Jehovah Loves You

[Russell]

Originally posted by Oyo
I wouldn't even JOKE about that kind of stuff, people get arrested for joking about it

When we went on holiday to America it turned out we were staying pretty close to Columbine my appearance didn't go down too well there

 

[Satori]

Originally posted by Jannet
Actually, this is incorrect. They believe that only 144,000 people from earth are going to heaven, and the rest are going to live on earth (everlasting life) in paradise after armageddon comes. And the rest are ONLY if God decides you're righteous enough to live on the planet. If not, once you die, you're dead, period. There is no Hades, since they believe Hades is death itself, the soul dies with the body, period.

I had heard of this as well so I guess it's just this particular sect of Jehovah's that think this.

I find it amusing how people think they can choose to interpret "god's word" any way they choose, heheh. Seems kinda self-defeating if you ask me

Satori

 

[Satori]

Originally posted by HoserHellspawn
As for the propaganda I had read, it seemed highly anti-intellectual, very much "God is right and god wants this so you better do it. Oh, and his name is Jehova".

Heheh, the one I read had quotes from einstein and newton and shit, loads of "evidence" supporting creationism, biology, cosmology (blacks holes were predicted in the bible! hhahhha), etc.

It's amazing how one spin-off of one religion could be so varied in its delivery and basic assertions (such as the number of "seats in heaven").

Satori

 

[Satori]

My mother in law's mother (my gramma-in-law I suppose) once got financially sodomized by a couple of young jehovahs (a guy and a girl around 18 years old). They would visit her and talk to her for hours and then hassel her to buy books and donate to their church. I think it's sad how they prey (pray perhaps?) on the old and frail of mind (she was like 70 or something). In all we suspect they fucked her for about 10-15 grand (which is like about 7-11 grand or something in US$). My mother in law was not pleased. Finally she had someone call her when they were visiting her mom again and she went over there and told them to leave and not to come back or else she get the cops on their asses for fraud or some thing, heheh.

My mother in law said like she felt that the young jehovahs actually felt they were doing a good thing by fucking her mother, they couldn't understand why she was so upset about the money and their visiting, etc. This is simply because they are brainwashed so completely that their sense of ethics and basic human descency is shrouded behind a thin veil of self-deception and self-oppression. To borrow a phrase from my good buddy JC: forgive them, they know not what they do.

heheheh

Satori

 

[Jannet]

Originally posted by Satori



Heheh, the one I read had quotes from einstein and newton and shit, loads of "evidence" supporting creationism, biology, cosmology (blacks holes were predicted in the bible! hhahhha), etc.

It's amazing how one spin-off of one religion could be so varied in its delivery and basic assertions (such as the number of "seats in heaven").

Satori

Yer talking about a blue book called "Creation or Evolution", but who cares what the book is called

 

[Jannet]

Originally posted by Satori
My mother in law's mother (my gramma-in-law I suppose) once got financially sodomized by a couple of young jehovahs (a guy and a girl around 18 years old). They would visit her and talk to her for hours and then hassel her to buy books and donate to their church. I think it's sad how they prey (pray perhaps?) on the old and frail of mind (she was like 70 or something). In all we suspect they fucked her for about 10-15 grand (which is like about 7-11 grand or something in US$). My mother in law was not pleased. Finally she had someone call her when they were visiting her mom again and she went over there and told them to leave and not to come back or else she get the cops on their asses for fraud or some thing, heheh.

My mother in law said like she felt that the young jehovahs actually felt they were doing a good thing by fucking her mother, they couldn't understand why she was so upset about the money and their visiting, etc. This is simply because they are brainwashed so completely that their sense of ethics and basic human descency is shrouded behind a thin veil of self-deception and self-oppression. To borrow a phrase from my good buddy JC: forgive them, they know not what they do.

heheheh

Satori

Yikes, I'm sorry that happened to your mother in law's mother. That's horrible and I hope she recovered. But in defense to the JW's, this is not what the JW's DO. Those were sick people (not saying JW's AREN'T sick, but ya know what I mean). Personally I think they were using a JW front to perform that atrocity. Speaking as an ex-JW (you couldn't tell? hehe), the people I was surrounded by were really great, overzealous perhaps, but they really tried to go exactly by what the bible said (go door to door as Jesus did, study the bible, etc.). I left the flock because I felt stifled by their endless rules and inflexibility, not to mention my lack of BELIEF of a true god almighty. But I see it like this: there are shit people in all religions (i.e., catholic school boy molestation comes to mind ).

