Legalize All Drugs? Would It Work?

Should all drugs be legalized, regulated, and profited from?

  • No, keep that poison illegal

    Votes: 4 21.1%
  • Just legalize light stuff like weed

    Votes: 6 31.6%
  • Hell yeah, legalize it all, hedonism FTW

    Votes: 9 47.4%
  • Huh? .... What? .... Where?

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    19
Well you're not getting mine either because you keep phrasing it incorrectly.

I know you never said people should not take drugs "just because it's the right thing to do". My point is that a person's health is by far the most important reason you shouldn't do hard drugs. That reason alone should be enough to deter somebody from hard drug use, and if not, that person is probably not serious about being sober. No amount of external pressure is going to get somebody to quit if they don't have the desire within themselves to do it. I think you get confused with my posts sometimes because I tend to use a lot of hyperbole.

And just to be clear, I'd be fine with imprisoning hard drug dealers, but if a guy on the street had a little bit of a meth on him, I don't think he should get jail time, but he should be offered help.
 
And here we see more bountiful prude-mobile bullshit. What gives the government the right to decide which activities are "too addictive" for people to engage in? Where do you draw the line?

I've made it quite clear where I draw the line. Hard drugs like heroin.

What gives them the right is the fact that addiction does not only hurt yourself, it hurts your family and your community. Addicts will do anything to get more money to spend on drugs. Sometimes reprehensible things.

Both ethics and criminology tend to see an activity as "wrong" when it harms others (not oneself) in some way, and (for example) sitting in a chair or lying on a bed enjoying an acid trip (which, according to scientists who have studied it, is the closest thing an atheist can have to "religious experience") simply doesn't fit into those categories in any way, shape, or form.

Hard drugs do harm others. If you ever had someone close to you on hard drugs you would understand this fact. I'm not talking about acid. I've made it very clear I'm talking about heroin. You're the one that said "all drugs" not just acid.

And your argument of "people can overdose on anything" seems to contradict pretty much any logic your argument might have had going for it - you know people can die from drinking too much water, right? :tickled: http://www.cracked.com/article_16760_6-people-who-died-in-order-to-prove-retarded-point.html (number 2)

Straw man again. I never said "people can overdose on anything". I said people can overdose on purer cleaner versions of hard drugs.
 
5 Illegal Drugs With Surprisingly Wholesome Medical Uses:

#5. Cocaine Treats Wounds on Children
#4. LSD Can Cure Alcoholism
#3. Heroin Helps Women in Labor (Oh, and Heroin Addicts)
#2. MDMA (Ecstasy) Can Cure PTSD
#1. Methamphetamine Helps ADHD and Obesity

http://www.cracked.com/article_20023_5-illegal-drugs-with-surprisingly-wholesome-medical-uses.html

Medical usage is not the same as Legalization. This does not support your original statement.

Many drugs are illegal but still used for medical purposes. Morphine being one. Many prescription drugs as well.
 
5 Myths About Illegal Drugs You Probably Believe

#5. LSD Makes You Insane
#4. Natural Drugs Aren't as Bad for You
#3. PCP Turns Normal People Violent ... and Grants Superhuman Strength!
#2. "Crack Babies" Exist
#1. The War on Drugs Lowered Drug Use Rates

http://www.cracked.com/article_20561_5-myths-about-illegal-drugs-you-probably-believe.html

I never said any of those things.

Do you get all of your information from cracked.com?

You love tearing down straw men here
 
Good night, sleep tight, and fuck off with all your prudish illogical bullshit about banning random chemicals:

http://www.urban75.com/Drugs/drugten.html

10 Reasons to legalise all drugs

1 Address the real issues

For too long policy makers have used prohibition as a smoke screen to avoid addressing the social and economic factors that lead people to use drugs. Most illegal and legal drug use is recreational. Poverty and despair are at the root of most problematic drug use and it is only by addressing these underlying causes that we can hope to significantly decrease the number of problematic users.

2 Eliminate the criminal market place

The market for drugs is demand-led and millions of people demand illegal drugs. Making the production, supply and use of some drugs illegal creates a vacuum into which organised crime moves. The profits are worth billions of pounds. Legalisation forces organised crime from the drugs trade, starves them of income and enables us to regulate and control the market (i.e. prescription, licensing, laws on sales to minors, advertising regulations etc.)

3 Massively reduce crime

The price of illegal drugs is determined by a demand-led, unregulated market. Using illegal drugs is very expensive. This means that some dependent users resort to stealing to raise funds (accounting for 50% of UK property crime - estimated at £2 billion a year). Most of the violence associated with illegal drug dealing is caused by its illegality

Legalisation would enable us to regulate the market, determine a much lower price and remove users need to raise funds through crime. Our legal system would be freed up and our prison population dramatically reduced, saving billions. Because of the low price, cigarette smokers do not have to steal to support their habits. There is also no violence associated with the legal tobacco market.

