Thoughts about the music business
- Thread starter tuonelan
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Eurynome
Kukkahattutäti
^^^^^^^^^^ now THAT one I might actually wanna watch. Haven't even heard of it, but I loved Harvey K in "Smoke". :Smokedev: 
papajohnny
Member
Karhu
Senior Bear
Metallica without Cliff Burton isn't Metallica. It has become some other entity that stole a dead guys songs and they try to improve on it, failing. But they have $$$ so crap it is. Lars is such a whiner I don't care anymore what poop they put out.
koivusaari
Member
Eurynome
Kukkahattutäti
The piano dude is cool, though.
BTW congrats to Turisas-Olli's dad for bringing another Grammy to Finland.
Speaking of which, I am incredibly annoyed that QOTSA didn't get a Grammy. 
...Like Clockwork is easily the best rock album of the petiletka (five-year period).
But, then again, what do you expect of an industry that cuts short the performance of three of the greatest living American rock musicians to show ads of Hilton and Delta Airlines and the end credits???
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9dZOyIJOyI
EDIT: My thoughts exactly "NIN Frontman Trent Reznor to Grammys: ‘F*CK YOU’"
...Like Clockwork is easily the best rock album of the petiletka (five-year period).But, then again, what do you expect of an industry that cuts short the performance of three of the greatest living American rock musicians to show ads of Hilton and Delta Airlines and the end credits???
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y9dZOyIJOyI
EDIT: My thoughts exactly "NIN Frontman Trent Reznor to Grammys: ‘F*CK YOU’"
Eurynome
Kukkahattutäti
...AND keeps undermining one of the few remaining global promotional tools that actually work.
Ah, but that was to be expected. I'm amazed it took them so long to take the videos down. - The guy who uploaded the one I saw in the morning had written it probably will not gonna last more than 10 minutes.
It seems that they managed to pull off another all-time low by omitting Jeff Hanneman in their RIP segment. And Hanneman had two Grammys with Slayer...
It seems that they managed to pull off another all-time low by omitting Jeff Hanneman in their RIP segment. And Hanneman had two Grammys with Slayer...
Lang Lang was cool and the staging of the performance was interesting. Not as epic as this, though:
And how much do I love Reznor for his comments.
And how much do I love Reznor for his comments.
Last edited by a moderator:
Eurynome
Kukkahattutäti
Another self-styled genius who hasn't had a hit in 25 years is trying to sue his remaining fans for cheating him out of his due millions...
He's a bigger asshat than just that. He hired a friend of mine's brother just to surf YouTube all day and send takedown notices to anyone who did a video that featured his music in any way. Use a song of his in a dance contest and put up video of your routine? Have a video of your infant doing something adorable while there's a Prince song playing on the radio in the background? Suckit, beyotchez! That shit is coming down unless you pay the Prince his royalties.
papajohnny
Member
Even if all that said in that article is true, I couldn't give two shits.
Rock, along with metal and whatnot, has been dead in my eyes for many, many years. I grew in an environment where rock was dead (and still is), and when I finally got "integrated" into the "global rock scene" or movement, or whatever it is called, I saw it's just as rotten, only from the inside.
Like I've said before, I don't give a certain mass of feces for rock 'n' roll as a trend. There are good bands, good albums still being made, and I'll take a listen at those, go to a show if I have a chance.
The fact that some random washed-up oldies are disappearing from the scene should be concerning? What the fuck?
I mean, I like Motörhead and Lemmy, but it's realistic to expect him from stop playing. It's realistic to expect 'head to fall apart, or stop touring, it's realistic to expect them to die, after that long life of drinking whiskey, eating drugs and humping girls. That goes for any other rock band which has been on the scene for a long time. It's not sad in any way. Nor should it be worrisome. As much as I love (some of) those bands, I actually can't wait for the day when they will all fall apart.
It will create a vacuum that will have to be filled in some way. If other good original bands emerge and take the spot, good for them. If not, whatever. Then it just speaks volumes what a rotten cadaver rock scene is and has been, how many mindless, recycling cover-but-not-really-cover bands it has, and how many idiotic fans are out there, fans that worship them. What's the point?
