Satyricon Update

[Crimson Velvet]

Yes, but a medieval theme can also be incorporated MUSICALLY, as on Dark Medieval Times.

Strapping some flute over standard black metal doesn't make it any less standard.

I'm sorry, Zeph, but though flutes on DMT certainly is incorporated, they aren't integrated. Had he incorporated joik over the exact same black metal riffs, people would have called it "Sami black metal". The black metal part is simply not innovative, no matter how much you want it to be. Just enjoy the album for waht it is: A solid, early black metal album with a lot of heart and intent, but somewhat lacking in vision, which, in its own way, adds some charm on top of it. "The Shadowthrone" is better anyways...

The first band to properly integrate medieval themes into black metal in a fundemental fashion, successfully, is, in my opinion, Summoning.

 

[Zephyrus]

It goes much deeper than the flute parts. It's in the guitar melodies, especially the acoustic sections. Tell me that middle riff in "Dark Medieval Times" doesn't sound like a pipe organist pounding some chords.

I will agree that Summoning took the concept to a new level, made more obvious as they differ in instrumental focus. Satyricon, as traditional Black Metal, put it into the riffs, which makes it less obvious.

 

[Hubster]

LOL, I hope this is sarcastic, what Satyricon ever done that was "never been done before" ? They're a generic band that became popular because they made a split with Enslaved, who made a split with Emperor.

Best post of this thread. To hell with this band, they sucked from the very beginning and are worthless imo.

 

[Hubster]

Yeah, it's traditional medieval folk music. Someone earlier said that medieval music wasn't folk music, so I asked why. Medieval music still isn't a genre of music.

It isn't folk music, and actually, it is a sub-genre of Western Art music. To be more accurate, "medieval music" from a Western Art Music perspective, refers to a period before Renaissance and has little in common to the popular perception of "folk music" of the period.

Sorry if the above comes across harsh, it isn't meant to... just my personal frustration with the perception of Early Music in general society, as what people think it is is horribly incorrect... for example in the film Elizabeth, the music in court is historically inaccurate. The music played in that court would not have existed for another 300 or so years.

Anyway - I'm derailing here. Apologies...

 

[Crimson Velvet]

Without having listened to it for quite a while, I can say with a fair degree of certainty that the riffs on DMT mostly vary between Emperor-esque riffs and good ol' Celtic Frost-esque riffs. Where you hear "medieval melodies" is quite beyond me. I won't deny that they have some interesting takes on surface melodies, but that doesn't change the fact that the arrangements are still quite standard.

 

[Zephyrus]

I think we've gotten down to nitpicking here. The bottom line is that many bands claim inspiration from Satyricon's popularized medievalism, whether it existed in the music or not.

 

[Crimson Velvet]

Yeah, alright, I can agree with that.

 

[waif]

Best post of this thread. To hell with this band, they sucked from the very beginning and are worthless imo.

then gtfo.
srsly.

 

[Hubster]

Oh please. I'm not the only one expressing a non-agreeance in this thread.

 

[tagradh]

Haven't read any of the thread but... are they still making the black/rock stuff or...?

 

[Hubster]

Pretty much. I find every release they simply get waaay more accessible. I don't find they have much feeling at all these days, but then again I'm totally biased considering I've never been a fan to begin with...

 

[Zephyrus]

Yeah, because accessibility automatically equals less quality.

 

[V.V.V.V.V.]

it's fucking hubster...what do you want? actual reasoning?

 

[Hubster]

^ Oh shut up & give it a rest V5, I'm not trying to start a fight here for gods sake. I am capable of non-argumentative posting you know.

Yeah, because accessibility automatically equals less quality.

In the case of Satyricon, accessibility does equal less quality imo, not that they ever had much to start with anyway. I know you love them Zeph, and that's cool man. It's just with Satyricon, of all bands of the second wave, I just find them a real non-entity, they're just really bland to me.

 

[Crimson Velvet]

it's fucking hubster...what do you want? actual reasoning?

Funny how Hubster can't say that in this thread, yet you say this...

"Nile is pretty much average semi-brutal death that does not deserve the fame they get...but they probably get it because they're gimmicky, sterile and plain-out easy to digest."

...in the Death Metal thread. What's the difference, exactly?

Besides, accessibility does equal less feeling. Whenever there is even some commercial sensibility behind the song-writing process, there will be some compromise in the artist's vision. That is unavoidable. There is no way that a band's vision just happens to coincide with the most vapid, commercial, hook-ladden black metal there is. Especially considering the band's early material, which, albeit not revolutionary, was still quality fucking black metal.

 

[tagradh]

Hah, I just downloaded the new album. The only other one I have heard is Dark Medieval Times. Even if I wasn't to compare the new one to that, it's complete crap.

 

[Hubster]

 

[Zephyrus]

Besides, accessibility does equal less feeling. Whenever there is even some commercial sensibility behind the song-writing process, there will be some compromise in the artist's vision. That is unavoidable. There is no way that a band's vision just happens to coincide with the most vapid, commercial, hook-ladden black metal there is. Especially considering the band's early material, which, albeit not revolutionary, was still quality fucking black metal.

You're making the assumption that Satyricon considered marketability when developing their new sound. You don't know that. It's perfectly plausible that they were influenced by Rock music and it became their artistic vision to synthesize it with the Black Metal they've been playing. Just because Rock music tends to be more accessible, which will cause Black n' Roll to be more accessible than Black Metal, doesn't mean it's geared toward marketability. Commercial appeal is an unintended consequence of introducing Rock influences.

Cite an official interview with Satyr or Frost if you think it lends credence to their commercial intentions.

 

[skeptik]

They were obviously looking for a wider audience when they agreed to license out their releases instead of continuing to have it available only through their own label.

Look, the point of what everybody is saying was that Satyricon didn't do anything groundbreaking or revolutionary. That doesn't mean that they didn't create some great albums.

 

[Hubster]

Look, the point of what everybody is saying was that Satyricon didn't do anything groundbreaking or revolutionary.

Can't disagree with that