 

[MetalManCPA]

I remember as a kid, these 2 young JW's coming by the house. At first, their main goal was to convert. But even after they realized it wouldn't work, they still came back for quite awhile just to chat (usually to my Mom).

In hindsight, my guess is they were still trying to "sway" my mother, but in a subliminal and indirect way. They stopped giving the handouts - and the chat was very general in nature. (I was 10 or so at the time)

 

[Jannet]

Did you know that JW's believe they will not be worthy of life on an earthly paradise if they DON'T preach? They are taught that every person you decide not to preach to is blood on your hands. LITERALLY. You are responsible for every life you could have saved by preaching. Scary shit, eh? That's why those 2 JW's never stopped entirely trying.

 

[JesusChristPose]

The Jehovah Witnesses believe just what Jannet stated.

Unlike traditional christianity, they believe that once a non-believer is cast into the lake of fire, their physical body burns and that is the second death. There are other christian denominations that believe this, but they too are considered to be a cult, like the Jehovahs.

One thing I will give those "cults" credit for...if one reads the bible without discrimination, a particular worldview, subjectiveness due to denominational upbringing, in other words, with an open mind, the bible does teach just that - but then how would all the mainstream denominations put fear into their prospective flocks?

It is much easier to imagine facing a final second death rather than an eternity of torture.

 

[Jannet]

However, if the non-believer never was preached to by a JW, they are innocent of all wrongdoing, since they were not aware of the "truth" so to speak. (This is JW thinking, btw). These people, if they died before armagaddon arrived, will receive a resurrection, and will be taught the ways of jehovah within the 1000 years that Satan is locked up away. Then Satan will be let loose to bug the hell of the poor people that just learned about Jehovah (totally unfair if you ask me - sadistic and selfish), and this will be the second judgement. The people that do not accept Jehovah after the resurrection will suffer the second death (this is the second death you were talking about, jesuschristpose), and once all the people are weeded out, Jehovah will end Satan's life, and everybody will live happily ever on a paradise on earth. The End. (and now we return to our regularly scheduled program..)

 

[JesusChristPose]

and there is another so-called christian "cult' that believes basially the same thing...The Worldwide Church of God.

They believe that there is actually 3 ressurections and that most of us "sinners" will be taught by born-again saints during that 1000 year period, where then most of those taught will accept Christ as their saviour...only the very few incorrigably wicked will suffer the second death in the lake of fire, as most will then believe.

But this strategy does not suit mainstream christianity well, because it takes away their belief that God is in some sort of "soul winning" contest with Satan, here and now, and that this is the only time that God is calling all of us.

 

[Jannet]

Not to mention the lack of a promise of a heavenly paradise with angelic wings and clear blue skies once you die. JW's and the church you spoke of are quite boring compared to this prospect! When I was JW, this was an argument I always encountered from non-JW's, "Well, I'm going to heaven, and why would we want to stay on this earth as paradise, when heaven is perfect and we can be with our Lord Jesus Christ sporting brand new angel wings?" Religious people naturally want something better than what is currently reality (actually, don't we all?). Since the bible is so damn contradictory when it comes to this sort of thing, people just grab and run with the "I'm going to heaven" bit, since it sounds so otherwordly, and otherwise, "Perfect." Who wants to live here, then die, then wake up HERE? Oh, I forget, the JW's...hehehe

 

[JesusChristPose]

Another controversial issue with regards to mainstream christianity's beliefs...

If God made each animal after its own kind then what kind did he make man after? To answer that, one must really pay attention to what God said in Genesis during this creative process. God said that he will make man after HIS likeness, so then it would be logical to say that God made man after the GOD KIND.

So when christians die what do they become? Angels? No. They become children of God. Their own bible says that Christ is the groom and the church is the bride, and then all of those born again are the children.

So when one is saved and becomes born into the God family they become GODS.

Mainstream christianity would have you thrown out of their flock if one believed that, but then I say, what will they become angels? Too funny, as Genesis never mentions that we were made after the ANGEL kind.

Angels were creatures long before man.

The Worldwide Church of God makes sense with this one. All of the planets in all of the universe were created for a specific purpose (and they quote the bible's statement that all of what God created will serve a purpose). And that after the 1000 year reign, all of those born again will create their own worlds utilizing the planets now in existence.