Same thing can be said about the metal scene ( I consider metal music to be part of the rock music, same goes for "scenes", but let's separate them for the sake of the argument). You've got a shitload of "old" bands which have been on the scene for a very long time, you have many reunions of even older bands which suck in general now and will never be on the level on which they stood 15+ years ago. And the worst of all, you've got millions of uninnovative cover-but-not-cover bands of Iron Maiden/Metallica/Slayer/Kreator/Venom/Bathory/Death/Cannibal Corpse/Mayhem/Darkthrone (insert any other influential band in here) which just plainly suck. In best case they're a solid clone band, but why the fuck should we be listening to clone bands?
Rock fans, metal fans, whoever, majority of them are no smarter than a regular One Direction gig attendee (like the writer of the article, I have no idea how does that band sound, but I can imagine). They just dress differently, and listen to some more "refined" music, but they're no better.
The scene in general is a fucking hole, a lavatory which hasn't been cleaned since ever.
I don't see a single reason why should I, a music listener (by that I consider a person who likes music, buys music, and actually listens to albums and doesn't do that just for show) care about this great mindless concept of interconnected douchebags centered around an old, rotten and raped music style which has, in good portion, lost any of its value.
I care about artists which still put out good albums, artists which care about music and artists who do not overly concern themselves with the aforementioned collective, but rather fit a "niche of quality".
As long as there are people like that, and people who support them, rock n' roll, real rock n' roll will never die.
This refurbished corpse with a ton of make-up is about to die?
Okay, so long.
I apologize for this venomous rant, but the article was good (I'm not sarcastic), so it dragged these thoughts out of me (and admittedly, they've been there for a long time). If anyone is offended by this, well, please respond. If not, whatever.
Everything I've said may sound arrogant, but I really don't care. I don't consider myself to be better than a regular "rocker" out there, but I know I'm not worse.
Enjoy your music, beautiful people.
Rock, along with metal and whatnot, has been dead in my eyes for many, many years. I grew in an environment where rock was dead (and still is), and when I finally got "integrated" into the "global rock scene" or movement, or whatever it is called, I saw it's just as rotten, only from the inside.
Like I've said before, I don't give a certain mass of feces for rock 'n' roll as a trend. There are good bands, good albums still being made, and I'll take a listen at those, go to a show if I have a chance.
The fact that some random washed-up oldies are disappearing from the scene should be concerning? What the fuck?
I mean, I like Motörhead and Lemmy, but it's realistic to expect him from stop playing. It's realistic to expect 'head to fall apart, or stop touring, it's realistic to expect them to die, after that long life of drinking whiskey, eating drugs and humping girls. That goes for any other rock band which has been on the scene for a long time. It's not sad in any way. Nor should it be worrisome. As much as I love (some of) those bands, I actually can't wait for the day when they will all fall apart.
It will create a vacuum that will have to be filled in some way. If other good original bands emerge and take the spot, good for them. If not, whatever. Then it just speaks volumes what a rotten cadaver rock scene is and has been, how many mindless, recycling cover-but-not-really-cover bands it has, and how many idiotic fans are out there, fans that worship them. What's the point?
Same thing can be said about the metal scene ( I consider metal music to be part of the rock music, same goes for "scenes", but let's separate them for the sake of the argument). You've got a shitload of "old" bands which have been on the scene for a very long time, you have many reunions of even older bands which suck in general now and will never be on the level on which they stood 15+ years ago. And the worst of all, you've got millions of uninnovative cover-but-not-cover bands of Iron Maiden/Metallica/Slayer/Kreator/Venom/Bathory/Death/Cannibal Corpse/Mayhem/Darkthrone (insert any other influential band in here) which just plainly suck. In best case they're a solid clone band, but why the fuck should we be listening to clone bands?
Rock fans, metal fans, whoever, majority of them are no smarter than a regular One Direction gig attendee (like the writer of the article, I have no idea how does that band sound, but I can imagine). They just dress differently, and listen to some more "refined" music, but they're no better.
The scene in general is a fucking hole, a lavatory which hasn't been cleaned since ever.
I don't see a single reason why should I, a music listener (by that I consider a person who likes music, buys music, and actually listens to albums and doesn't do that just for show) care about this great mindless concept of interconnected douchebags centered around an old, rotten and raped music style which has, in good portion, lost any of its value.
I care about artists which still put out good albums, artists which care about music and artists who do not overly concern themselves with the aforementioned collective, but rather fit a "niche of quality".
As long as there are people like that, and people who support them, rock n' roll, real rock n' roll will never die.
