so i fucking suck at snare micing help me out, clips

[Metaltastic]

Can't listen now cuz I'm in a hotel with my lappy, but my experience has been that hi-end in snares comes far more from the overheads! (though I've never had a chance to try a bottom mic on snare). Also, though, bear in mind the effect of mic positioning is lessened the farther away from the source you are, so try raising the mic a bit (also it'd help with proximity effect, which by virtue of increasing lows can further obscure highs)

 

[KeithRT99]

pull that snare mic back for starters. Then take the tape off all the drums, that's the wrong way to tape drums if you want to eliminate ring. Tuning the snare properly is the foundation of a good drum sound. It's ok if it rings alittle, just make sure it rings in key, and it's not annoying amounts.

take a peice of tape and fold it so it looks like _/\_ , then press the peak part together: it will look kinda like _l_
Place this on the snare batter. This is the best way to kill ring with tape. It works in the same fashion as a heat diffuser, like you see on graphics cards and stuff.

Also, alot of the high end From the snare comes from overheads and room mics, as well as bottom snare/shell mics and bleed from all the other mics. It's really hard to get a snare to sound like how we hear snares in the uber polished productions of today with just a snare top mic and some processing.

 

[Morgan C]

take a peice of tape and fold it so it looks like _/_ , then press the peak part together: it will look kinda like _l_
Place this on the snare batter. This is the best way to kill ring with tape. It works in the same fashion as a heat diffuser, like you see on graphics cards and stuff.

I believe the tab on the top is so that you can take it off. It doesn't actually affect the sound any more than a piece of tape stuck straight on would.



As for back on-topic.. it sounds really ringy and shit for being completely taped up. The number one thing is tuning.. I'm finally learning how to tune properly and now my toms are sounding better with 2 year old skins than they were when I first got the heads.

It looks like a decent snare. Put an ORing on it (for muffling) while you're tuning, it gets rid of the overtones and helps you focus on the tonic (which you should be used to hearing after mixing for so long). Get the tonic the same on all parts, then take the ORing off, put a TINY bit of muffling on and it should be all you need. I've quickly learnt that too much muffling kills the highend FAST.

Get new heads, at least for the snare top. Even if you're sample replacing, it might sound odd if you've got a very different sample to what you're hearing in the overheads. Plus what you'll be hearing in the overheads/room will be shit.

See my progress on drum mic'ing in this thread:
http://www.ultimatemetal.com/forum/...eventually-youll-get-some-killer-samples.html
will be updating that tomorrow after actually recording a band instead of just fucking around on the kit.



PS: if you are struggling with bleed.. I've heard a few things
-Move the hihats away (altho they're really far away as it is).
-I believe Bergstrand has put carpet and tshirts around the back of the snare drum mic.
-HIT THE FUCKING SNARE. Don't be a pussy (or don't let the drummer be a pussy. In this clip I turned the stick around to use the butt and then hit the snare pretty much as hard as I could, while keeping the rest of my dynamics fairly normal. And my hihats are like 3x closer to my snare than yours are.

 

[CatharsisStudios]

those clips sadly are dual mic'd. thats how much i fucking fail at life. so doesi t come to down to the room or my technicque, what does your room look like, maybe i should click the link haha, do you have aim or any of that bs?

 

[Morgan C]

My room is a garage. It sounds fucking awful.

My msn is underscore_ (at) hotmail.com

 

[KeithRT99]

I believe the tab on the top is so that you can take it off. It doesn't actually affect the sound any more than a piece of tape stuck straight on would.

that's part of it, but it makes a huge difference. If you think a little strip of tape just placed flat on the head works the same, then you're way wrong. By adding the flap on the tape, you're increasing the surface area of the snare. The flap diffuses energy and kills ring.

 

[CatharsisStudios]

fuck phsyics,

 

[madmuso]

I find that without some sort of overhead or distant mic the snare sound is incomplete.

cheers,

 

[Fox Mulder]

fuck phsyics,

There's no getting away from it

 

[paladin shredder]

if you are having trouble getting a good sound out of a dw snare, you've fucked up somewhere! new heads and a drum tuner are always a good place to start!

everyone loves steven slates samples around here and he has given some adisve on this:

he said he uses two mics for top snare (a dynamic mic and a small diaphragm condenser side by side) and a bottom mic. all of his samples were recorded to tape and with lots of analog eq and compression. fortunately for us there are plugins to help with processing.

i'm just now started like my recorded snare tracks. i'm also micing the bottom of the snare now, but room mics and overheads help the sound quite a bit as well. my processing chain goes tape emulation, gate/expander, eq, transient designer, and compression. analog modeling plugs are a must for eq and compression when it comes to drums imo. hope this helps!