Make more sense than tradional christianity's belief that all saved will look up to Jesus praising his name with song and harp forever...what purpose would God get out of that? Why would a God want people to praise him for eternity? Sounds something like Satan would want out of his mininons lol.

 

[Jannet]

This got me thinking. If we take the bible at face value, think about Jesus Christ. He was in existence at the time of the making of the garden of eden, and before that, and he was a spiritual being in heaven. The Serpent in the garden was Satan, and before he took the form of a snake, he too was a spirit in heaven, same as Jesus Christ. There are many pictures that depict Jesus Christ with wings after his resurrection (not that this means much, but take it as face value), and we must also think, what about the dove which called forth in God's voice "this is my son....." when Jesus was baptised? The dove was a bird, with wings. I think this is a symbol of what God represented. Now, we can safely say that the angels themselves were God's children, since they didn't make themselves, but God made them in his image, and since it is claimed in the bible that God made all things. This Jesus was a physical man on earth, it is safe to say that the angels had this physical appearance also (think of the angel who appeared to Joseph, warning him of the doom the child faced if he stayed in Bethlehem, or the angel that appeared to the apostle paul). These were all in the shape of men (the bible states). So I would think, if we are to go by the bible, that if man was to die and go to heaven, they would also be angels, since they are God's children. Mmm..this is actually my logic (but bible logic, please understand, not my personal beliefs), not a JW logic.

 

[JesusChristPose]

I used to know the exact biblical location of what I am about to say, but I don't anymore...however I do know that the bible teaches that human kind is not of the same nature of the angel kind and that man was created only a "little lower than the angels" but will be greater in the future (I believe this is found in Hebrews). It would be like saying a dog could be a cat.

In fact, that is exactly why Satan rebelled against God, because he knew that God's plan for mankind was to potentially create a greater being than the angel.

God is not an angel. God said in Genesis, "let us (Elohim) create man after OUR image. The word "image" in hebrew means a likeness both in outside appearance internally - the mind.

God never called an angel his child, yet those saved are called his children.

 

[Jannet]

So who are the Elohim? Who is OUR? Jehovah and Jesus Christ? Jehovah and the Angels? But now you're getting into territory that I'm a bit unfamiliar with, since I stopped studying the bible long ago. The way I see it is that if God is the guy who claims "May no one worship any other God but me," and, "I am the one true God," why would the pitiful human beings be at the same level as him when they die and go to heaven? This would be VERY contradictory to God's selfish self-image, and since he would KILL people for worshipping stone/gold images of a fake god-like image, how would he feel about lowly humans converted to his peers? I remember this scripture in the bible that claims that God clothes the trees, birds, and why do we worry about such things, since he takes care of the lowliest of organisms on earth. With a comment like this, you'd think that there would be no suffering, disease, famine, etc. (one way the bible contradicts itself). Also, It's interesting that there are animals and foliage that last longer than any human being could ever dream of living today. There are trees that live hundreds of years!! Turtles live over 100 years, in addition to other animals. Basically my point is that since God is a selfish bastard who doesn't like sharing the glory with ANY THING, much less ANY ONE, it's hard to picture human beings as his Godly peers, especially since he treats them sub-par anyway (judging by the way of the world today - trees and turtles get better treatment than humans do..grrrr).

 

[JesusChristPose]

That is why I quit being a christian a long time ago...too much contradiction and confusion, that it just can't be true. A convulted hypocritical mess, indeed.

 

[Satori]

Holy crap, I don't think I've read so much pointless and ridiculous bullshit in a thread here in a long time. Thanks for pointing out this supreme idiocy, it was very entertaining. Boy do I feel sorry for the poor fucks who actually take this nonsense seriously, self-delusion and irrationality seems even less appealing than I remember. heheh

Satori

 

[Belial]

Originally posted by Satori
Holy crap, I don't think I've read so much pointless and ridiculous bullshit in a thread here in a long time. Thanks for pointing out this supreme idiocy, it was very entertaining. Boy do I feel sorry for the poor fucks who actually take this nonsense seriously, self-delusion and irrationality seems even less appealing than I remember. heheh

I know what you mean. The more I rea stuff like this, the more it amazes me that people actually believe this fairy tale is reality.

 

[Qsilver]

I think some of the south park episodes give some interesting thoughts about religions. Like the one episode in which people were drowning themselves in the pool of taj mahal or something.

And yes, I'm talking about that often so annoying but still a cartoon worth watching