little off topic but has anyone seen The Two Towers yet?

[Yngvai X]

Originally posted by Tyrion
I've just seen the movie and I have to admit I'm not that enthusiastic as anyone else seems to be here... I have to say I'm a huge fan of the books, and for me it just wasnt close enough to the story in the book. Tolkien wrote a tremendous story, why does Jackson have to change it on so many occasions??

I especially disliked the melodramatic hollywood touch Jackson added to the whole plot (the scene with the village and the two fleeing children and their reunion with their mother, close-ups of crying children and women all the time at helms deep, the dream sequences with Arwen). A lot of his new scenes add to that point as well, for example the warg battle with Aragorn's fall and his glorious return, the Osgiliath scene (why the heck did Faramir let Frodo go all of a sudden?? This wasnt logical at all) or the part when the eleves joined the humans at helms deep. I also extremely disliked how Jackson presented the Ents (not visually but how he showed their character). In the book Ents are the oldest beings alive and extremely wise and farsighted. They need a lot of time to take their decisions and never act light heartedly. In the movie they look like stupid tree trunks who change their mind without even thinking about the outcome. Why should Treebeard not know about the damaged wood at Orthanc and just change his mind (and obviously all the other Ents with him as well after he just gave a shout to them...) becuase the Hobbits lead him there??? That's just nonsense imo.

Well, enough of the complaints. I really LIKED the development of Frodo's personality. I also liked Gollum, especially his discussions with his "alter ego". The battle scenes are just fantastic, both the battle at helms deep and orthanc.

I guess if you go to that movie without knowing the book you will be absolutely fascinated. If you like the book and know every passage by heart more or less you might be a bit disappointed like I was. I'm sure I'll like the film much better when I see it the 2nd time cause I wont concentrate that much anymore on the "mistakes" in the plot. I already had that with the first movie...

I know plenty of book enthusiasts who love the movies. Its not a point of liking the book before going to see the movie, its a point of going into the movie and not expecting a literal adaption of the book, but an *interpretation* of the story. It seems to me the diehards that nitpick about little things like fucking Elves being at the Helms Deep battle almost go into the movie expecting to be dissapointed. Nothing Peter Jackson changed impeded the flow of the original story at all. I'll have you know that the other producers were telling Jackson NOT to include the Ents because they felt it would be too difficult to pull off!!! But because PJ wanted to stay true to the novels and that he knew he'd never hear the end of it, he included the Ents, and IMO, he did an absolutely fantastic job with them. Treebeard is one of my favorite charaters in the entire trilogy and I was wondering how they'd portray him, and I think they just really hit the nail on the head. I don't think the Ents acted at all out of character by deciding to attack Isengard almost immediately after seeing the damage done to the forests. If anything, that accentuates the severety of his act against the forests - if the Ents usually take a long time and think out every possible action before they are sure it is the correct choice, then Saruman must have REALLY done something to piss them off to warrant such a quick reaction. Its similar in the books too, PJ only changed it around a bit to make it more dramatic. Actually, the changes he made only added to the drama and the tension, it did nothing to take away from it.

So I can only say to just approach the films with an open mind and enjoy it as a movie, not as "this-better-be-a-word-for-word-adaption-or-I-will-hate-it".

 

[ProgMetalFan]

I hated the dream sequences with Arwen... the portrayal of Faramir... and I thought the voices of Gollum and Treebeard were too difficult to understand. It took a lot of effort on my part to try and understand just half of what they were saying in those heavily processed voices.

 

[fustiar]

Originally posted by theodyssey
anyway, @stardust2112, i know the movie ends exactly as the book does in FoTR.

actually the end of FOTR [movie] is the start of TTT [book].

and the end of TTT [movie] is missing the end of TTT [book].

the start of RotK [movie] will have the end of TTT [book].

geez, TTT seems to have the most important parts in it =p

 

[The Yngster]

Originally posted by Yngvai X
I know plenty of book enthusiasts who love the movies. Its not a point of liking the book before going to see the movie, its a point of going into the movie and not expecting a literal adaption of the book, but an *interpretation* of the story. It seems to me the diehards that nitpick about little things like fucking Elves being at the Helms Deep battle almost go into the movie expecting to be dissapointed. Nothing Peter Jackson changed impeded the flow of the original story at all. I'll have you know that the other producers were telling Jackson NOT to include the Ents because they felt it would be too difficult to pull off!!! But because PJ wanted to stay true to the novels and that he knew he'd never hear the end of it, he included the Ents, and IMO, he did an absolutely fantastic job with them. Treebeard is one of my favorite charaters in the entire trilogy and I was wondering how they'd portray him, and I think they just really hit the nail on the head. I don't think the Ents acted at all out of character by deciding to attack Isengard almost immediately after seeing the damage done to the forests. If anything, that accentuates the severety of his act against the forests - if the Ents usually take a long time and think out every possible action before they are sure it is the correct choice, then Saruman must have REALLY done something to piss them off to warrant such a quick reaction. Its similar in the books too, PJ only changed it around a bit to make it more dramatic. Actually, the changes he made only added to the drama and the tension, it did nothing to take away from it.