 

[Joematthews]

With any luck I'll be sampling a snare today, so Ill mic it up and take some pictures and provide clips, if thats any help to anyone?

Joe

 

[madmuso]

Catharsis,

last week i was pissfarting around with a snare and was finding I had the same problem, I was using 57 on top and bottom but it just wasnt doing it for me, once I added the at4050 on top (not too far, just far enough to let the sound develop before it hits the mic) it made a difference. Although in the end I didnt get a snare sound i was happy with it still showed me something about snares and mics.

Heres the snare with 57 on top and bottom (compressed with oxford):
http://www.mediafire.com/file/jnlyo5zjjjz/Rshot with oxford2 dyn Louder.wav


Heres the ame snare with 57 on top and bottom and with at4050 above (and the snare has been tuned differently):
http://www.mediafire.com/file/zuit2djmnex/tama2 el8 comp.wav

cheers,

 

[462studio]

Tape jesus fuck.

Buy new heads, and some moongels my friend.

 

[darthjujuu]

my vote says room isn't the problem. tune a little tighter and factor in overheads, especially if you have real nice SDC's, i tracked with some nice octavas right above the kit once and the snare sounded crispy as fack. only other mic was a 57 on top, no bottom. snappiest brightest snare sound i've ever gotten. i can post the track if anyone cares. granted the kid has an acrylic pork pie as well.

 

[madmuso]

my vote says room isn't the problem. tune a little tighter and factor in overheads, especially if you have real nice SDC's, i tracked with some nice octavas right above the kit once and the snare sounded crispy as fack. only other mic was a 57 on top, no bottom. snappiest brightest snare sound i've ever gotten. i can post the track if anyone cares. granted the kid has an acrylic pork pie as well.

+1 for the octavas.

 

[GarethSE]

i swear even the AD raw sounds are muffled as fuck
i am always eq-ing in so much high end on my snares anyway, so dont worry about it
snares take high shelf boosts like toast takes peanut butter
deliciously, motherfucker

the ring is horrible as shit though
tune your fucking drum dude
if i was to try mixing a track with that snare sound without replacing, i would be gating it so hard there would be nothing left of it.

 

[HandsOfDespair]

i swear even the AD raw sounds are muffled as fuck
i am always eq-ing in so much high end on my snares anyway, so dont worry about it
snares take high shelf boosts like toast takes peanut butter
deliciously, motherfucker

yeah but by boosting the snare with a hi-shelf wouldn't you boost the hh and ohs bleed too?

 

[462studio]

yeah but by boosting the snare with a hi-shelf wouldn't you boost the hh and ohs bleed too?

Typically yes you would, but I like some high end on my snares too. So I either replace the snare 100% with samples of the actual snare drum I'm recording (I take about 30 velocities worth usually), so I don't bring up any HH or other bleeding with it.

The other option is to duplicate the snare track, insert Drumagog on the duplicate at 100% and insert a sample that fits, and boost the high end on that instead.

 

[Morgan C]

Update on my thread here.

I found today, that even though the actual snare sounded pretty ugh, and the snare top mic sounded AWFUL, with the room/OH sound turned up fairly loud I actually really like the result. Probly wouldn't work for metal but for rock I think it nails the Paramore-ish sound.

Raw snare (sounds shitty like the OP's ;p):
http://files.getdropbox.com/u/324723/Drums, Snare, Rec (330).mp3

Rough mix:
http://files.getdropbox.com/u/324723/PaleBlueEyes 1.mp3

 

[beechstudio]

I read in an article Mix back in the 90's where guys would take a piece of plywood or plexiglass just under the snare when they tracked in a carpeted room. Forgot what engineer this tip came from. Another alternative is to reamp the snare as Michael Wagener sometimes does to get more snap out of the bottom snare.

http://www.michaelwagener.com/wspixhtm/snare reamp.html