Some Radio Rock (Headcrusher's band) - SD2.0, Impulses, Panic Room Master!

[Mikaël-ange]

I dig overall production work on this, great job

 

[Ermz]

Not a single person complained about the drums being fake or the guitars being DIs. In fact I doubt anyone ever thought about these possibilities. Therefore I'd say "Mission accomplished".

Amazing isn't it? This is what people have been accustomed to hearing as normal. I wonder whether it has good or bad implications for the music industry. I mean, how much cheaper would it be for you to continue doing your drums as straight MIDI files rather than booking out a huge studio and recording them? So much less effort, and for the same impressions from people.

Just seems weird to me y'know. I can't tell whether it's a good or bad thing. I suppose not so good for drummers, hahah.

And thanks Plec. You did an ace job as always. I think the original master (the one not done by you) tried to change the mix way too much and as a result it sounded hollow and boomy. Not to mention the compression/limiting tearing the overheads. Upon reviewing this one a few times I think it may still be a tiny bit hot for me, but I'm good with it. I know I've probably given you the impression that I prefer for mixes to be quite up there, but to me there is definitely a 'sweet spot' where each project kinda sings its best. It always seems to be a trade-off of how much the transients are in your face or getting in the way of the music. I try to build the mixes in a way that once you've limited, clipped or whatever it to bring the snare back down into the song, it has hit the desired volume level. It's not always a perfect approach of course, but I think we manage to pretty much hit the ballpark most times!

Ultimately as you say, listeners still associate largeness with volume, and perhaps the excitement created by subtle distortions. This is popular music, and ultimately something I had hoped to 'break' Good Will Out into their industry, so it helps them to conform to these trends before they go off and do things their own way. Whilst the guys into production here may take issue with some clipping here and there, I'm willing to bet the industry guys and fans will largely be loving it. That's just the sacrifice we make at times.

Also thanks everyone for your kind words, and of course the critiques. I'm sure the band are as thankful as I am.

 

[Nebulous]

Listened to this one in the background and didn't hear any clipping.

That's what the majority of any fan base will agree with.

 

[Mago]

i think i stumbled across this song earlier...maybe when you posted the mnoir mix...
still think that the mix is great, but that im not that much a fan of austrian-radio-rock, just because a lot of bands are doing that here...its the only chance to get on the radio though.
if i hear your mix on the radio i'll tell you though ; )

its funny that those guys are from styria, some great metal bands are from there haha

 

[Charles J]

Lighten up, dudes! Getting a master to 'industry' levels whilst making it sounder fatter and larger WITHOUT AUDIBLE PUMPING is quite a feat in itself, especially w/radio rock oriented music that generally has a lot more information wayyy down in the low-end.

The slighhhht, audible clipping doesn't bother me a bit. It's about the OVERALL picture here, not a few slight imperfections (if you want to call them that, more like by-products of the territory) that no one will ever notice besides fellow geeks (me included!).

I think it's rocking. I love the drum sounds and Plec's master made the guitars sound AMAZING. I thought I was hearing some sort of Mesa variant before you posted that it was the Bugera.

Plec's master definitely beats out the first one the band had done by a long shot, for me at least.

Is Plec mastering via stems or are you just rolling w/stereo bounces? I have a feeling it's stems (based on how cohesive the low-end becomes on the masters) but I could be wrong!

Damn, I wish bands had more of a budget to allow me to talk them into getting my mixes mastered by Plec, that'd be a dream for me! I worship Plec and have ever since the first Miseration record came out... =D

 

[ATLA]

on my headphones the guitars sounded really soft, but then again its because im so used to hearing ultragain edgy guitar tones on here. however on my speakers the guitars sit very well with everything!

 

[Ermz]

Hey CJ,

This mix was actually sent as a simple stereo bounce. But usually I like to send Plec the bass guitar separately just in case I got the low-end relationship between kick/bass/guitars wrong. Being in a small room, no matter how treated, still presents some challenges down there, and I like to be positive.