4 Drug users are a majority


Recent research shows that nearly half of all 15-16 year olds have used an illegal drug. Up to one and a half million people use ecstasy every weekend. Amongst young people, illegal drug use is seen as normal. Intensifying the 'war on drugs' is not reducing demand. In Holland, where cannabis laws are far less harsh, drug usage is amongst the lowest in Europe.

Legalisation accepts that drug use is normal and that it is a social issue, not a criminal justice one. How we deal with it is up to all of us to decide.

In 1970 there were 9000 convictions or cautions for drug offences and 15% of young people had used an illegal drug. In 1995 the figures were 94 000 and 45%. Prohibition doesn't work.

5 Provide access to truthful information and education
A wealth of disinformation about drugs and drug use is given to us by ignorant and prejudiced policy-makers and media who peddle myths upon lies for their own ends. This creates many of the risks and dangers associated with drug use.

Legalisation would help us to disseminate open, honest and truthful information to users and non-users to help them to make decisions about whether and how to use. We could begin research again on presently illicit drugs to discover all their uses and effects - both positive and negative.

6 Make all drug use safer

Prohibition has led to the stigmatisation and marginalisation of drug users. Countries that operate ultra-prohibitionist policies have very high rates of HIV infection amongst injecting users. Hepatitis C rates amongst users in the UK are increasing substantially.

In the UK in the '80's clean needles for injecting users and safer sex education for young people were made available in response to fears of HIV. Harm reduction policies are in direct opposition to prohibitionist laws.

7 Restore our rights and responsibilities

Prohibition unnecessarily criminalises millions of otherwise law-abiding people. It removes the responsibility for distribution of drugs from policy makers and hands it over to unregulated, sometimes violent dealers.

Legalisation restores our right to use drugs responsibly to change the way we think and feel. It enables controls and regulations to be put in place to protect the vulnerable.

8 Race and Drugs


Black people are over ten times more likely to be imprisoned for drug offences than whites. Arrests for drug offences are notoriously discretionary allowing enforcement to easily target a particular ethnic group. Prohibition has fostered this stereotyping of black people.

Legalisation removes a whole set of laws that are used to disproportionately bring black people into contact with the criminal justice system. It would help to redress the over representation of black drug offenders in prison.

9 Global Implications

The illegal drugs market makes up 8% of all world trade (around £300 billion a year). Whole countries are run under the corrupting influence of drug cartels. Prohibition also enables developed countries to wield vast political power over producer nations under the auspices of drug control programmes.

Legalisation returns lost revenue to the legitimate taxed economy and removes some of the high-level corruption. It also removes a tool of political interference by foreign countries against producer nations.

10 Prohibition doesn't work

There is no evidence to show that prohibition is succeeding. The question we must ask ourselves is, "What are the benefits of criminalising any drug?" If, after examining all the available evidence, we find that the costs outweigh the benefits, then we must seek an alternative policy.

Legalisation is not a cure-all but it does allow us to address many of the problems associated with drug use, and those created by prohibition. The time has come for an effective and pragmatic drug policy.

"If the (drug) problem continues advancing as it is at the moment, we're going to be faced with some very frightening options. Either you have a massive reduction in civil rights or you have to look at some radical solutions. The issue has to be, can a criminal justice system solve this particular problem?"
Commander John Grieve, Criminal Intelligence Unit, Scotland Yard, Channel 4 1997
 
1 Address the real issues

This is fallacious. We can address the "real issues" and the drug issues at the same time.

2 Eliminate the criminal market place

There will still be a criminal market place for other things like weapons, hit men, prostitution, etc.

3 Massively reduce crime

This is the stupidest "argument" in favor of legalization. Yeah crime will be reduced if you make illegal things legal, duh. If we legalized theft and murder crime would be reduced also, because those no longer would be crimes.

4 Drug users are a majority

"Nearly half" or "45%" is not a majority. Also this argument is fallacious. Just because a majority does something doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.

5 Provide access to truthful information and education

We can provide access to truthful information (and it's already out there) while still keeping drugs illegal.

6 Make all drug use safer

You supported this claim by mentioning higher HIV rates among users. There will still be no cure for HIV if drugs were legal. How will drugs being legal stop users from spreading HIV by sharing needles? Answer: It won't.

7 Restore our rights and responsibilities

This is the one point where I actually somewhat agree. We should have a right to grow and cook our own plants of any kind for medicinal uses. I think selling or giving hard drugs to others should be illegal though.

8 Race and Drugs

The race issue goes far beyond drugs. Making drugs legal wouldn't change people's perceptions of other races.