So I can only say to just approach the films with an open mind and enjoy it as a movie, not as "this-better-be-a-word-for-word-adaption-or-I-will-hate-it".

I agree with 100% of what you said.

 

[Kliffoth]

I *just* got back from the movie and I'm greatly disappointed. It's like Peter Jackson rewrote the script FOR NO GOOD REASON! I'm a stickler for book to movie translations, I usually hate them. FOTR I could understand the changes in, and I found myself loving it in spite of myself...but TTT. It would take me all night to list the faults with this film. But here are a few of the more glaring ones...

1. Faramir is a PRICK!
2. The Ents have nothing to do with Helms Deep.
3. Key scenes involving Eomer were removed.
4. Gimli is nothing but comic relief.
5. Helms deep is a pansy little fortress in the film.
6. The Elves magically come to the Eorlingas' aid.
7. Needless 'Aragorn fell off a cliff' crap.
8. Needless 'Aragorn and Arwen' crap.
9. (Before this turns into an essay) Half of the film was BORING! I kept hoping for it to end!

I DO like.
1. Gandalf vs. Balrog scene (Incredible!)
...
...
um...
2. the scenery was pretty...
um...
3. Treebeard looks cool...

Thats about it... God how depressing!!!

 

[Tyrion]

Originally posted by Yngvai X
It seems to me the diehards that nitpick about little things like fucking Elves being at the Helms Deep battle almost go into the movie expecting to be dissapointed.

I didnt mind at all that the elves came to help the humans at Helms Deep, I just disliked the fact that PJ had to add "artificial" dramatic aspects to almost every single scene . I think the story in the book is already dramatic enough, it was just too much for my taste in the movie. The first movie didnt have that "darmatic overload", there was also time for the progression of the characters and their reletionships to each other. I really missed that in TTT, sometimes it almost reminded me of "just another pathetic hollywood movie"...

Treebeard is one of my favorite charaters in the entire trilogy and I was wondering how they'd portray him, and I think they just really hit the nail on the head. I don't think the Ents acted at all out of character by deciding to attack Isengard almost immediately after seeing the damage done to the forests. If anything, that accentuates the severety of his act against the forests - if the Ents usually take a long time and think out every possible action before they are sure it is the correct choice, then Saruman must have REALLY done something to piss them off to warrant such a quick reaction.

Treabeard, oldest creature on earth, master of Fangorn and friend of every tree in the forest just didnt notice someone was destroying his forest right before his nose?? Well, that somehow just doesnt match my imagination of Treebeard. He's also babbling stupid stuff all the time like a retard, it's rather a comical than a wise figure in the movie imo.

Its similar in the books too, PJ only changed it around a bit to make it more dramatic.

Actually, the changes he made only added to the drama and the tension

I completely agree, and that was just the thing I didnt like about it... Because he spent so much time to add more drama and tension he neglected the characterization of the main characters like Treebeard, Eomer or Theoden. Some parts of the storyline also suffered because of that.

If you read my comments you might think I really hated the movie, but thats not the case at all. I liked it, but I think it could have been much better. I'm already impatiantlly waiting for the extended version, maybe I'll then get the more detailed characterizations I would like so much...

 

[fustiar]

The same thing was said with FOTR when it was initially released... blahblah PJ changed the script, Bilbo isn't Frodo's uncle, why is Glorfindel not there... Why is the crack in the Gates of Moria visible, wtf is with Arwen, why does Elrond not look elvish...

After a few months the hubbub will settle down and you guys will come to your senses!

And for complaining about things being left out, come on. That's stupid. You DO know that the extended cut will likely include a whole bunch of scenes relevent to character development and plot? They just decided to include the war scenes because that's what excite people!

If there wasn't any war and fighting in LOTR would it still be as cool?

 

[Yngvai X]

Originally posted by Tyrion


I completely agree, and that was just the thing I didnt like about it... Because he spent so much time to add more drama and tension he neglected the characterization of the main characters like Treebeard, Eomer or Theoden. Some parts of the storyline also suffered because of that.

If you read my comments you might think I really hated the movie, but thats not the case at all. I liked it, but I think it could have been much better. I'm already impatiantlly waiting for the extended version, maybe I'll then get the more detailed characterizations I would like so much...

Funny though, because he portrayed Treebeard *exactly* how I envisioned him in my head in terms of character. Visually, it was a little different, I kinda thought he'd have stumpy-er legs as opposed to really long ones. But it just goes to show how two different people can get two different impressions from the same book .

 

[Tyrion]

Originally posted by Yngvai X
I kinda thought he'd have stumpy-er legs as opposed to really long ones.

Yep, so did I... I thought they would be more root-like, like the really fat roots of old trees that show up on the ground beside the trunk. It looked kinda funny though when they opposed the flood leaning against the stream with their long legs... That would have been difficult with stumpy legs

But it just goes to show how two different people can get two different impressions from the same book .

That will always be the difficulty with movie adaptions of books. Every reader has other pictures in his mind, so everyone will be disappointed with some aspects cause they dont match their imagination. I've found quite a few scenes in both LotR movies that exactly matched my imaginations though. The mines of Moria in TFOFT for example, or Gandalf's fight with the Balrog. I really wonder how Shelob will look like...