Thought on PoS Scarsick

[General Zod]

USA does not have the monopoly on western culture.

I wasn't trying to suggest we do. What I was trying to say, is often when people refer to the west, they're making reference to the U.S. or are referring to the U.S. first and foremost. Which isn't to say this is always the case.

Zod

 

[ProgMetalFan]

unmitigated disaster (and am a POS fan, though I'll admit to holding off on ordering Scarsick because of the widespread negative reviews)

"Unmitigated disaster" is also a good term for "Scarsick"... I can't believe they could produce an album worse than "Be"... the lyrics, though terrible, is the least of this album's problems.

 

[Jurakan]

...Witholding opinion until actually hearing Scarsick...

Don't want to just comment on the politcs, but on the context of the politcs in the album.

 

[Urban breed]

After all, there's a Starbucks on every corner, even in Sweden! =)

Ummm... ? There's gotta be quite a few corners missing in Sweden since I last had a look then...
...oh, so that's what cutting corners means...!

And as far as the debate goes, you could put out an album with lyrics all about how absolutely awful Sweden is and it wouldn't upset me one bit.
You're quite entitled to your opinion. Be it right or wrong ... doesn't matter at all.
Then again, this is coming from someone that doesn't mind people badmouthing a band I'm in.
Guess I've a completely different mindset... I wonder, am I alone..?
Possibly. Does it matter? Not really.

 

[Kenneth R.]

It makes you a wiser person.

 

[mandrake6]

What I don't quite understand is all of the blatant hostility towards Gildenlow and this album. I've listened to the whole thing many times over, and as far as I am concerned, it is a great album! Sure, in some people's opinions, including my own, it is not OHBtCL, and in other's opinions it is not Remedy Lane. But then again, would you really buy it, or even listen to it for that matter, if it was?? I know that when I got hooked on PoS, it was because there is no other band on the face of this Earth that even comes close to sounding like PoS. ORIGINALITY!!! That is what music is all about. I understand the term "influenced." But so many bands today, and I am especially talking about metal bands, are seemingly, and very blatantly copying their so-called "influences." I think it is a breath of fresh air when a band like PoS comes around and releases a new and even more complex sound with every album. So very many of you have ripped apart BE since it was released. Why? Does nobody but me see the beauty in it? Sure it's eclectic? And it's weird sounding? But you aren't supposed to take it for the next PoS masterpiece. Take it as Daniel Gildenlow's masterpiece. In 1979, another musician released his masterpiece--Roger Waters created Pink Floyd's "The Wall." Why is that album not widely discredited, much the same way that BE has been, not only on this forum but by so many so-called PoS fans everywhere?

And, really, all of this started because someone stated the song "America" was actually un-American, or anti-American for that matter. SO WHAT!!! That is what is beautiful about this country, and the entire FREE world for that matter. We can say whatever we want. Nobody says anything when an American band rips on this country. I firmly believe that Daniel is making rational judgements about the entire Western world, but I think that he is stating very surreal truths about the land that so many of us were born in and have grown up in. Well, I guess for some, the old saying is actually true...the truth does actually hurt!

Scarsick is for me the best album I have heard in a long time. I only hope that someday Daniel and company will get to come to the states and perform these songs live.
Big Jay

 

[General Zod]

We can say whatever we want. Nobody says anything when an American band rips on this country.

Exactly. It's similar to the dynamics in the relationship between brothers. Growing up, you and your brothers fight like cats and dogs. And it's perfectly acceptable for you to wail on each other. However, if someone else lays a hand on your brother... it's on.

I firmly believe that Daniel is making rational judgements about the entire Western world, but I think that he is stating very surreal truths about the land that so many of us were born in and have grown up in.

Perhaps. However, I think there are a few elements at play here, that explain why people are annoyed. First, why not turn that insightful, surreal eye towards Sweden and wax poetic about its problems. Second, Daniel has already talked about how he'll never perform in America again. I think that probably gave a lot of people the idea that he has issues with the U.S. Lastly, to the best of my knowledge, he's never lived here. Therefore, his views on this country are based on what he sees on T.V. and in the movies. Not exactly the foundation for a well conceived opinion.

Zod

 

[Kenneth R.]

