then? Or Progressive hard rock (similar to say Rush)?

Dream Theater's Image and Words came out 2 years after Empire. So I think they are still difficult to compare.

 

[General Zod]

Dream Theater fans and Queensryche fans have been debating for years. As Shaye, Britt and Bryant can attest, we use to have these debates back on usenet. I view them both as Prog Metal. I view them both as important bands. I view Queensryche as superior. If someone disagrees on any of those three points, that's certainly their prerogative.

Zod

 

[VenomGA]

Dream Theater fans and Queensryche fans have been debating for years. As Shaye, Britt and Bryant can attest, we use to have these debates back on usenet. I view them both as Prog Metal. I view them both as important bands. I view Queensryche as superior. If someone disagrees on any of those three points, that's certainly their prerogative.

Zod

1] Both as prog metal. I think Queensryche ceased being prog metal years ago and has since been more of a hard rock band for the most part. Dream Theater has always been a prog metal band.

2] Both as important bands. Hell yes. Queensryche started the prog metal genre with Mindcrime and Dream Theater took over and perfected it.

3] Zod views Queensrcyhe as the superior band. He is entitled to his opinion as we all are. I personally think Dream Theater is far superior band has has been for the last 17 years, but that is my opinion.

 

[General Zod]

1] Both as prog metal. I think Queensryche ceased being prog metal years ago and has since been more of a hard rock band for the most part. Dream Theater has always been a prog metal band.

Agreed.

2] Both as important bands. Hell yes. Queensryche started the prog metal genre with Mindcrime and Dream Theater took over and perfected it.

One might even say it began with Rage.

3] Zod views Queensrcyhe as the superior band. He is entitled to his opinion as we all are. I personally think Dream Theater is far superior band has has been for the last 17 years, but that is my opinion.

Dream Theater has definitely been the superior band for the last 15 years. However, from what I've read, it seems there have been a lot of less than entralled Dream Theater fans since Scenes.

Zod

 

[Met-Al]

First off, thanks to Zod for the props on my previous post.

Second, I find this whole Dream Theater/Queensryche debate fun. As anybody who knows me will tell you, I think Dream Theater trums Queensryche on their worst day. Just seeing the two bands on tour together in 2003, one could see who was winning the crowd each night. As for each band's respective songwriting talents, it's hard to pick one over the other unless you pick things apart. After all, both bands may be considered progressive (be it at one point in their history or another), but they have completely different writing styles. If you like concise songs with really strong lyrics, then I would have to give the trophy to Queensryche circa 1983-1994. If you prefer that a song take you on a lengthy journey with lots of dynamics, Dream Theater is the way to go. Queensryche's songwriting has taken a major dump in the past twelve years, so Dream Theater wins in that department.

As for who kickstarted progressive metal, Fates Warning beat Queensryche to the punch with "The Spectre Within." Even by today's standards, that album is full of progressive goodness.


Stay metal. Never rust.
Albert

 

[Cheiron]

As for who kickstarted progressive metal, Fates Warning beat Queensryche to the punch with "The Spectre Within." Even by today's standards, that album is full of progressive goodness.


Stay metal. Never rust.
Albert

Then you might as well just say that early Iron Maiden was progressive-metal.

 

[Urban breed]

In my view, the only progmetal album they ever made was Operation: Mindcrime.

To my mind 'Rage for Order' is much more progmetal than 'Operation:Mindcrime'. In fact, I consider 'Operation:Mindcrime' to be (refined and tasteful) metal on a hardrock foundation.

(I know, I know, but quite frankly, I don't care about peoples misinformed definitions of various genres and subgenres. )

 

[Matt Crooks]

<snip>Just seeing the two bands on tour together in 2003, one could see who was winning the crowd each night. <snip>

Agreed! At the Baltimore show we got QR first. After their set 1/4 of the people left before DT even started.