Listening to Blackwater Park for the first time in awhile...

[Metaltastic]

And HOLY GOD, I never noticed the hilarious amount of autotuning on Mike's clean vocals (specifically in "The Leper Affinity"). Talk about warble-city, Nordstrom could've been a bit more discrete with that methinks Also, the incredible lack of saturation in the guitar tone (and yet its annoying denseness) still pisses me off, and it was very revealing to see Exocaster describe what he had heard about the guitar tracking (in this thread):

Blackwater Park, IIRC, is a lot of layers of fairly low-gain tracks. I remember Mikael saying something to the effect of "playing heavy metal with a Jeff Beck tone" but liking the sound when the tracks were combined.

Still a great album musically, but not without its production inconsistencies IMO!

 

[Ermz]

Wasn't Blackwater Park engineered entirely by Steven Wilson?

 

[LydonB]

Wasn't Blackwater Park engineered entirely by Steven Wilson?

That is what I thought.

 

[KeithTidd]

any specific parts where it's noticeable?

 

[Exocaster]

IIRC, that was from an interview in Guitar World right around the time Deliverance came out, if anyone wants to find the exact quote.

I can only imagine how un-saturated the actual tone they recorded with is, because the palm mutes don't sound "right" at all, and no amount of layering is going to change how the amp actually reacts. While I'm partial to less saturated tones in general, I don't think Mikael's "Jeff Beck tone" description could be too far from the mark there! I do like the thickness of the guitars as a whole, but a chunkier tone would have been more appropriate for that style.

I'll have to go back and listen for the Autotune thing...

The booklet for my copy of BWP says "Engineered by Opeth, Steven Wilson and Fredrik Nordstrom".

 

[Metaltastic]

Ok, so maybe it was Steven Wilson - moot point people, my sentiments still stand I didn't realize he was working with them at that point, I thought Damnation was their first co-venture. And Keith, I'm talking the entire clean vocal part ("Lost are days of spring, you sighed..." etc.), especially the held notes; maybe that warblyness isn't autotune, but it's annoying and unnatural sounding to me! And yeah, it's on the palm mutes that the oppressive wimpiness of the tone (once again a good example being in "Leper Affinity," that awesome riff at 2:14)

 

[Metaltastic]

And listening again, when the harmony clean vocals come in, it gets even worse, because the warblyness on the two parts are oscillating at different frequencies, AIIEEEE!! Also, in the first part (before the "AM radio" effect in the left channel), the words "sighed" and "let" are the worst offenders.

 

[Kazrog]

I think it sounds fucking great.

 

[Splat88]

^^^^
+1

I love the guitar tone on Blackwater Park. When I first bought Deliverance and put it in my CD player, I was extremely disappointed in the sound by comparison.

I've listened to Blackwater Park in full probably over 100 times and I haven't noticed any auto-tuning problems. I hope I won't notice them because if I do, it will bug me forever. A long time ago someone on this forum brought to my attention a horribly triggered snare fill on Fear Factory's "Replica" from Demanufacture. I never noticed that snare fill before and now I can't bear to listen to it. Bummer.

 

[Ermz]

I think since Opeth's music at that point didn't tend to rely on 'chug chug' the wimpy tone doesn't matter so much. What recording all those layers *did* do was improve the density and textural complexity of the tone, so it just sounds FULL and RICH when chords or notes are ringing out. In its own way that is what creates the distinctive wall of sound on that album. Good thing too because the drum sound sucks!

My main qualms with the album were pumping. ear fatigue on some systems because the guitars are too strong in a particular mid region & the not-so-strong drum sound.

 

[Morgan C]

@Metaltastic
I have a live version of Leper Affinity and that bit sounds exactly the same as the album. Its a bootleg, so no autotuning. I think thats just Mikael's voice.

I love the sound of BWP, guitars are great, bass is fat and loud and works really well with the lots-of-guitar-at-low-gain tone. I actually love the drum sound too, especially the snare. I wouldn't change a thing about the production, or the songs.


edit: on a side note.. how do you pronounce Mikael Akerfeldt? I'm Aussie so these names are all but jibberish to me XD.

 

[wishtheend]

I hear no auto-tune issues with this album whatsoever. The clean vocals on this album have a good amount of verb and delay (of which I think is set to a static ms rather than a project bpm). What I think you are hearing is just the result of multiple takes that are just slightly different from one another delaying/verbing against each other.

I think it's obvious to hear it's not autotune because on some of his small scale runs you can hear how he'll still sometimes slide into the note he's singing instead of hitting it dead on. With the exception of some strong compression, I think the vocals sound great.

 

[J the TyranT]

I think the tone fucking rules, actually... always have

 

[Splat88]

Good thing too because the drum sound sucks!

I love the drums on that album!

 

[KeithTidd]

i don't think that's auto tune you're hearing. I know steven wilson has said he uses auto tune and he did say he was gonna tune the harmonies on the lamentations dvd, but i think that's influencing what you're hearing. There may be alittle tuning going on but it's not flagrant, mikael is a G and sounds totally natural. The slight warble is the vibrato in his singing.

regardless, still my favorite album.

 

[pifos_2]

And listening again, when the harmony clean vocals come in, it gets even worse, because the warblyness on the two parts are oscillating at different frequencies, AIIEEEE!! Also, in the first part (before the "AM radio" effect in the left channel), the words "sighed" and "let" are the worst offenders.

I don't think it is autotuned. you can really hear at 02:24, at "day", that it is humanly not perfectly perfect picthed. also on "remedy my confusion". it reflects his singing abilities back then and its very natural to me.

it can sound a little odd sometimes but it's a 2001 album.

its a legendary record to me. I dont really care for the other Opeth albums (except maybe Ghost Reveries). This one is gold.

EDIT : Ok "you sighted" is very bizarre....

 

[Fifth_Horseman]

I think BWP is the best sounding Opeth album before Jens Bogren came into the picture, except maybe for Damnation (but we can't compare distorted rhythm guitar sounds with that one).
I'm also not a fan of the guitar tone on Deliverance, I think that production didn't fit Opeth. I'll take the warm atmospheric wall of sound over that one any day.

 

[drew_drummer]

I like the production on that album, I like how the guitar isn't the "focus" if that makes sense.

 

[Meisterjäger]

edit: on a side note.. how do you pronounce Mikael Akerfeldt? I'm Aussie so these names are all but jibberish to me XD.

My-kul (regular) Ack-Er-Felt

 

[egan.]

I think it sounds fucking great.

+2