I wouldn't say those are the only forms of information available these days. There are books, the internet, word of mouth, and so on. It is highly possible that he is more aware of the inner workings of this country than he's being given credit for in this thread.

How much do you all know about Sweden? Maybe some not so much, but others can probably confidently say they know a fair amount about what it's like, even having never lived there.

 

[BlindPanzer]

I think the lyrics are better than what they seem to at first. They follow suit in that they are more direct, so you won't get much subtlety from the wordplay but it still tackles the same issues as the previous albums. Disco queen for example can be taken to be either someone haveing agressive sex or playing a record and that might seem a bit unoriginal, immature, and/or forced. Taken in context with the album, hoewever, the song is an integral piece of the puzzle about use and abuse of people and of the self.

I also think that DG didn't name it TPE2 for exactly the same reasons already shown in the thread. He wants to avoid having those comments that only look at the album in light of TPE1. Obviously that seems impossible given the fact that since it is a continuation of the first album, but at least try to see the merits and faults in and by themselves within the album, not just because it doesn't live up to TPE1. Pretty much either like or hate Scarsick because it's Scarsick, not because its TPE2.

Also once you get your copy you'll see it says "The Perfect Element II: HE" which means that we'll probably be getting TPE2:She in the near future. A year if you follow the lyrics in enter rain...

 

[AngraRULES]

How much do you all know about Sweden?

Probably not much, given one of the biggest problems in *most* Americans is the inability to care or be aware of what goes on outside the USA... Sad, but true.

 

[General Zod]

I wouldn't say those are the only forms of information available these days. There are books, the internet, word of mouth, and so on.

In the end, it all comes down to second hand experiences.

How much do you all know about Sweden?

Little. But then again, I don't write songs that call Sweden into a negative light.

Zod

 

[The Invisible Guest]

Probably not much, given one of the biggest problems in *most* Americans is the inability to care or be aware of what goes on outside the USA... Sad, but true.

I don't know of any Swedish programming that can be found on US tv's or radio's. If you read the papers you might catch a blurb here or there about Sweden, but in general they are a non entity here when it comes to news coverage.

That doesn't mean that American's wouldn't care about problems that might be going on in their country, or abroad. American's have shown they care about Tsunami victims, holocaust victims around the planet, and famines taking place in Africa. I'm sure America could give more, but so could everyone else.

Britt

 

[Greykiller]

Exactly. It's similar to the dynamics in the relationship between brothers. Growing up, you and your brothers fight like cats and dogs. And it's perfectly acceptable for you to wail on each other. However, if someone else lays a hand on your brother... it's on.

Perhaps. However, I think there are a few elements at play here, that explain why people are annoyed. First, why not turn that insightful, surreal eye towards Sweden and wax poetic about its problems. Second, Daniel has already talked about how he'll never perform in America again. I think that probably gave a lot of people the idea that he has issues with the U.S. Lastly, to the best of my knowledge, he's never lived here. Therefore, his views on this country are based on what he sees on T.V. and in the movies. Not exactly the foundation for a well conceived opinion.

Zod

First, if you are a popular music group, and speak out against Bush, you do so at your peril for airplay (google the Dixie Chicks and Clearchannel if you do not believe me).

Second, I reiterate my point about sources of information. If, for example, you want to read about what is really going on in Iraq (or, more importantly, in our own national elections!!!), read some of the UK papers in general and The Gaurdian in particular: http://www.guardian.co.uk/guardian/.

When people realize that 95% of American Media (newspapers, television, magazines and radio) is owned by 6 multinational corporations, it is easy to see why they are more likely to toe the Bush propoganda line--because they want even more deregulation than they already have. Running news stories that cost business is not the way for American Media anymore--foreign papers do not have that restriction, and are far more likely to tell the whole truth about what goes on over here.

 

[General Zod]

First, if you are a popular music group...

I'm not clear why you chose to quote my post to make your points. Your post doesn't seem to address anything I said. Did you quote me by mistake?

Zod

 

[SharkBlack]

When people realize that 95% of American Media (newspapers, television, magazines and radio) is owned by 6 multinational corporations, it is easy to see why they are more likely to toe the Bush propoganda line--because they want even more deregulation than they already have. Running news stories that cost business is not the way for American Media anymore--foreign papers do not have that restriction, and are far more likely to tell the whole truth about what goes on over here.