This refurbished corpse with a ton of make-up is about to die?
Okay, so long.
I apologize for this venomous rant, but the article was good (I'm not sarcastic), so it dragged these thoughts out of me (and admittedly, they've been there for a long time). If anyone is offended by this, well, please respond. If not, whatever.
Everything I've said may sound arrogant, but I really don't care. I don't consider myself to be better than a regular "rocker" out there, but I know I'm not worse.
Enjoy your music, beautiful people.
^^Can't say that I disagree with much of that.
Big problems for the music industry and the people who live off of it on the marketing side -- what do you do to sell more recordings when a good chunk of what you sell has been around for 50 years and can be found used in a million places and formats? And why should I care to go see these artists when I've seen them before in their prime and they haven't been vital and relevant in over a decade? Elvis and John Lennon are still selling a shit ton of recordings and as long as they are a sure thing why should the recording industry give a shit about splashing money trying to turn a contemporary artist into Elvis? They already have him. Their biggest problem is that they have to keep reselling him in some new form and keep people buying the same old shit.
The big problem for working musicians is that they have to compete in a world that already has Elvis, try to get money out of a company that already has Elvis and doesn't need them until they can compete with Elvis in terms of sales.
Elvis was a hero to most but he never meant shit to me.
Plenty of rock on Bandcamp, but you have to go find it and sort through the weak stuff to find the good. Plenty of work for a musician, but s/he has to expect to compete with the plumber next door rather than with Elvis.
Big fucking headaches for festival promoters, but most of them are douchebags anyway, so who cares.
And fuck Classic Rock magazine. Let them pimp their funeral memorabilia somewhere else. That shit is Hit Parader for yuppies.
Big problems for the music industry and the people who live off of it on the marketing side -- what do you do to sell more recordings when a good chunk of what you sell has been around for 50 years and can be found used in a million places and formats? And why should I care to go see these artists when I've seen them before in their prime and they haven't been vital and relevant in over a decade? Elvis and John Lennon are still selling a shit ton of recordings and as long as they are a sure thing why should the recording industry give a shit about splashing money trying to turn a contemporary artist into Elvis? They already have him. Their biggest problem is that they have to keep reselling him in some new form and keep people buying the same old shit.
The big problem for working musicians is that they have to compete in a world that already has Elvis, try to get money out of a company that already has Elvis and doesn't need them until they can compete with Elvis in terms of sales.
Elvis was a hero to most but he never meant shit to me.
Plenty of rock on Bandcamp, but you have to go find it and sort through the weak stuff to find the good. Plenty of work for a musician, but s/he has to expect to compete with the plumber next door rather than with Elvis.
Big fucking headaches for festival promoters, but most of them are douchebags anyway, so who cares.
And fuck Classic Rock magazine. Let them pimp their funeral memorabilia somewhere else. That shit is Hit Parader for yuppies.
papajohnny
Member
Well said, really.
I'll admit that I've personally once bought an Elvis CD (I am aware that Elvis in this discussion represents much more than just himself, but, heh, coincidence... ). I knew that my money went 100% to a label, label about which I probably don't give a damn. However, the CD was nicely packaged, had all those hits I loved (I really liked Elvis as a kid, he was important in my childhood) and wasn't expensive at all.
I caught the bait.
Whilst I'm still happy, in a weird sort of way, that I bought that CD, it was the first and last time I've bought something that has been a rehash of a rehash of a refined vomit of a stylized crap that was once good music.
Since then, I've never bought a single CD or a vinyl of a dead or retired musician which has been presented as a re-release or whatever.
It's not the problem in the rerelase. It's a problem in milking a dead cow.
One thing is when you reissue an obscure album of a long lost artist, and it's completely different when you''re doing...this.
Same thing works with live performance.
If I understood the article well, the guy is saying that there are no bands to support big names. Well big wonder. Why the fuck don't you push those bands forward?
And hell yeah, there are plenty of good bands. Like tuonelan said, go through Bandcamp. Plenty of jewels there.
But alas, there is no safe money in having a relatively unknown band headlining. What am I going to do with no money going to my pocket?
Fuck music industry. Really, fuck 99% of labels. Most of them are chicken shit scared of promoting something new, and play on the safety card of pushing forward same old crap, and destroying the new generation of potentially fabulous artist.