Plec's master is actually a LOT closer to the final mix than the original one was, and I think this speaks to the credit of not over-doing it in mastering. Just raise the volume, round off the rough edges, and don't try to turn it into something it isn't, unless it needs it. We definitely have a great working relationship and I'm always confident when I send files to him. When it's getting mastered by others it's a bit like sending it out into the blue and flipping a coin.

 

[lolzgreg]

Plec, as I said, the master sounds excellent. I also see where you're coming from on that regard of pleasing the masses when it comes to the final master's sound level.

Great work altogether, guys.

 

[HeadCrusher]

still think that the mix is great, but that im not that much a fan of austrian-radio-rock, just because a lot of bands are doing that here...its the only chance to get on the radio though.

Interesting, which bands are you talking about in particular? I don't hear that kind of music that often - at least not from native artists...

if i hear your mix on the radio i'll tell you though ; )

Well for now you'd have to come down south to hear it on the radio but who knows, maybe in a few weeks/months...

its funny that those guys are from styria, some great metal bands are from there haha

Which ones do you like the most?

 

[Plec]

Lighten up, dudes! Getting a master to 'industry' levels whilst making it sounder fatter and larger WITHOUT AUDIBLE PUMPING is quite a feat in itself, especially w/radio rock oriented music that generally has a lot more information wayyy down in the low-end.

The slighhhht, audible clipping doesn't bother me a bit. It's about the OVERALL picture here, not a few slight imperfections (if you want to call them that, more like by-products of the territory) that no one will ever notice besides fellow geeks (me included!).

I think it's rocking. I love the drum sounds and Plec's master made the guitars sound AMAZING. I thought I was hearing some sort of Mesa variant before you posted that it was the Bugera.

Plec's master definitely beats out the first one the band had done by a long shot, for me at least.

Is Plec mastering via stems or are you just rolling w/stereo bounces? I have a feeling it's stems (based on how cohesive the low-end becomes on the masters) but I could be wrong!

Damn, I wish bands had more of a budget to allow me to talk them into getting my mixes mastered by Plec, that'd be a dream for me! I worship Plec and have ever since the first Miseration record came out... =D

Thx for the kind words.

Like Ermz said, he usually sends me STEMS on projects in case low-end needs to be tweaked a bit more in detail. I think it's funny though that you mention the low-end in that way. I don't really think about it much since I just do what I do 'til I think it sounds good, but quite a few clients have commented that the main reason for them coming to me with their projects is because I make the low-end sound better then they thought possible.

 

[Ermz]

To anyone that's curious, here is how the mix sounded as it was being mixed: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/285689/ermz-headcrusher-demo-10.mp3

That's essentially just prior to mastering with me mixing into my usual clipper/limiter. Use that to feed your a/b/c comparisons if you'd like and you can hear the nuances between all versions.

 

[El_Gato]

K, so I guess I'll chime in as well.

Here's the "original" Master by John @ panicStudios if you'd like to check it out: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/2075327/GoodWillOut/Paranoid-Download/GoodWillOut-Paranoid.mp3

Curious to see which version you guys like best.
Personally the clipping in Plec's version bugs me as well.

First, apologies for the "4 fuckin chords" thing , I 'll explain a little: I just hate em if are used alone like in the intro. Too obvious. I think the song and band is great BTW. Keep it up!

2nd, I like this version better but the other one is great too.

 

[jval]

The kick sounds weird to me but the mix is pretty good. The heavy parts sound more "pro" than the verses but that could just be the vocalist being kinda weak and the crashes sounding fake... overall nice work

 

[Metaltastic]

Love the guitar tone and massive fullness of the low-end dude, but ye gods that singer is awful, I'm sorry, just a really unpleasant voice IMO (obviously nothing you could do about that, though perhaps some more aggressive tuning would have helped)

 

[Soundlurker]

^haha she's not that bad but I remember when I gave it a shot at mixing I edited her vocals so that she says jealousy and not jealouZy...it was really bugging me.