9 Global Implications

There are too many factors at play to know the global implications of legalizing drugs. Any comment on future events globally in this "what if?" scenario is purely speculation.

10 Prohibition doesn't work

On a personal level, it certainly does. I'd like to try several drugs, but I can't find them. So prohibition has stopped me from using those drugs. If they were legal, I could go find and buy them easily. That'd probably not be to my benefit though.

Beyond that, Sweden is an excellent example. Drug use is just a third of the European average while spending on drug control is three times the EU average.
 
1 . I'd like to try several drugs, but I can't find them. So prohibition has stopped me from using those drugs. If they were legal, I could go find and buy them easily. That'd probably not be to my benefit though.

A strongly doubtful and generally stupid assumption:

http://www.psychedelic-library.org/relmenu.htm

http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/lsd/pahnke3.htm

http://deoxy.org/w_psyrel.htm

http://www.lsdexperience.com/part-2/experience-preceded-by/

Also, somewhat related, isn't it time now for your afternoon nap after your specifically-selected low-sodium crackers and decaffeinated tea? :tickled::tickled::tickled::tickled:
 
Meth might help with ADHD but it also destroys your body in the process lol, not the best argument there.
 
If you're not going to try and debate, and instead resort to ad hominem attacks I see no point in continuing this discussion. I've responded to all 10 of your points (which you likely copy pasted from someone else), and you respond to just half of one of my points with a personal attack. Mods?
 
If you're not going to try and debate, and instead resort to ad hominem attacks I see no point in continuing this discussion. I've responded to all 10 of your points (which you likely copy pasted from someone else), and you respond to just half of one of my points with a personal attack. Mods?

I responded with four links related to the topic which you didn't even bother to read or respond to - a truly brutal personal affront that the mods definitely do need to respond to :tickled::tickled::tickled::Spin::Spin::Spin:

If you can't handle the heat, get outta the kitchen - or just whine to the mods about your displaced inefficiency :tickled::Spin::tickled::Spin::tickled: :fu:
 
Yeah because a person just says "hey i'm going to try heroin today" because they're stupid and deserve to die. Nope. They fall in with the wrong crowd. They're depressed. They lose a job and have to move in with druggie friends. They're in an abusive relationship. There are countless different reasons people turn to drugs and very few of them have anything to do with the quality of their genetics. Once rehabilitated many can function as normal human beings who do Not deserve to die.


This is going to be a retarded attempt from my young mind but wouldn't this signify that the person was weak of mind? Its sad for anyone to fall into drugs whether its because of depression or financial issues but if they're falling into drug use, its there responsibility to go find help BEFORE all this happens. So its their fault.

Do you follow me?
 
it's their fault but people are fucking stupid so sometimes it's better to limit their choices.

i initially was pro-legalize-everything but now im kind of leaning towards legalizing just the light stuff.

because if more dumbasses are gonna OD and the good ol USA is gonna be forced to take care of them that could lead to more health insurance cost out of MY pocket.

so basically i wish i was pro-legalize-everything but only if we let them die for ODing. but otherwise yea just keep the deadly shit illegal i have no interest in them anyways
 
There's just no way you can convince someone like me that legalization of all drugs will make things better.

This sums up the response of those that are against decriminalization/legalization pretty succinctly.

It's like arguing with creationists. Facts be damned. Only anecdotes are real.
 
Legalize a lot of things that are less harmful, and shift the focus from criminalization to recovery while still keeping things like meth and heroin technically illegal.

I think that this approach, combined with the ending of the drug war/SWATing people who are using meth etc would go a long way towards fixing the situation. Destroy the incentive for massive drug production.
 
This sums up the response of those that are against decriminalization/legalization pretty succinctly.

It's like arguing with creationists. Facts be damned. Only anecdotes are real.

Umm, no. To the contrary, I've pointed out multiple fallacies in the pro legalization arguments. Most if not all of my counter points have been logically valid.
 
Umm, no. To the contrary, I've pointed out multiple fallacies in the pro legalization arguments. Most if not all of my counter points have been logically valid.

I don't really see any new arguments in reviewing the thread. There is a ton of overlap with the gun debates, and the "wild west" scenarios never come to pass, and I don't think everyone is going to be lying in the street from meth usage.

"The ban didn't work, that's why we need it!" seems to be the synthesis of your arguments.
 
Where do you live again brah? I'm guessing not on this planet.

When AZ changed their gun laws several years ago to allow people to carry into places that served alcohol, there were all these "concerned citizens" and op-eds about how there would be blood flowing into the streets from an apocalyptic nightmare of booze fueled showdowns at Applebees and Chilis across the state. Of course, it didn't happen.