The media toe the Bush propaganda line? You've got to be kidding...
They and most media here and abroad feed into the anti-Bush Anti-American hysteria.... It's the new popular culture....

 

[Kenneth R.]

and who feeds them the latest craze hmmm?

the biggest secret and biggest joke of all western culture is that the "counter" culture IS an appendage of the culture it opposes. they're all incestuous buddies owned by the same companies and governments.

case in point- Hot Topic. anticulture. owned by the same people who own the stores that Hot Topic shoppers detest. MTV. The counter culture. or is it? Antibush campaigns. It doesn't take a poly-sci student to immediately notice that democrats would hate the guy. It doesn't take a poly-sci student to see why republicans would seek to distance themselves from the guy in light of upcoming elections. the public has pinned Bush as the major cause of all the idiocy that those two parties have summarily caused, and so like good little cockroaches, they're all backing anyone who throws mud at him because they know the public approves.

it is important to note as well, that although i do agree that international (ie, european) news services are less slanted, i will underscore that they are not without bias either. no one is, and for that matter - one must observe the situation from as many angles as possible in order to best ascertain the elusive Truth. this is a fundamental reason behind my argument that PoS should not be taking flak on account of them not being American and bashing obvious flaws in western culture, a culture that geographically speaking, includes Sweden in the "west".

 

[lady_space]

I agree that America alone doesn't define "western culture". However, when people speak of the west or western culture, much of their sentiment, good or bad, seems to be directed at America.

While an opinion eloquently stated is preferable to the rantings of a moron, I still take umbrage at the anti-American sentiments of those who have never spent any real time here.

Based on his lyrics, I would assume Daniel is a fairly bright guy. However, has he ever lived here? Or is his understanding of America, Americans and American culture based on what he's seen on T.V. and in the movies?

I have no idea what he's basing it on, but since it seems pretty on-target to me, it's sort of a moot point in my eyes. I know I certainly have opinions on other countries that I've never stepped foot in. Don't you? When it comes down to it, we all get our information from somewhere, and it depends on your POV how reliable those sources are, even if they're our own senses.

The issue I have, isn't with someone like Urban. He's spent a good deal of time here, met a lot of people, and has a fair understanding of what the U.S. is like. Plus, based on his taste in woman, he's clearly a very bright guy.

lol, I knew I loved you for a reason. Seriously, though, Urban was here a total of 3 times before we hooked up, so I don't know that he's got any more than Gildenlöw does to base his opinion on.

I know I threw it on her iPod a ways back. I'm not sure if she ever really listened to it. I'll ask her.

Cool.

I guess the long and short of it is that I don't see any difference between someone who has lived here criticizing "here" and someone who hasn't. Obviously, a lot of people here don't feel that way.

You know what, fuck the States... I'm going to Europe. Right now.

Shaye

 

[Kenneth R.]

i decided that a long time ago

i wonder if i can get swedish citizenship

 

[Ascension]

You know what, fuck the States... I'm going to Europe. Right now.

Shaye

i decided that a long time ago

i wonder if i can get swedish citizenship

There are flights leaving for Europe virtually minutes apart...and there are no waiting lines.

 

[3DimensionalAperture]

I think it's really sad how much knee-jerk ignorance there is going on here.

Yeah, you *obviously* need to go to America in order to understand the country...


Nice logic fellas. Using it on you guys- you have no right to speak negatively about Daniel and his lyrics, since you're not lyricists/songwriters. Nothing makes less sense than the "You need to be a painter to be able to critique art" verbatim. People who use it are clearly fishing for reasons to explain their oversensitivity issues.

This country is in a rut no matter how many ways you slice it. It's not that hard to read up on what's going on here on the net or in a book or even on the news. If you get offended that Daniel feels negatively (keep in mind that I said negatively. You guys are making it seem like he sits around burning flags and signing up for the Taliban or something..) but isn't an American then I'm sorry for you. Excuse *him* for having an opinion- and a correct opinion at that since Sweden is a far superior country to America.

That said, the new POS is horrible because the music is awful, and Daniel can't rap for the life of him.