Industry killed rock n' roll. Industry gives us a same old "Best of" album every second year. Industry gives us a millionth deluxe turbo mega sexy edition of a same old album which everyone knows by heart and everyone buys again. Industry pushes forward same old geezer headliners. Industry complains that there is no money.
One thing I love about internet is that it is now relatively easy to find solid artists and good labels. And there are such. In most cases they're indie or completely underground, but they're worth it.
And like I said, it's those people that keep the flame.
And now I'm going to take the most massive dump on everything I've said and make the most ironic/cliche move here:
I just couldn't resist it.
I'll admit that I've personally once bought an Elvis CD (I am aware that Elvis in this discussion represents much more than just himself, but, heh, coincidence... ). I knew that my money went 100% to a label, label about which I probably don't give a damn. However, the CD was nicely packaged, had all those hits I loved (I really liked Elvis as a kid, he was important in my childhood) and wasn't expensive at all.
I caught the bait.
Whilst I'm still happy, in a weird sort of way, that I bought that CD, it was the first and last time I've bought something that has been a rehash of a rehash of a refined vomit of a stylized crap that was once good music.
Since then, I've never bought a single CD or a vinyl of a dead or retired musician which has been presented as a re-release or whatever.
It's not the problem in the rerelase. It's a problem in milking a dead cow.
One thing is when you reissue an obscure album of a long lost artist, and it's completely different when you''re doing...this.
Same thing works with live performance.
If I understood the article well, the guy is saying that there are no bands to support big names. Well big wonder. Why the fuck don't you push those bands forward?
And hell yeah, there are plenty of good bands. Like tuonelan said, go through Bandcamp. Plenty of jewels there.
But alas, there is no safe money in having a relatively unknown band headlining. What am I going to do with no money going to my pocket?
Fuck music industry. Really, fuck 99% of labels. Most of them are chicken shit scared of promoting something new, and play on the safety card of pushing forward same old crap, and destroying the new generation of potentially fabulous artist.
Industry killed rock n' roll. Industry gives us a same old "Best of" album every second year. Industry gives us a millionth deluxe turbo mega sexy edition of a same old album which everyone knows by heart and everyone buys again. Industry pushes forward same old geezer headliners. Industry complains that there is no money.
One thing I love about internet is that it is now relatively easy to find solid artists and good labels. And there are such. In most cases they're indie or completely underground, but they're worth it.
And like I said, it's those people that keep the flame.
And now I'm going to take the most massive dump on everything I've said and make the most ironic/cliche move here:
I just couldn't resist it.
Last edited by a moderator:
Eurynome
Kukkahattutäti
When I was half my current age, I almost exclusively listened to music that was recorded before I was born or shortly after; in fact several of my then-favorite artists had risen to fame around the time my grandma started elementary school. Their careers were, in most cases, cut short or at least severely hampered by the Great Depression, which I daresay had more devastating effects on the entertainment industry than Napster, Piratebay and all their offspring combined. Yet music didn't die then any more than it did on February 3, 1959. It has survived deaths and bankrupts unnumbered and will gracefully outlast even One Direction and Justin Bieber (I, too, still haven't heard either of them). According to a popular cliché, the average middle-aged consumer tends to maintain that the music of his/her teenage days was the best of all times ever and throughout the universe, but in truth, by far most of what I listen to nowadays has been recorded in the 2000s, with an estimated 90% of the small remainder being from the 1990s but by artists that continue to be active and relevant. Admittedly, the vitality of the rock and metal scenes differs from one region to the next, but at least here in Northern Europe it has been at its most alive in recent years, with only a slight decline since the years of the biggest boom (ca. 2005-09).
As long as bands keep finding new ways of marketing their art, and ideally at their own terms, I don't shed a tear over the decline of the traditional music industry. The good news is that labels with a good concept and an open ear for both artists and buyers can still make money by selling real records. Hails and respect to Svart for proving this point most admirably.
As long as bands keep finding new ways of marketing their art, and ideally at their own terms, I don't shed a tear over the decline of the traditional music industry. The good news is that labels with a good concept and an open ear for both artists and buyers can still make money by selling real records. Hails and respect to Svart for proving this point most admirably.
papajohnny
Member
Svart is great. Single most awesome and practical site I've ever ordered from.
I can list several more like them, at least in terms of their rooster quality.
I can list several more like them, at least in terms of their rooster quality.
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