As for the masters, I'll have to say I Plec's master does sound better...it sounds right whereas the other one makes the vocals sound somehow fake and scooped. I like the smoothness of the first master, though.

 

[Mago]

Interesting, which bands are you talking about in particular? I don't hear that kind of music that often - at least not from native artists...

I'm talking about the "Die neuen Österreicher" stuff.
kört für mich alles zum selben schaß...aber anders kommts nicht auf Ö3.

Well for now you'd have to come down south to hear it on the radio but who knows, maybe in a few weeks/months...

Yeah? on which one? maybe i'll try when im in styria in april/may
oder bei der durchfahrt zum metalcamp

Which ones do you like the most?

Wofpack Unleashed i guess.
we also played with some great bands from styria at some gigs.
but what else could you expect from a "steira bua" ; )

 

[HeadCrusher]

Well, imo the singer is actually quite good (plus she is only 17) but I admit that these particular takes are awful.

Achso, naja, mit den neuen Österreichern würd ich Good Will Out jetzt aber nicht vergleichen... Für Ö3 braucht man übrigens einen Major-Vertrieb, soweit ich das bisher mitbekommen hab - "neuer Österreicher" zu sein ist glaub ich weniger eine Voraussetzung.
Wenn du herunten bist hör Soundportal. Vielleicht läufts bis dorthin auch schon auf der Antenne.
Die Wolfpack Unleashed kannte ich zwar, wusste aber ehrlich gesagt nicht, dass die aus der Steiermark sind. Naja, man lernt nie aus!

 

[Mago]

Well, imo the singer is actually quite good (plus she is only 17) but I admit that these particular takes are awful.

Achso, naja, mit den neuen Österreichern würd ich Good Will Out jetzt aber nicht vergleichen... Für Ö3 braucht man übrigens einen Major-Vertrieb, soweit ich das bisher mitbekommen hab - "neuer Österreicher" zu sein ist glaub ich weniger eine Voraussetzung.
Wenn du herunten bist hör Soundportal. Vielleicht läufts bis dorthin auch schon auf der Antenne.
Die Wolfpack Unleashed kannte ich zwar, wusste aber ehrlich gesagt nicht, dass die aus der Steiermark sind. Naja, man lernt nie aus!

I think its noticable that she CAN acutally sing, but i dont understand why she forces her voice in that strange way during the verses. the chorus sounds good though. but again, i just think its too much "0815", nen? ; )

stimmt hast recht...für die neuen Österreicher isses sicher zu rockig und zu wenig poppig. vl hab ich mich bei der aussage auch einfach zu sehr von meinen bandcontest erfahrungen beeiflussen lassen..da hört ma die richtung relativ oft...
ich find gar nicht dass die schlecht sind oder so, das was sie machen machens eh gut, aber mir isses einfach zu poppig. hab sogar Paramore versucht weil mir ein lied gfalln hat, aber zu mehr hats nie greicht.
ich hab keine ahnung was man braucht um auf Ö3 zu kommen, mich intressierts ehrlich gsagt auch gar nicht^^ war die neue Österreicher aktion net eh von Ö3 aus?
"Soundportal" is gechecked. werds versuchen.

WU sind aus Leoben so weit ich weis. der sänger sagt mir nicht 100%ig zu, aber die gitarren sind einfach zu geil
kennst "The Crimson"? die sind auch leiwand, glaub eh auch aus graz.

 

[HeadCrusher]

Jap, The Crimson kenn ich natürlich. Du die Perishing Mankind? Sollte dir eigentlich auch gefallen, wenn dir WU zusagen.

 

[Mago]

PM kenn ich auch, mir war grad nur nicht so bewusst dass die auch bei euch daheim sind...
sind nicht schlecht, kann mich aber nicht wirklich für sie begeistern muss ich zugeben...wobei ich sie einmal am Metalcamp kurz gehört hab von der weiten (14h^^), klang nicht schlecht.